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Old August 14, 2000, 12:37 PM   #1
tstr
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So I bought this nifty little Derringer that shoots .45 Colt or .410 shotshells thinking it would be a fun little gun. Out of four shotshells I tried, it only managed to make one of them go off. There wasn’t enough impact on the primer. So I try a .45 Colt round. I’m shooting into a stump with a target taped to it. The bleeping bullet bounced off the stump and hit me in the forehead. I bled all over the place.

I was pretty upset that I’d bought a boomerang gun until it occurred to me that it would be flying back to the dealer today.

tstr
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Old August 14, 2000, 12:47 PM   #2
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Glad you were able to cheat death.

Regards,

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Old August 14, 2000, 01:06 PM   #3
JJR
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Which part was the mistake?
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Old August 14, 2000, 02:28 PM   #4
mcshot
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Glad you're OK.
So now we know the .45 colt is not a manstopper on bounce back. That is good.
Was that an ironwood stump?

------------------
"Keep shootin till they quit floppin"
The Wife 2/2000
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Old August 14, 2000, 02:58 PM   #5
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Cool, can you do that again?

Sam
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Old August 14, 2000, 03:04 PM   #6
Monkeyleg
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So a stump doesn't stop a .45? I learned the hard way years back that a mattress against a cinder block wall wasn't an effective stopper either, but wood? Hmmm.

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Old August 14, 2000, 03:22 PM   #7
James K
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Hi, tstr,

I am glad you were not seriously hurt. With a low power round (which the .45 Colt would be out of that short barrel), it is common to have the bullet bounce back from a tree or a fence post. The old .41 derringer rimfire round did it almost routinely. With softer wood, the bullets would stick and could be picked out with the fingers. Black powder revolvers with round balls are also very subject to bouncing back.

Remember the often repeated warning against shooting at hard surfaces?

Jim
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Old August 14, 2000, 04:11 PM   #8
Satanta
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Glad you're ok...but i have this image in my mind...

[[Man aims derringer at stump.]]
~BLAM!~
~bounce~
~THUNK~
"OUCHIES!!!!!~

HAHAHAHAHAHahahahahahahahahahahahah!!!!!!!!!
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Old August 14, 2000, 04:13 PM   #9
9x19
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What's the last thing an Oregonian says before they perish?

"Hey, watch this..."

Glad your booboo had a happy ending.



------------------
Make mine lean, mean, and 9x19!
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Old August 14, 2000, 04:17 PM   #10
Art Eatman
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Ah, the old Bounce Back Syndrome! I first discovered this with a Blackhawk, medium loads, and a cedar stump at five yards. Mesquite logs provide some bounce, also.

A buddy of mine was shooting his Python with some hot SWC loads at my hanging steel target; some 15 yards. Center-punched himself in the belly-button. Bruised himself into being a sho-nuff "outie"! (Good that he was wearing a winter shirt over a tee-shirt!)

, Art
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Old August 14, 2000, 05:58 PM   #11
tstr
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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR> [[Man aims derringer at stump.]]
~BLAM!~
~bounce~
~THUNK~
"OUCHIES!!!!!~ [/quote]

Yeah that was pretty well it. Actually a little bit funnier except for the blood. We'd been shooting other things at the stump no problem. But when I got ready to fire my new Derringer I started out cautious and fired the first round into a dirt bank. My shooting partner said, "arn't you going to shoot at the target?"

I said, "I dunno, I think I might get hurt."

My partner said, "ah come on."

I said, "It'll bounce off and hit me in the head." (swear to God I really did say that.)

Partner says, "no way."

So I aimed at the target.

~BLAM!~
~bounce~
~THUNK~
"OUCHIES!!!!!~

I yelled “OUCH!” slapped my hand to my head and turned to my partner and yelled, "I told you I'd get hurt."

My partner, of course, did not believe me -- at least not until the blood started pouring down my face. Partner kept saying, "I would have sworn you were just joking when you did said that."

Anyway. The .45 Colt is designed to fire in a larger gun and with such a short barrel it couldn't generate any velocity, especially since it was a 255grain bullet. I probably could reproduce the same energy with a good sling-shot. (I'm not going to, I just said I probably could )

tstr


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Old August 14, 2000, 06:06 PM   #12
Mike Irwin
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I shot one of those mini derringers in .44 Mag a few years ago. The first shot dislocated my thumb.

Never did take the second.

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Old August 14, 2000, 06:06 PM   #13
10CFR
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I had a standard velocity .22 long rifle bounce back off a fence post one time and I heard and felt it zing past my ear. Very unsettling. I don't know if it would have penetrated or not if it had hit me. Also, when I was going through an NRA instructor school at a Marine Corps indoor range in Quantico, one of my classmates caught a bounced back .45ACP FMJ round square in the chest while we were doing night fire training. It didn't penetrate his skin, but left a heck of a big red welt. He said it hurt accordingly - definitely got his attention. Glad you survived your event.

-10CFR
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Old August 14, 2000, 06:22 PM   #14
Erik
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You must be mistaken, M&S confirm that the .45 Long Colt one shot stops stumps 97.8564347% of the time.

---

I am glad to hear you are OK, considering the potential for grievous injury.

The most painful bounce-back I had was a 9mm returning to my ankle from about 15 yards.

I had a bullet bounce back and smack me in my shooting glasses a few years back- that will get your attention in a hurry!
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Old August 15, 2000, 01:27 AM   #15
Don Gwinn
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Is that the Cobray? Black, two barrels side-by-side, with a switch on the hammer to select which barrel fires?

