Yet another quarterbore project on the way

[taylorce1]

If you're still finding the top bolt release rifles they're NOS. Almost all current 110s use the bottom bolt release. There are a few exceptions with the scout and chassis models stil using the old release. I'm guessing the ACIS style mags shown are the reason.

[stagpanther]

If you're still finding the top bolt release rifles they're NOS. Almost all current 110s use the bottom bolt release. There are a few exceptions with the scout and chassis models stil using the old release. I'm guessing the ACIS style mags shown are the reason.

Are you saying that Savage is discontinuing top bolt releases on all 110's (and their numerical doppelgängers) and from now on they will all be bolt-release in front of the trigger guard--even for non-AICS detachable magazines? I was not aware of this. I detest those bottom releases and have been a staunch Savage loyalist for decades--but that may end if I'm forced to purchase only bottom release rifle actions. I know about the release conversions and have used chassis that can adapt to both--but they still suck IMO. Savage is going to lose other hard-cores like me over this I suspect.

[taylorce1]

Originally Posted by stagpanther

Are you saying that Savage is discontinuing top bolt releases on all 110's (and their numerical doppelgängers)

There are no longer any numerical differences, they're all just a model 110. Short action, long action, blued, stainless, or carbon fiber it is just a model 110. If you look at the current offerings for Savage, if it doesn't have an extended magazine it uses a BBR.

[stagpanther]

edit

[stagpanther]

Taylor--I have been unable to corroborate that BBR is effectively the production standard.

[taylorce1]

@stagpanther, this was hashed out when the BBR (bottom bolt release) came out on Savage Shooters. It was discussed how it was seen a cost saving measure by the moderators. All I know for sure is that TBR (top bolt release) rifles are getting harder to find, stripped actions with TBR are a premium. Also if you look at what Savage is offering only the rifles with an ACIS style mag are offering the TBR. If Savage uses a flush fit magazine they're all BBR rifles.

I doubt Savage will come out and say the BBR is the standard for the 110 action. You just have to look at the current offerings to know that the company is headed that way.

[Txhillbilly]

Savage has no "Standard". They seem to always change something with the 10 / 110 action every few years just to keep everyone in the aftermarket confused as to what parts will actually work with them.

That's one of the main reasons that I started using custom action's on my builds. Yes, they cost more, but just knowing that I have a multitude of choices when it comes to barrel's / stock's / trigger's, makes it well worth the extra expense.

I put a 25 CM together a couple years ago. Fun cartridge to shoot. Finding the best load for it hasn't been as easy as the 6.5 CM's or 22 CM's I've put together, but it is a very good shooter with the 135gr Berger bullet's.
I used an ARC Archimedes action with a 24" X-Caliber 1-7.5 twist barrel. A Trigger Tech special trigger, all in a Woox Exactus chassis, and topped off with an Athlon Cronus scope in a set of ARC M10 rings.

[stagpanther]

Txhillbilly--beauty build you've got there! I'm a huge fan of ARC scope mounts--never needed to lap them and they stay put. I've looked often at their actions--it seems to me they are retiring their other action for the Coupe de Gras--the only thing that that I hesitate about ordering one is that the anything with .473 bolt face on down requires the conical breech barrels.

[Txhillbilly]

Originally Posted by stagpanther

Txhillbilly--beauty build you've got there! I'm a huge fan of ARC scope mounts--never needed to lap them and they stay put. I've looked often at their actions--it seems to me they are retiring their other action for the Coupe de Gras--the only thing that that I hesitate about ordering one is that the anything with .473 bolt face on down requires the conical breech barrels.

I've got 3 ARC action's - Nucleus, Nucleus 2.0, and the Archimedes. Personally, I like the Nucleus 2.0 the best. I always wanted one of the Mausingfield action's, but just never saw enough difference / upgrade for the price.
Ted's scope rings are the best made, IMO. I have 6 pair of them!

