Would you shoot these hand loads?

mrawesome22 · April 25, 2008, 09:19 PM

Hello all. I was at work last week and was talking guns with a fellow co-worker. I mentioned I had a 44RemMag and that I was a reloader. He tells me that he used to own a 44RemMag and has a bunch of brass I can have. So I tell him that I would greatly appreciate it and he brings them in the next day. He brings me about 150 once fired and 26 live rounds. The box with the live rounds had a Speer reloading sticker on it which read: Cartridge 44, bullet 240gr (manufacturer and model not specified), powder 24gr H110 (max Hodgdon load), primer CCI (magnum or standard not specified). So I asked him where these came from and he tells me that they were made at Custom Cartridges in Cambridge, OH. So I start inspecting them and right off the bat I notice one round that was longer than some of the others. But I thank him for them and take them home. I got out the caliper and started measuring. The bullets are .430" diameter, and look like XTP's. OAL's are all over the place from a low of 1.592" to a high of 1.618", and about half have the primers seated too high. They wobble badly when sat on a flat surface. And the brass is very corroded. I would be ashamed to sell something that looked like this stuff. Another thing, would YOU sell MAX CHARGE loads to someone you didn't even know, let alone you wouldn't even know the gun it was going to be shot out of? Here is a picture.

joneb · April 25, 2008, 09:49 PM

I would not shoot those reloads

I would take them apart and reload the bullets and brass only. The Hornady .44 cal XTP's are .430 dia. Geese I guess the reloader of those cartridges didn't have a case trimmer, or a clue

zxcvbob · April 25, 2008, 09:51 PM

I think I'd pull the bullets, reseat the primers, and reload that brass pretty light the first time. (Maybe 3/4 power loads using Unique or Bullseye.) Then polish 'em up and inspect to see how bad the corrosion really is.

The bullets are probably fine, and those are expensive bullets. It'd be a shame to waste them. I would not fire those rounds as-is.

Goldy · April 25, 2008, 09:58 PM

If they were mine, I'd pull the bullets and chuck the cases. I don't trust cases with corrosion . I think it degrades the strength of the brass. There maybe a reason the primers are not flush and the bullets are pushed up. Powder might be degrading.

Not worth the chance. Just save the bullets.

goldy

Hawg · April 25, 2008, 10:08 PM

From the pics it looks like the cases weren't trimmed. I don't shoot anybodys reloads but my own. I don't care who they are or how long they've been reloading. I will not do it.

**Mal H** · April 25, 2008, 10:10 PM

Yes, I'd fire them. That is the term you use when you no longer need someone or something, isn't it?

I wouldn't hesitate to chamber them ...
in my inertial bullet puller and pull every single one of them.

Those are a disaster looking for a place to go off. Too many things might be wrong with them.

bigautomatic · April 25, 2008, 10:12 PM

Definately looks like XTPs, but who knows about the rest of the load. Pull the bullets, dump the powder, and fire them with only the primer. Tumble the brass until all the corosion is gone, and inspect it carefully before reloading it.
But, is all this and your safety really worth 26 cases? I would pull the bullets, dump the powder and fire the primers just to make them safe, and put my efforts towards the 150 once fired cases. 150 cases moderately loaded will last a very long time.

CPTMurdoc30 · April 25, 2008, 10:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Goldy

If they were mine, I'd pull the bullets and chuck the cases. I don't trust cases with corrosion .

I am in 150% total agrement with that statement right there. I might try the two middle ones but if the guy cant seat a primer how accurate was the powder charge?

bigautomatic · April 25, 2008, 10:23 PM

CPT-I just noticed the two center rounds that you pointed out. They are definately different than all the others. Much more groove showing, less corrosion, etc. They look like they came from a different batch. I still wouldn't shoot them either though.

mrawesome22 · April 25, 2008, 10:26 PM

I figured I was going to get these kinds of responses. Thank you all and I will be pulling the bullets and dumping the powder. I'm curious to find out what the charge weights in these things will be. If the variations in OAL and primer seating are any indication, I'm probably going to be seeing anywhere from 20 to 25 grains of powder. Maybe this guy needs a friendly phone call to let him know what I think of his work?

EDIT: Yes, I put the two longest in there as an eye popper.

**Mal H** · April 26, 2008, 12:32 AM

Actually the OAL variations you found aren't that big of a deal. You'll find variations in most commercially produced ammo. For the rounds in question, as long as the crimp is in the cannelure (and it looks like it is), then the OAL is satisfactory. When handloading, we try to be a little more careful than that, but it won't make much difference in either pressure variations or muzzle velocity.

