Stainless Tikka .243 exploded at the range today - lots of luck

[MeekAndMild]

mete, a gunsmithing question: If there is a flaw in a rifle, is it possible that the proof load they shoot at the factory could overstress it so that it would later explode with a normal load?

[mete]

The proof test is to test for gross flaws.If the proof tests starts a crack because of a flaw standard loads will do it to though it will take a few rounds to do it .Considering that the guns in question failed within about two boxes of ammo , they would have failed with or without the proof load.

[Dean Speir]

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As Groucho said in A Night at the Opera, the jig is up…

Finnish gun manufacturer recalls faulty hunting weapons

…in Finland, at least.

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[PsychoSword]

Whoa, this thread is still going! I was in doing a transfer yesterday and spoke to the gunshop owner. We couldn't get ahold of the guy, but if he has the pictures, I will post them here, hopefully within a few days now.

I also confirmed through the gunshop owner that his gun was not on the recall list.

Are they talking about Fire Capt in the article? He's from Washington.

[FirstFreedom]

Thanks Dean. I believe the recall of the 2,700 suspect guns is *worldwide*. It's just issued from Finland, where the manuf. is located. Tell your friends, boys, if they have a Tikka.

[See, I *told* you guys that WSMs are more dangerous because of less metal thickness between the cartridge case and the outer surface...JK, I don't think that matters. ]

[mete]

"All consumers have been contacted a long time ago " Well Dean , they still seem to be in denial...The company admits to 6 blow ups. The fellow in the article is the fire fighter from washington.

[Nuts590]

All buyers have been notified, and most of the guns have been returned to the factory for repairs or replacement, except for a few in the United States.

That doesn't exactly make me sleep better at night...

[Dean Speir]

A limited number of recently delivered Sako and Tikka stainless steel rifles have been recalled due to a problem discovered in the steel used in the barrels. The lowest serial number affected by this recall is 419140 and the highest serial number affected is 461951; however, only a small percentage of rifles within this range of numbers is being recalled. In addition, no rifle shipped before February 2004 is involved in the recall. Because only a limited number of recently shipped rifles are involved in the recall, customers being asked to return their rifle are being contacted directly. Although the recall is nearly complete (99% of rifles affected by the recall in the U.S. have already been returned or are in the process of being returned), if you have a stainless steel Sako or Tikka rifle within the serial number range listed above, received by you after February 28, 2004, and you want to check and determine whether it is being recalled, please call 1-800-503-8869. If you have received a written or telephonic recall notice, please follow the instructions for returning the recalled product contained in that notice.

At least two of those with whom I've been in contact who have experienced the catastrophic failures, one here and one in Finland, have "lawyered up."

We shall see what we shall see.

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[FirstFreedom]

Well, the two that have lawyers, how badly were they injured, if at all? If they weren't, then they're wasting their time - they ain't gonna get compensated for a bad range day unless physical injury is first established.

[Master Blaster]

42,000 rifles affected, and they have not been real forthcomming about issueing the recall when they have known about the problem for months. I'm sorry I could never consider one of their rifles ever.

As far as the lawyers go, these folks at Tikka, Sako, Berretta, need to be sued for a bundle of money for their neglegence, and foot dragging on recalling these rifles. Rifles aint like a toaster, you know where each and every one went, especially in the USA.

[RifleReady]

Am I understanding this defect is only in the stainless?

And if every serial number is a rifle that's 42,811 so what's up with that?:barf:

[Rivers]

(1) Tikkas and Sakos use the same barrels. (2) Fluting a barrel doesn't make it stiffer. (3) It's entirely possible that anybody filing a lawsuit will receive a substantial settlement, whether or not they suffered any physical damage. (4) This thread has nothing to do with whether stainless barrels are prone to explode...they aren't. Bad batch of steel.

[FirstFreedom]

It's entirely possible that anybody filing a lawsuit will receive a substantial settlement, whether or not they suffered any physical damage.