[stagpanther]

Got a call this morning from a new LGS that my actions had arrived from Northland--so off I went. They must have immediately booked them in upon delivery and called me--I like that in an FFL--gave em a tip. In an odd twist of fate--I had an MDT chassis sitting around doing nothing for many years because I mistakenly ordered it sized for a model 10 action--which I've never had. So I decided to combine the 25 creedmoor project with a shiny new tungsten finish model 10 action. Also ordered Northland's own custom recoil lug and barrel nut.



After finishing assembly I discovered I had forgotten to test the accutrigger--unfortunately this action came with one that tested to a stiff 4.5 pounds and futzing with the return spring didn't gain me anything but maybe a reduction down to 4 lbs. Not good. Got on the phone and talked to James at Northland--turns out Savage actually uses several different springs depending on the action type (they love to keep things confusing) in the accutrigger. I didn't know that. So I ordered a couple of Rifle Basix SAV 1's. James is very good at processing and shipping an order very fast--but that still meant I couldn't get around to completing the build til next week. While browsing around looking for parts for something unrelated--up pops up a complete Rifle Basic SAV 2 trigger kit that I had completely forgotten about. Talk about luck. After install got it down around 10 ounce pull.



Besides the old chassis I also used an old ratty Luthar buttstock--I know lots of people like them--but I don't, especially. I simply didn't have anything else available at the moment.

[taylorce1]

I've been interested in trying a chassis build with either my Ruger American Predator or Savage 10 6mm Creedmoor. I just don't know what I want in a Chassis. I did get an email from Arken optics about Outlier and a 50% off sale. I've never heard of this company, but at $400 for a chassis.

I'm pretty tempted to try them. I configured it as light as I could and it came in just over 3 lbs with bag rider. I'm just hesitant as I've never heard of Outlier before this email.

[stagpanther]

I have most of my non-hunting guns in MDT or KRG chassis. There's something intrinsically appealing about MDT solid aluminum chassis--they are so simple to use--crank their tough action bolts up to high torque and forget about all the touchy-feely bedding stuff.

I ended up taking the Lothar buttstock off--I really can't stand those things--and stole a magpul CTR from one of my ARs along with a Vortex Crossfire. I whipped up some moderate 135 berger/H4350 loads just to do a function test and a bit of a break-in. After a few preliminary shots to find the range at 176 yds these are the very first two 5 shot groups down the Shilen tube, I believe they were just engaging the lands at 2.84" COL. Gonna put one of my top-tier scopes on for the next outing--looks promising. The build works perfectly and shoots great, nicely balanced. I did no prep of the brass--really big thumbs up for alpha munitions brass--hard to tell the brass had even been used after firing except for the primer with firing pin impact. I rarely take much notice about brass--but this stuff is serious high-quality from what I've seen so far.

[Txhillbilly]

Nice build, Stagpanther!
I've never had much luck with Alpha or Peterson brass. It's too thick and I always get high pressure before I get close to the velocities I get with Lapua, Starline, or even Hornady brass.

[stagpanther]

Nice build, Stagpanther!
I've never had much luck with Alpha or Peterson brass. It's too thick and I always get high pressure before I get close to the velocities I get with Lapua, Starline, or even Hornady brass.

Thanks--I'm curious--what kind of loads are you using and what velocities are you going for? I also built a 25 PRC and could easily get 3200 fps with bigger bullets but a 257 cartridge can easily become a barrel-burner when driven fast and can be murder on throats I've found. That's a big reason why I decided to make a 25 creedmoor--I'm thinking I'll be happy if I get 2800 to 2900 fps out of it.

[Txhillbilly]

Originally Posted by stagpanther

Thanks--I'm curious--what kind of loads are you using and what velocities are you going for? I also built a 25 PRC and could easily get 3200 fps with bigger bullets but a 257 cartridge can easily become a barrel-burner when driven fast and can be murder on throats I've found. That's a big reason why I decided to make a 25 creedmoor--I'm thinking I'll be happy if I get 2800 to 2900 fps out of it.

I tried them with my 6.5 CM's and 22 CM in the past, and couldn't come close to getting the same velocities that I get with proven loads with other brass.

