Nervousness about Open Carry (VA)

doseyclwn · December 22, 2002, 03:46 AM

Hello all. I live in Richmond, VA. I obtained my firearm a few weeks ago. I took the requisite NRA course and put in all my paperwork to obtain my CCW, just waiting on that. I recently decided that I'd like to open-carry my gun, but I feel kinda funky about this. Why? Perhaps my liberal upbringing, perhaps 'cause I worry about people giving me crap about it. I was wondering how many of you open carry, were you nervous about it, what did you do about that nervousness, do people ever give you crap about it, etc. Any help would be most appreciative. One of the reasons I worry about it is that I look like a freak. I look like Jerry Garcia did at age 31 pretty much. I"m a big guy, long hair, beard. Now, I realize that because I choose to look this way, I'm gonna get hassled. I'm just not sure how to react in this instance. I KNOW if a cop sees me open carrying I"m gonna get hassled. Well, that's my paranoid rant for the day. Any advice is welcomed.

Drjones · December 22, 2002, 06:08 AM

Open carry is a bad idea for many reasons. Try doing a search here, and you will dig up lots of info.

Here's some off the top of my head:

-You are an instant target. If someone is going to commit a crime near you, they will single you out to take you first.

-You lose the element of surprise.

-You will get some unwanted attention and looks. Because of your appearance, as you said, you may get hassled by the cops.

Those are just a few. Sorry, its late and I can't think that well, but I've read many threads on it, and its just a bad idea, except in a very few situations. (Store owner, gun shop employee...)

So overall, I wouldn't do it.

answerguy · December 22, 2002, 07:10 AM

If that's you in the JPG you are either too young to carry or can expect lots of attention from cops becasue of your biker look. I would also expect lots of cellphone traffic from soccer moms "Man with a gun!".

Smurfslayer · December 22, 2002, 11:17 AM

This is Virginia, not New Joyzee...
1st - 85% of the people you pass, encounter, notice, stand in a grocery line with etc.. won't even notice.
2nd - of the 15% who DO notice, only 10% will even think a second thought about it.
3rd - of those 10% from item 2 above, only 10% will say something.
4th - of those 10% from item 3 above, 75% will be Pro 2a, and will want to talk guns with you.

IF by chance you manage to encounter an anti who's determined to hassle you, AND they're motivated to call the cops, just be polite, and within 5 minutes, they'll determine you've done nothing wrong, and about 60% of them will also, want to talk about your choice if firearm / holster

Seriously, I'm a MD refugee and it's taken me some time to get used to the permissive attitude towards firearms here. Here's an example. I'm in VCDL ( see www.vcdl.org ). Last Wednesday, was a the meeting at the Mason Government center - AND FFX Co. Police station. ~20 of us, with at MINIMUM of 1 open carried gun each, and most of us were carrying backups.....

On the VCDL site, are archived copies of "The Defender", the newsletter. In the last 3 issues, the topic of Open carry has been debated, quite well. Check them out. Remember, for all the negative 'keep it concealed' aspects, one fact remains - with open carry, you have faster, unfettered access to deploy the firearm if needed.

Since your appearance has been described as 'Biker-like', have a good, decent looking firearm and holster - like a service piece, well kept. At least it'll look professional there

Finally, there are a couple of places where open carry are prohibited in VA, very few, but just be sure you know about them. And finally, you *MUST* open carry in an alcohol serving establishment, CHP notwithstanding.
HTH

TallPine · December 22, 2002, 11:19 AM

Just get a cowboy hat and carry a Ruger Vaquero !

Seriously, I open carry all the time out here when I am out hiking and camping, but not much in town unless I am on my way in or out.

Nobody has ever said anything about it, including Forest Service and Game Fish & Parks people (game wardens). What people think, I don't care - except that they might think "I should leave this guy and his family alone."

But I would imagine it might be pretty scary back where you are...

LonWilson · December 22, 2002, 05:05 PM

Quote:

If that's you in the JPG you are either too young to carry or can expect lots of attention from cops becasue of your biker look. I would also expect lots of cellphone traffic from soccer moms "Man with a gun!".

As someone pointed out, this is not New Jersey. Open carry has been legal in many areas of VA for DECADES.

Also, as for your comment about "you're too young to carry", you need to start using your brain. I'm 21, and I have a CHL. Since when are you to make moral judgements on "being too young to carry"? There are some 40 year olds I wouldn't trust with a squirtgun.

Seeker · December 22, 2002, 05:50 PM

Hey Lon, I

Quote:

Also, as for your comment about "you're too young to carry", you need to start using your brain.