[emphasis mine]

No, it's not. I'm a lawyer, and the fact is that defendants (and their insurance companies) don't settle and cough up even a thin dime unless you can prove all the elements of your claim in court. If you were not injured at all, you have failed in one element of your personal injury damage claim (the only kind of claim that could result in a *sustantial* recovery). Now, if you were even *slightly* injured, then yes, you'd be able to squeeze out a settlement of *some* kind, in all liklihood, but certainly not a very large one, for scrapes, bruises and such. Now, if you have a minor injury (scrapes, bruises), AND had resulting serious mental anquish, night sweats, PTSD, etc, from the experience which requires mental health treatment, etc., they yes, your recovery could be substantial indeed. But they are not gonna pay for anything but the gun itself (and maybe a paltry goodwill amount, under $500 or so), just because it exploded and therefore you had a bad day (mental anguish alone, without physical injury) - at least under the U.S.A. common law. Now, in other countries, yes, quite possibly the law is different.

This thread has nothing to do with whether stainless barrels are prone to explode...they aren't. Bad batch of steel.

Also not really correct. Unless you're disputing what Meek and others have said, it may NOT have been just a 'bad batch of steel'. It could have been too quick of a cooling process during heat treatment; it could have been being held at the wrong pressure during same. So, since high-chromium steel *IS* in fact far more likely to end up bad if strict controls are not used, then this thread really IS about 'whether stainless barrels are more prone to explode', to a large extent, since they are *IF* (and only if) the manufacturer in question has *potential* quality control issues, given the senstivity of this type of steel, relative to low-chromium steels.

[rick_reno]

http://www.webcom.com/gun_guy/recalls.htm#BTS1

TIKKA - SAKO - BERETTA recall!
Since November 2004 a serious problem has surfaced affecting stainless steel Tikka and Sako rifles. There have been several instances of "self-destruction," some involving personal injury. Nothing has been posted (as of 12-26-2004) on any of the three Web sites. One user's report noted, referring to the SAKO Finnlite model, "They have all been pulled from the shelves." This is no minor problem as can be seen if you examine some of the photos here (scroll down to "Re: Sako Blow-up" posted by "Lawndart") you will see the a result one shooter. The current thinking is a problem with the stainless steel barrels and some report offers to replace just the barrel while others report offers to replace the entire rifle. A poster at another forum (http://tinyurl.com/6mfuo) wrote: "recall on [Tikka] T3 Stainless rifles with serial numbers starting with 419140 and going to 461951." This information should not, however, be accepted as all-inclusive. Several shooters wrote they had received a "recall notice" from Beretta. Also, several people provided telephone numbers: Beretta 800-636-3420; in Canada, contact Stoeger's 800-263-1945. Another shooter posted this information:
"I had one of the recalled rifles (.308). After a lot of research and BS'ing with people at Beretta's customer service I finally got the direct phone number (301)-283-2191. Cheryl (ext 1212) is in charge of this "situation" and was very helpfull (once she called me back). The best thing to do is to call that number then hit "0" for the receptionist. You won't get through to Cheryl but chances are you will get through to Peter. I spoke with him twice and he got my message to Cheryl with a quick response."

What comes through "loud and clear" is shooters' disgust with the Beretta-SAKO-Tikka hierachy which apparently is refusing to publish any useful or explanatory information on any of the three websites. If you even think you might have one of the affected products, do NOT attempt to fire the rifle without assurance from the manufacturer that your rifle is safe to fire. Websites: Tikka, SAKO, Beretta USA

Outdoor Life magazine noted, in mid-2005, that this recall was "...99 percent complete. The firearm's importer, Beretta USA, reported that all but 20 of the 2,700 guns affected by the recall had been returned or were in the process of being returned. At least six cases of rifle failure have been reported, according to the Outdoor Wire, with the most serious case occurring to a Washington shooter who broke bones in his hand when his gun barrel exploded."

[Eghad]

In the Guns May 2005 issue also.......