WSM MAGNUM · April 26, 2008, 09:16 AM

Who ever loaded them did sloppy work. Makes you wonder about how consistent the powder charge is. That would be the bigger reason why I would not shoot them.
Pull the bullets, dump the powder, and fire off the primers. Then reload using the bullets that you pulled if you can identify them.

saudst · April 26, 2008, 03:47 PM

Just like we are all saying here, anything but fireing them. I lost a Super Blackhawk by fireing the same primer problem when I was 19. The cartrage to the right of the chamber hit against the breach and went off as well destroying the gun. Pull the bullets or toss them is what I would do.

Be safe.

DEDON45 · April 26, 2008, 06:48 PM

The max charge alone normally wouldn't stop me in a Ruger, T/C, or a Freedom Arms pistol... normally I'd say fire one and see what the primer looked like afterwards (pressure signs)... BUT... given the other issues you've seen so far (high primers, etc.) I don't know that I'd trust the consistency of the powder charge at all. In this case, I'd be pulling bullets and saving them (weigh a few to make sure they're fairly consistent), fertilize the yard with the powder, and deprime the brass ... whether or not to keep the brass, well, that's a judgement call there.

115scott · April 26, 2008, 06:53 PM

Is your gun worth the price of these shells?
Pull the bullets and chuck the rest.

**Frank Ettin** · April 26, 2008, 06:55 PM

All of the above -- I wouldn't shoot them. In general, I won't shoot any reloads but my own.

Ozzieman · April 27, 2008, 08:16 PM

If what the box said is true, the load of 24 GR of H110 is very close to max.
The Speer reloading manual number 10 states that 24.4 is the max load for H110 for a 240 GR bullet.
When you pull them, I would check one for powder weight just to see how "BAD" they are.
Corroded brass is not something that I will shoot through a magnum gun, it’s just not worth the price of a gun or a body part.

ShootingNut · April 29, 2008, 03:54 PM

Dig a hole 24" minimum, and bury the suckers, it ain't worth anyones time messing around with them. In my opinion more trouble than the casings are worth, or potential problems they may cause.

The Lovemaster · April 29, 2008, 03:59 PM

Pull the bullets, put all the powder in one pile, and light while keeping one's face as far away as possible.

Hey what's better than burning free powder?

ShootingNut · April 29, 2008, 05:28 PM

Dump that "Pile" of powder on the lawn, great fertilizer.

SN
PS: Spread the pile out a tad.

Steady52 · April 29, 2008, 09:28 PM

I have to agree with several of the posts about not shooting reloads other than my own. Unless you know the person extremely well who loaded them and know for certain about his/her skill, you just don't know for sure what you are getting. I'd toss those rounds. One of my high school teachers taught me the basics and he was very careful and I'm so glad he was. Unfortunately, most high school teachers don't teach their students valuable shooting and reloading skills these days.

KW-Bane · April 29, 2008, 09:45 PM

I would pull the bullets, then discard the rest. I would not shoot those rnds in my gun. They look like they were thrown together in a hurry with half the instructions missing.

benzy2 · May 3, 2008, 12:43 AM

As EVERYONE else has stated I would pull the bullets and use them. Beyond that I wouldn't risk the rest of it. When I first started reloading I thought I would use anything to make it cheaper to shoot. Now I personally would rather shoot a little less and know everything is going to work well and be safe. There are only a very select few beyond myself that I trust to shoot their reloads. They are people I know well and know their reloading process and ability well. Beyond that forget it.

April 25, 2008, 09:19 PM	#1
mrawesome22 Senior Member Join Date: November 9, 2005 Location: Ohio, Appalachia's foothills. Posts: 3,779	Would you shoot these hand loads? Hello all. I was at work last week and was talking guns with a fellow co-worker. I mentioned I had a 44RemMag and that I was a reloader. He tells me that he used to own a 44RemMag and has a bunch of brass I can have. So I tell him that I would greatly appreciate it and he brings them in the next day. He brings me about 150 once fired and 26 live rounds. The box with the live rounds had a Speer reloading sticker on it which read: Cartridge 44, bullet 240gr (manufacturer and model not specified), powder 24gr H110 (max Hodgdon load), primer CCI (magnum or standard not specified). So I asked him where these came from and he tells me that they were made at Custom Cartridges in Cambridge, OH. So I start inspecting them and right off the bat I notice one round that was longer than some of the others. But I thank him for them and take them home. I got out the caliper and started measuring. The bullets are .430" diameter, and look like XTP's. OAL's are all over the place from a low of 1.592" to a high of 1.618", and about half have the primers seated too high. They wobble badly when sat on a flat surface. And the brass is very corroded. I would be ashamed to sell something that looked like this stuff. Another thing, would YOU sell MAX CHARGE loads to someone you didn't even know, let alone you wouldn't even know the gun it was going to be shot out of? Here is a picture.