Hey Lon, I think he was refering to the person in the foreground of the picture.

answerguy · December 22, 2002, 06:38 PM

Quote:

Hey Lon, I think he was refering to the person in the foreground of the picture.

Exactly

doseyclwn · December 22, 2002, 07:08 PM

As far as the comment about me being to young to carry, I assume that was referring to my son. I disagree. With the way things are, I started him shooting 6 months ago (he is 22 months old today).

All kidding aside, one of the reasons I decided to get and carry a gun is because I have a family now.

cookhj · December 22, 2002, 08:13 PM

you might want to check the richmond city ordinances pertaining to open carry. i live in the city and i believe that open carry is illegal in the city of richmond, but check to be sure.

Jeff OTMG · December 22, 2002, 09:56 PM

When I was in Va. I carried open with no problems. One woman freaked and got a lesson in the law from some of the local police, but that is her problem since she is a blissninny (love that term). She needs to get over it and grow up, failing that she is welcome to move to NJ or NY where she might be more comfortable. There are areas in Va. where the prohibition on open carry was grandfathered it, so you need to check with the state police to identify those areas. If you go into a restaurant that serves alcohol you will need to carry open anyway, even if you have a permit. That is the way it was when I was there so that may have changed.

answerguy · December 22, 2002, 10:21 PM

For some reason the people who carry open and want to shove it in the face of 'blissninnys' remind me of gays who want to make public acts of affection for the effect it has on others.

For both situations I prefer 'keep it private'.

Mr. James · December 23, 2002, 01:45 PM

I've never had a negative experience carrying openly in Northern Virginia/Fairfax County. As Smurfslayer points out, the simple fact is the vast majority just don't notice the weapon. I carry a 1911 with a 4" bbl, and I honestly think most people just assume that black thing on my belt is a cell phone or PDA.

As to "the BG will shoot you first," more likely, the BG will go elsewhere rather than precipitate a fight with an opponent he knows is armed.

spacemanspiff · December 23, 2002, 02:17 PM

i've open carried from time to time, but granted, i live in a state where few blissninnys reside. honestly, i dont think 95% of those i've come across while carrying have noticed. the few that did either just nodded politely, and the younger of the bunch stared and pointed.
you have to get comfortable with it though and realize that if you do open carry, its not a good idea to fiddle with it, adjust it too often, as the more uncomfortable you appear to be with it on your hip, may dictate how uncomfortable others are with you wearing it.

depending on your local law enforcement officers, they may tell whomever bleats in fright over you and your shooter to 'urinate' up a rope....or if you have the displeasure of having a bleating LEO contact you, theres the distinct possibility of being charged with 'disturbing the peace'.

orlando5 · December 23, 2002, 06:18 PM

Quote:

As to "the BG will shoot you first," more likely, the BG will go elsewhere rather than precipitate a fight with an opponent he knows is armed.

And that is the reason why Cops carry open. It is also why gunshop clerks carry open.

Navy joe · December 24, 2002, 01:21 AM

Find "Yankytrash" on here and e-mail him. He'll school you up. There may be tactical disadvantages to open carry, but it's sometimes more important to do it as a social exercise, to affirm your right to be, to bear arms just by walking around on your daily business. I most often carry concealed, but fully support the right to open carry and do so on occasion. Richmond is legal, last thing they want to do is hear from VCDL again.

Also any of you VA stragglers, please see my post in Farewells, VA gunnie listserver in the making.

A point to ponder, many of the holster on the market are designed for concealed carry and range use. Get one with retention features, more than just a strap. For example I wouldn't want to carry a Glock in an open top belt slide, that's just begging to be grabbed. Get training on countering disarms. I agree, open carry is why criminals shoot cops rather than skulk away. They want the weak, not the ready.

Jeff OTMG · December 25, 2002, 05:52 PM

answerguy, find another answer. The reason I open carry in Va. (and WV) is NOT to make a political statement, but because that is the only LEGAL way for me to do it. Va. does not seem to think that my Texas CHL is good enough, though somehow my Tx. drivers license is just fine.

I am a bit disturbed about your disapproval of people following the law and using freedom of expression and freedom of speech to promote their political beliefs. I agree that I do not find it comfortable to be around two men kissing in public, but I would NEVER say something to them about it, report it to the police, or attempt to have legislation passed that would prevent it.

Those who do carry open as a political statement deserve our thanks, for they are doing more for the cause of promoting firearms in the public eye than any of us who only show up at the polls to vote. Be an activist. We will all be joining in a march against the MMM on Mother's Day 2004 in Washington, D.C., if they decide to show up. I will be there, will you? I was there on Mother's Day 2000, were you?