[stagpanther]

I tried them with my 6.5 CM's and 22 CM in the past, and couldn't come close to getting the same velocities that I get with proven loads with other brass.

My target velocity is 2,850 fps with the biggest 25 cal bullets. In the Aipha brass I'm not very far from that in the low-end load I shot--but to be honest I haven't done any real development yet--this load was just a function test. Are you necking your brass up/down from some other caliber? I have most makes of 6.5 and 6 creedmoor brass, might consider trying that. I'm not a routine 1000+ yd shooter so getting max velocities (and burning out a barrel under 1000 rounds) is not a priority for me.

[Txhillbilly]

Originally Posted by stagpanther

My target velocity is 2,850 fps with the biggest 25 cal bullets. In the Aipha brass I'm not very far from that in the low-end load I shot--but to be honest I haven't done any real development yet--this load was just a function test. Are you necking your brass up/down from some other caliber? I have most makes of 6.5 and 6 creedmoor brass, might consider trying that. I'm not a routine 1000+ yd shooter so getting max velocities (and burning out a barrel under 1000 rounds) is not a priority for me.

Yes, I neck down 6mm CM brass for my 22 CM, and 6.5 CM brass for my 25 CM. The barrel life on the 25 CM should be in the 2500 - 3000 round range, I think you'd have a hard time doing it in 1000 rounds.
I got over a 1000 rounds out of my first 22 CM barrel, and I hot rod the hell out of it.

[stagpanther]

This weekend was the first time this year I've had the "all clear" to go as long as I wanted, so I popped my 5HD on my new 25 creedmoor build and took it out to 359 yards. Wasted more shots than I thought I would finding the range--but did find a nice group of the 135 bergers driven by 41.2 grs of H4350. I was getting around 2,850 fps which is pretty much the target velocity range I was aiming for, so I'll come back to this load for further exploration. Full disclosure--I did spaz and pull one (5th) shot badly--it didn't even hit the target.

[stagpanther]

The Shilen barrel is amazing and can shoot way beyond my abilities, I ordered another one as an eventual replacement--or maybe another build. I've reached the conclusion that IMO the 25 creedmoor is probably the best all-around choice for the modern .257 highSD/BC bullets at present, when I factor in velocity, powder consumption and barrel wear/endurance. It doesn't happen all the time with all the groups; but I have repeatedly seen dual bullet impacts that were almost perfectly concentric.

As a side note, I was curious to see how well the barrel would do with some of the very high BC bullets like PVA's 120 gr Seneca; a solid lathed bullet which is very long for the weight and who's bearing surface is pretty far back from the center of the bullet--which means it has a long jump before engaging the leade. Still shoots them very well.

[stagpanther]

I had tried these in my 25 PRC and decided to try them in my 25 creedmoor as well. They are "waisted" bullets and not as big as the 135 gr bergers which the freebore on the barrel was specifically cut for--meaning it, like the PVA Seneca, has a long jump to engage the leads but it doesn't seem to be much of deterrent to accuracy. The Bulldozer is a hunting bullet and doesn't have as high a BC as other bigger .257 bullets; "only" G1 .570 and G7 .292--but my gut feeling tells me that they may possibly be underrating that (!). The Redding seating stem seems to crush down the nose insert when seating. I found what appears to be a good node at 40.9 grs using VV N555. I think the powder is a bit slow since I was seeing notable muzzle discharge, though no flash as far as I can tell. I might try a magnum primer to see if that makes any difference. Once again I managed to blow the group by not keeping the rifle steady through one of the shots--but the 4 shots inspire me to keep trying.

[stagpanther]

Today's menu consists of PVA 120 gr Seneca very high BC solids. Using VV N160 this time, a bit faster and a bit finer cut than N555. These bullets are literally needle-nose sharp and can poke a hole in your hand if you're not careful. I gotta get a new seating stem worked out for the Redding die--for all the money they charge for a custom die--and the fact the 25 creedmoor was specifically created with the newer high SD/BC bullets in mind--I don't get why it has a lower ogive nose angle.