The other surprise (or maybe not) is that .410 shotshells are amazingly weak out of that teeny barrel. We were shooting dad's at a soda can one day--and the shot failed to DENT the aluminum. You could hear it hit the can. I moved up to about five feet, which was as close as I cared to be, and never did manage to pierce that thin aluminum.
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Old August 15, 2000, 11:22 AM   #16
Chipperman
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Too bad you don't have it on film. I think a lot of us here would pay to see it.
OUCH
Glad you're ok.
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Old August 15, 2000, 06:15 PM   #17
Gopher .45
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Eye protection? Check. Ear protection? Check. Helmet with face guard? Why do I need a bloody face guard? You know I heard about this guy who was shooting this .45 derringer once and ...

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Old August 15, 2000, 06:43 PM   #18
CANIS
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Sorry to hear about your accident! I own a couple of .45colt/.410 derringers and find them to be the most powerful guns I could find in such a small package. Silvertips are great in it and .410 000 buck does a heck of a job on cans, melons and whatever else I can hit. Maybe you were shooting reduced velocity cowboys rounds? I've never had any such trouble with mine and have blasted clean through many a fencepost!

Canis
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Old August 15, 2000, 10:23 PM   #19
Dan in GA
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Important rule.......never use a petrified tree stump as a backstop......glad you're okay.......Dan in GA
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Old August 16, 2000, 02:27 PM   #20
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When I lived in central California, we used to be able to drive 5 minutes out of town and we would be in a dry riverbed with very high sand dune sides. All the locals would shoot in this dry riverbed. One day aabout 5 of us were firing away at an old abandoned car left in the riverbed when we saw some old tires on one of the banks...we switched to center punching the tires when two of the guys went head over heels in a somersault.

Apparently, both of them caught slow moving slug ricochets coming off the "hubcaps." They both had welts on their shins from those hunks of metal, but we kept on shooting, but from within a trench.
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Old August 16, 2000, 06:07 PM   #21
Juan Hunt Greer
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Actually, I suspect that the shot was so anemic because it was being fired in a chamber actually designed for .410 shotshell. I understand that there is a lot of "windage" untill the bullet hit the rifled part of the barrel. Of course, when You load a .410, there is only about 1" of barrel in front of the shell, so they are really only good as a conversation piece.
crankshaft
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Old August 17, 2000, 01:31 AM   #22
Archie
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tstr, glad you're okay. I blew out a pair glasses with a Daisy CO200 bb pistol in my mis-spent youth.

Anyway, couple of comments on various posts:
Shooting any bullet into a FLAT metal target will do one of two things; either destroy itself on impact (leaving the lead smear mentioned by xxero) or it will penetrate. Penetration in this instance is a matter of velocity, by the way.
I've put over 10,000 rounds onto metal targets, and have corroborated with men who have done more... trust me.
However, the bullet disintegrates and flies off tangental to the face of the target. So don't have anything off to the sides, except maybe splatter shields. Also, don't put the metal target over a cement walkway, you'll get a secondary splatter.

If a metal target has a "dimple" or cup shaped impression, one can (with suitable bad luck) put a bullet into one side of the depression, which will return it back at the shooter. Best returns are from softer (less likely to break), slower bullets.

LASur5r, rubber tires will "bounce" bullets with some good force. Not the hubcaps or wheels, the tires themselves. Also usually best (worst?) results come from slower bullets. The tires give, not allowing the projectile to penetrate, then rebound....

Probably the same thing that happened with the 45 Colt and the tree stump. "Green" wood is "bouncier" than older, dried wood. Go figure.....

Mike Irwin, I shoot one of the (North American?) derringers in 45ACP one time. Never griped about the recoil of my 1911 again.......

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Old August 17, 2000, 05:02 AM   #23
45King
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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Jim Keenan:
The old .41 derringer rimfire round did it almost routinely. With softer wood, the bullets would stick and could be picked out with the fingers[/quote]


Jim, when I was a kid, my Grandpa once let me shoot his Remington .41RF derringer. (Had I known then how valuable the ammo was, I'd never have done it.) I found that the bullet would penetrate the side of a rusty paint can filled with sand, and that it would also penetrate to the base into the end grain of a pine stump.
This all makes me wonder if a knife might not be a better back-up than a derringer in ANY caliber.


------------------
Shoot straight & make big holes, regards, Richard at The Shottist's Center
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Old August 17, 2000, 01:13 PM   #24
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Regarding metal targets, ricochets are greatly minimized by the use of swinging or springing targets, that give way when struck by the bullet.

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Old August 17, 2000, 06:58 PM   #25
CANIS
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I would venture to say that most people discount the usefulness of a derringer either based on hearsay or a bad experience with an inferior gun or anemic round. Since it seems in vogue nowadays to say that a .32 or .380 is a viable pocket pistol, I would say that a .45 colt or .410 000 buck will do significantly more damage to a BG than one of these normal mousegun cartridges (For God's sake, people actualy look at the NAA mini as a better pocket gun!!).

I find my derringers to be as reliable as a revolver (can you truly say that about any mouse auto?) and packs a very potent punch at the intended range of 3 - 7 yards.

I have literally dintegrated melons and other targets with my derringers. I can also hit targets reliably out to 7 yards or so.

So - I would not in any way prefer a knife to a derringer for self defense. I carry one one of my derringers everyday and trust my life to it's 2 powerful shots.

Just thought I''d stick up for one of my favorite handgun styles...

Chris Canis
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