Point is that in Texas and Oklahoma, where I spend most of my time, open carry is not legal, but in places where it is, using it as a tool of political speech is a great idea. Don't bury your head, pull your head out and do something.

LonWilson · December 26, 2002, 12:12 AM

Quote:

I am a bit disturbed about your disapproval of people following the law and using freedom of expression and freedom of speech to promote their political beliefs. I agree that I do not find it comfortable to be around two men kissing in public, but I would NEVER say something to them about it, report it to the police, or attempt to have legislation passed that would prevent it.

There have been attempts, trust me on that one! :P

December 22, 2002, 11:17 AM	#4
Smurfslayer Senior Member Join Date: June 3, 2001 Location: Northern Virginia, USA Posts: 298	It's not that bad This is Virginia, not New Joyzee... 1st - 85% of the people you pass, encounter, notice, stand in a grocery line with etc.. won't even notice. 2nd - of the 15% who DO notice, only 10% will even think a second thought about it. 3rd - of those 10% from item 2 above, only 10% will say something. 4th - of those 10% from item 3 above, 75% will be Pro 2a, and will want to talk guns with you. IF by chance you manage to encounter an anti who's determined to hassle you, AND they're motivated to call the cops, just be polite, and within 5 minutes, they'll determine you've done nothing wrong, and about 60% of them will also, want to talk about your choice if firearm / holster Seriously, I'm a MD refugee and it's taken me some time to get used to the permissive attitude towards firearms here. Here's an example. I'm in VCDL ( see www.vcdl.org ). Last Wednesday, was a the meeting at the Mason Government center - AND FFX Co. Police station. ~20 of us, with at MINIMUM of 1 open carried gun each, and most of us were carrying backups..... On the VCDL site, are archived copies of "The Defender", the newsletter. In the last 3 issues, the topic of Open carry has been debated, quite well. Check them out. Remember, for all the negative 'keep it concealed' aspects, one fact remains - with open carry, you have faster, unfettered access to deploy the firearm if needed. Since your appearance has been described as 'Biker-like', have a good, decent looking firearm and holster - like a service piece, well kept. At least it'll look professional there Finally, there are a couple of places where open carry are prohibited in VA, very few, but just be sure you know about them. And finally, you MUST open carry in an alcohol serving establishment, CHP notwithstanding. HTH __________________ Dave Help Repeal the National Parks ban on self defense!:

December 22, 2002, 11:19 AM	#5
TallPine Senior Member Join Date: August 11, 2002 Location: Montana Posts: 528	Just get a cowboy hat and carry a Ruger Vaquero ! Seriously, I open carry all the time out here when I am out hiking and camping, but not much in town unless I am on my way in or out. Nobody has ever said anything about it, including Forest Service and Game Fish & Parks people (game wardens). What people think, I don't care - except that they might think "I should leave this guy and his family alone." But I would imagine it might be pretty scary back where you are... __________________ "The inherent right in the people to reform their government, I do not deny; and they have another right, and that is to resist unconstitutional laws without overturning the government." --Daniel Webster

December 22, 2002, 07:08 PM	#9
doseyclwn Junior Member Join Date: December 11, 2002 Posts: 11	re: open carry As far as the comment about me being to young to carry, I assume that was referring to my son. I disagree. With the way things are, I started him shooting 6 months ago (he is 22 months old today). All kidding aside, one of the reasons I decided to get and carry a gun is because I have a family now.

December 23, 2002, 02:17 PM	#14
spacemanspiff Senior Member Join Date: January 16, 2002 Location: alaska Posts: 3,498	i've open carried from time to time, but granted, i live in a state where few blissninnys reside. honestly, i dont think 95% of those i've come across while carrying have noticed. the few that did either just nodded politely, and the younger of the bunch stared and pointed. you have to get comfortable with it though and realize that if you do open carry, its not a good idea to fiddle with it, adjust it too often, as the more uncomfortable you appear to be with it on your hip, may dictate how uncomfortable others are with you wearing it. depending on your local law enforcement officers, they may tell whomever bleats in fright over you and your shooter to 'urinate' up a rope....or if you have the displeasure of having a bleating LEO contact you, theres the distinct possibility of being charged with 'disturbing the peace'. __________________ "Every man alone is sincere; at the entrance of a second person hypocrisy begins." - Ralph Waldo Emerson "People demand freedom of speech as a compensation for the freedom of thought which they seldom use." - Soren Kierkegaard