April 25, 2008, 09:51 PM	#3
zxcvbob Senior Member Join Date: December 20, 2007 Location: S.E. Minnesota Posts: 4,720	I think I'd pull the bullets, reseat the primers, and reload that brass pretty light the first time. (Maybe 3/4 power loads using Unique or Bullseye.) Then polish 'em up and inspect to see how bad the corrosion really is. The bullets are probably fine, and those are expensive bullets. It'd be a shame to waste them. I would not fire those rounds as-is. __________________ "Everything they do is so dramatic and flamboyant. It just makes me want to set myself on fire!" —Lucille Bluth

April 26, 2008, 09:16 AM	#12
WSM MAGNUM Senior Member Join Date: September 30, 2006 Location: Maryland Posts: 750	Who ever loaded them did sloppy work. Makes you wonder about how consistent the powder charge is. That would be the bigger reason why I would not shoot them. Pull the bullets, dump the powder, and fire off the primers. Then reload using the bullets that you pulled if you can identify them. __________________ Henry - Life NRA Member, USCCA Shield Member If con is the opposite of pro, is Congress the opposite of progress?

April 26, 2008, 03:47 PM	#13
saudst Senior Member Join Date: February 20, 2008 Location: Central Wisconsin Posts: 184	Kaboom!! Just like we are all saying here, anything but fireing them. I lost a Super Blackhawk by fireing the same primer problem when I was 19. The cartrage to the right of the chamber hit against the breach and went off as well destroying the gun. Pull the bullets or toss them is what I would do. Be safe. __________________ Tim. "Fear of death will not prevent dieing, but it may prevent living".

April 26, 2008, 06:53 PM	#15
115scott Senior Member Join Date: March 29, 2008 Location: Montana Posts: 109	Is your gun worth the price of these shells? Pull the bullets and chuck the rest. __________________ Scott Personally, I carry a gun because I'm too young to die and too old to take an ass whoopin. ~ 'Those who hammer their guns into plows will plow for those who do not.' ~ Thomas Jefferson

April 25, 2008, 09:49 PM	#2
joneb Senior Member Join Date: December 10, 2005 Location: Central , OR Posts: 1,888	I would not shoot those reloads I would take them apart and reload the bullets and brass only. The Hornady .44 cal XTP's are .430 dia. Geese I guess the reloader of those cartridges didn't have a case trimmer, or a clue

April 25, 2008, 09:58 PM	#4
Goldy Senior Member Join Date: May 23, 2004 Posts: 163	If they were mine, I'd pull the bullets and chuck the cases. I don't trust cases with corrosion . I think it degrades the strength of the brass. There maybe a reason the primers are not flush and the bullets are pushed up. Powder might be degrading. Not worth the chance. Just save the bullets. goldy

April 25, 2008, 10:08 PM	#5
Hawg Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2007 Location: Mississippi Posts: 16,192	From the pics it looks like the cases weren't trimmed. I don't shoot anybodys reloads but my own. I don't care who they are or how long they've been reloading. I will not do it.

April 25, 2008, 10:10 PM	#6
Mal H Staff Join Date: March 20, 1999 Location: Somewhere in the woods of Northern Virginia Posts: 16,959	Yes, I'd fire them. That is the term you use when you no longer need someone or something, isn't it? I wouldn't hesitate to chamber them ... in my inertial bullet puller and pull every single one of them. Those are a disaster looking for a place to go off. Too many things might be wrong with them.

April 25, 2008, 10:12 PM	#7
bigautomatic Senior Member Join Date: December 18, 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 610	Definately looks like XTPs, but who knows about the rest of the load. Pull the bullets, dump the powder, and fire them with only the primer. Tumble the brass until all the corosion is gone, and inspect it carefully before reloading it. But, is all this and your safety really worth 26 cases? I would pull the bullets, dump the powder and fire the primers just to make them safe, and put my efforts towards the 150 once fired cases. 150 cases moderately loaded will last a very long time.

April 25, 2008, 10:23 PM	#9
bigautomatic Senior Member Join Date: December 18, 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 610	CPT-I just noticed the two center rounds that you pointed out. They are definately different than all the others. Much more groove showing, less corrosion, etc. They look like they came from a different batch. I still wouldn't shoot them either though.