A bout 3,000 rifles sold under the Sako and Tikka labels have been recalled following catastrophic failures, but a small number of guns sold in the American market remain in the hands of owners who apparently have not heard about the recall. A weakness in the stainless steel used to manufacture rifles last year has led to ruptured barrels. Contact the Sako/Tikka Recall Center immediately at (800) 503-8869 with your rifle's serial number to find out if your firearm is affected.--Courtesy NSSF

[UniversalFrost]

Hi, other than the stainless models are any others affected? I saw a T3 tactical (not stainless) in 7.62 (.308) that blew up in almost the same way as the .243 stainless you are describing (but in 2003). Other than the mis-convienance of blowing up, the gun shot sub MOA for about the last 500 rounds as was a good target rifle. Tikka replaced the rifle for the guy no questions asked. I was considering picking up one of the stainless models in 7mm mag, but am thinking of going with a REM Sendero after reading this thread and I don't like how they are not advertising the recall (have been to Tikka website recently and never saw a thing about the stainless recall).

Thanks for the heads up..

Too bad they blow up rather often, other than that they are a smooth, accurate rifle.

[Rivers]

First Freedom: Thanks for the reply. I believe your description of why the steel might have been bad qualifies under my definition of a "bad batch of steel."

Won't take issue with your opinion about settlements, other than to say that my personal experience is that there have been large settlements paid out by insurance companies when no damages were proven. (eg., the Bushmaster case) I personally was involved in a case with a large insurance company in which there were multiple plaintiffs, in which the insurance company paid out $13M in settlements, not bothering to investigate and require "proof" in any of the claims.

[FirstFreedom]

No prob. Don't forget guys - this is a 1.5 year old thread - I think (but am not totally sure) that Sako has resolved all the issues there.

[impact]

This is at least the third such incident involving stainless Sako/Tikka rifles and good quality factory ammunition. It does not appear to be an ammunition problem, but rather a problem with the rifle barrels.

Anyone who owns a stainless SAKO or TIKKA rifle should contact the manufacturer before firing it again.

This thread contains contact information for the manufacturer/distributor as well as pics of a blown up SAKO rifle.

Oh great! I have a new Tikka 270 in stainless. Unfired!

[impact]

No prob. Don't forget guys - this is a 1.5 year old thread - I think (but am not totally sure) that Sako has resolved all the issues there.

I hope they did FF. My gun is a year old. Thanks

[jentb737]

A Sako Rifle chambered for the 243 Winchester Caliber BLEW UP at a rifle range near Winchester, Virginia a few days ago. There must still be a problem of some sort with these Sako rifles. When I receive more of the details I will post the information. jentb737

Good Shooting To You All, Jent

Jent P Mitchell III ----- [email protected]

[arkie2]

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[jentb737]

I and WE already ruled out operator error. This shooter was no greenhorn. You will notice that I use my real name in all my computer activity. I am never relutant to stand by my words. There is an investigation in progress. Cartridges from the batch that held the cartridge that blew this Sako still exist and have been preserved. Most all of the parts of this Sako were recovered for inspection and post accident investigation. I believe the problem is with the rifle. It will be very enlightening when we determine the date of manufacture of this Sako rifle.

Good Shooting To You All, jentb737

Jent P Mitchell III ---- [email protected]

[billindenver]

stainless barrel? Fluted? How old is the rifle?

[warrior poet]

Has anyone considered harmonic frequency? The fluting would change the natural vibrational frequency of the barrel, and MAYBE the vibrations of the firing pulse are causing resonance, weakening the metal with every shot. Look up the old Tacoma Narrows Bridge- if my recall is right. It was there that the wind caused resonance and tore the bridge apart.
If I'm seeing this right, maybe the fluting, coupled with the particular alloy of stainless steel, created a barrel with a resonance frequency within the vibrational frequency range of the firing pulse. That would mean that it weakens itself with each firing vibration. That would explain why it WAS good enough to pass inital "proofing" tests- assuming Tikka/Sako/Beretta does those- but failed later. Just a guess, though. I haven't seen- let alone tested, or seen tests of- any of these barrels... AND my schooling on harmonics is well over a decade old- that's where I remember the name of the bridge from BTW.
I'm no expert and I'm new to this thread. On reading it... harmonics popped into mind. Then again, with ex-wife pops into my mind now and then... AND that's definitely not a good thing.