December 24, 2002, 01:21 AM	#16
Navy joe Senior Member Join Date: January 28, 2001 Location: VA, USA Posts: 1,804	Find "Yankytrash" on here and e-mail him. He'll school you up. There may be tactical disadvantages to open carry, but it's sometimes more important to do it as a social exercise, to affirm your right to be, to bear arms just by walking around on your daily business. I most often carry concealed, but fully support the right to open carry and do so on occasion. Richmond is legal, last thing they want to do is hear from VCDL again. Also any of you VA stragglers, please see my post in Farewells, VA gunnie listserver in the making. A point to ponder, many of the holster on the market are designed for concealed carry and range use. Get one with retention features, more than just a strap. For example I wouldn't want to carry a Glock in an open top belt slide, that's just begging to be grabbed. Get training on countering disarms. I agree, open carry is why criminals shoot cops rather than skulk away. They want the weak, not the ready. __________________ FY47012

December 22, 2002, 06:08 AM	#2
Drjones Senior Member Join Date: July 16, 2002 Posts: 1,239	Open carry is a bad idea for many reasons. Try doing a search here, and you will dig up lots of info. Here's some off the top of my head: -You are an instant target. If someone is going to commit a crime near you, they will single you out to take you first. -You lose the element of surprise. -You will get some unwanted attention and looks. Because of your appearance, as you said, you may get hassled by the cops. Those are just a few. Sorry, its late and I can't think that well, but I've read many threads on it, and its just a bad idea, except in a very few situations. (Store owner, gun shop employee...) So overall, I wouldn't do it.

December 22, 2002, 07:10 AM	#3
answerguy Senior Member Join Date: July 4, 2002 Posts: 176	If that's you in the JPG you are either too young to carry or can expect lots of attention from cops becasue of your biker look. I would also expect lots of cellphone traffic from soccer moms "Man with a gun!".

December 22, 2002, 08:13 PM	#10
cookhj Senior Member Join Date: October 30, 2001 Posts: 330	you might want to check the richmond city ordinances pertaining to open carry. i live in the city and i believe that open carry is illegal in the city of richmond, but check to be sure.

December 22, 2002, 09:56 PM	#11
Jeff OTMG Senior Member Join Date: October 15, 1998 Location: OKC, OK & Austin, Tx Posts: 3,707	When I was in Va. I carried open with no problems. One woman freaked and got a lesson in the law from some of the local police, but that is her problem since she is a blissninny (love that term). She needs to get over it and grow up, failing that she is welcome to move to NJ or NY where she might be more comfortable. There are areas in Va. where the prohibition on open carry was grandfathered it, so you need to check with the state police to identify those areas. If you go into a restaurant that serves alcohol you will need to carry open anyway, even if you have a permit. That is the way it was when I was there so that may have changed.

December 22, 2002, 10:21 PM	#12
answerguy Senior Member Join Date: July 4, 2002 Posts: 176	For some reason the people who carry open and want to shove it in the face of 'blissninnys' remind me of gays who want to make public acts of affection for the effect it has on others. For both situations I prefer 'keep it private'.

December 23, 2002, 01:45 PM	#13
Mr. James Senior Member Join Date: April 10, 2001 Location: The Old Dominion Posts: 1,521	I've never had a negative experience carrying openly in Northern Virginia/Fairfax County. As Smurfslayer points out, the simple fact is the vast majority just don't notice the weapon. I carry a 1911 with a 4" bbl, and I honestly think most people just assume that black thing on my belt is a cell phone or PDA. As to "the BG will shoot you first," more likely, the BG will go elsewhere rather than precipitate a fight with an opponent he knows is armed.

December 25, 2002, 05:52 PM	#17
Jeff OTMG Senior Member Join Date: October 15, 1998 Location: OKC, OK & Austin, Tx Posts: 3,707	answerguy, find another answer. The reason I open carry in Va. (and WV) is NOT to make a political statement, but because that is the only LEGAL way for me to do it. Va. does not seem to think that my Texas CHL is good enough, though somehow my Tx. drivers license is just fine. I am a bit disturbed about your disapproval of people following the law and using freedom of expression and freedom of speech to promote their political beliefs. I agree that I do not find it comfortable to be around two men kissing in public, but I would NEVER say something to them about it, report it to the police, or attempt to have legislation passed that would prevent it. Those who do carry open as a political statement deserve our thanks, for they are doing more for the cause of promoting firearms in the public eye than any of us who only show up at the polls to vote. Be an activist. We will all be joining in a march against the MMM on Mother's Day 2004 in Washington, D.C., if they decide to show up. I will be there, will you? I was there on Mother's Day 2000, were you? Point is that in Texas and Oklahoma, where I spend most of my time, open carry is not legal, but in places where it is, using it as a tool of political speech is a great idea. Don't bury your head, pull your head out and do something.