April 25, 2008, 10:26 PM	#10
mrawesome22 Senior Member Join Date: November 9, 2005 Location: Ohio, Appalachia's foothills. Posts: 3,779	I figured I was going to get these kinds of responses. Thank you all and I will be pulling the bullets and dumping the powder. I'm curious to find out what the charge weights in these things will be. If the variations in OAL and primer seating are any indication, I'm probably going to be seeing anywhere from 20 to 25 grains of powder. Maybe this guy needs a friendly phone call to let him know what I think of his work? EDIT: Yes, I put the two longest in there as an eye popper.

April 26, 2008, 12:32 AM	#11
Mal H Staff Join Date: March 20, 1999 Location: Somewhere in the woods of Northern Virginia Posts: 16,959	Actually the OAL variations you found aren't that big of a deal. You'll find variations in most commercially produced ammo. For the rounds in question, as long as the crimp is in the cannelure (and it looks like it is), then the OAL is satisfactory. When handloading, we try to be a little more careful than that, but it won't make much difference in either pressure variations or muzzle velocity.

April 26, 2008, 06:48 PM	#14
DEDON45 Senior Member Join Date: March 24, 2008 Posts: 278	The max charge alone normally wouldn't stop me in a Ruger, T/C, or a Freedom Arms pistol... normally I'd say fire one and see what the primer looked like afterwards (pressure signs)... BUT... given the other issues you've seen so far (high primers, etc.) I don't know that I'd trust the consistency of the powder charge at all. In this case, I'd be pulling bullets and saving them (weigh a few to make sure they're fairly consistent), fertilize the yard with the powder, and deprime the brass ... whether or not to keep the brass, well, that's a judgement call there.

April 26, 2008, 06:55 PM	#16
Frank Ettin Staff Join Date: November 23, 2005 Location: California - San Francisco Posts: 9,473	All of the above -- I wouldn't shoot them. In general, I won't shoot any reloads but my own.

April 27, 2008, 08:16 PM	#17
Ozzieman Senior Member Join Date: December 14, 2004 Location: Northern Indiana Posts: 6,117	If what the box said is true, the load of 24 GR of H110 is very close to max. The Speer reloading manual number 10 states that 24.4 is the max load for H110 for a 240 GR bullet. When you pull them, I would check one for powder weight just to see how "BAD" they are. Corroded brass is not something that I will shoot through a magnum gun, it’s just not worth the price of a gun or a body part.

April 29, 2008, 03:54 PM	#18
ShootingNut Senior Member Join Date: December 27, 2006 Location: Wisconsin Posts: 1,475	Get Out The Shovel Dig a hole 24" minimum, and bury the suckers, it ain't worth anyones time messing around with them. In my opinion more trouble than the casings are worth, or potential problems they may cause.

April 29, 2008, 03:59 PM	#19
The Lovemaster Senior Member Join Date: December 29, 2007 Location: Arizona Posts: 416	Pull the bullets, put all the powder in one pile, and light while keeping one's face as far away as possible. Hey what's better than burning free powder?

April 29, 2008, 05:28 PM	#20
ShootingNut Senior Member Join Date: December 27, 2006 Location: Wisconsin Posts: 1,475	Cancel TruGreen Dump that "Pile" of powder on the lawn, great fertilizer. SN PS: Spread the pile out a tad.

April 29, 2008, 09:28 PM	#21
Steady52 Member Join Date: April 24, 2008 Location: NE Kansas Posts: 29	I have to agree with several of the posts about not shooting reloads other than my own. Unless you know the person extremely well who loaded them and know for certain about his/her skill, you just don't know for sure what you are getting. I'd toss those rounds. One of my high school teachers taught me the basics and he was very careful and I'm so glad he was. Unfortunately, most high school teachers don't teach their students valuable shooting and reloading skills these days.

April 29, 2008, 09:45 PM	#22
KW-Bane Senior Member Join Date: October 22, 2006 Location: Mississippi Posts: 109	I would pull the bullets, then discard the rest. I would not shoot those rnds in my gun. They look like they were thrown together in a hurry with half the instructions missing. __________________ http://www.kwsquad.com/kwsite2/ "Everyone knows there is right and wrong, but integrity proves a man"

May 3, 2008, 12:43 AM	#23
benzy2 Member Join Date: April 16, 2008 Posts: 38	As EVERYONE else has stated I would pull the bullets and use them. Beyond that I wouldn't risk the rest of it. When I first started reloading I thought I would use anything to make it cheaper to shoot. Now I personally would rather shoot a little less and know everything is going to work well and be safe. There are only a very select few beyond myself that I trust to shoot their reloads. They are people I know well and know their reloading process and ability well. Beyond that forget it.