|
Forum Rules | Firearms Safety | Firearms Photos | Links | Library | Lost Password | Email Changes |
Register | FAQ | Calendar | Today's Posts | Search |
|
Thread Tools | Search this Thread |
August 21, 2008, 08:20 AM | #26 |
Member
Join Date: May 20, 2008
Location: East Africa
Posts: 67
|
Wildebees,
"We've been attacked. We won. We are the exemptions to the rule." Sorry to hear you had to go through that. A good friend of mine and his family got burgled, beaten and raped during a long and horrible night a few years ago in Joburg. Luckily they all survived. Fences, watchmen, alarms, grills, locks etc were of no help. No dogs, no guns. Up here, the average criminals are a little less organised and the crime level is nowhere near as high. I have no statistics to show it, but I have hardly ever heard of a break-in here where there wasn't at least one inside man. A shotgun, rifles and/or handguns in a house are more an incentive to try a break-in than a deterrent. As others said, a good dog goes a long way, but its far from a guarantee. After some unmentionables poisoned our little Buddy late last year, we got another one and he's doing alright, so far. We also try to take good care of our house staff (they have been with us for many years) and make sure we stay friendly and close with the neighbors. Back on topic: I do believe there may be something to the racking theory under some circumstances against some criminals, but I certainly wouldn't rely on it. BA |
August 21, 2008, 08:27 AM | #27 |
Senior Member
Join Date: July 1, 2008
Location: Los Angeles, Kalifornia
Posts: 1,176
|
You guys in Africa don't mess around do you? Kids with AK-47s. Genocide.
And marauding bands of commandos. |
August 21, 2008, 08:44 AM | #28 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: February 27, 2008
Location: midwest
Posts: 4,209
|
my personal therory is that while the sound of me racking the first round of buckshot may be enough to have him turn tail,it may not therefore it's a good thing I'm holding a loaded shotgun instead of a tape recorder.
__________________
rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6 Quote:
|
|
August 21, 2008, 08:46 AM | #29 |
Member
Join Date: May 20, 2008
Location: East Africa
Posts: 67
|
Not to mention bureaucracy, tropical weather, corruption, great fishing, moving the goal posts, horrendous traffic, opportunities, drunk driving, beautiful scenery, poverty, astonishing wildlife and political turmoil. It seldom gets boring down here...
BA |
August 21, 2008, 08:58 AM | #30 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: December 20, 2007
Location: S.E. Minnesota
Posts: 4,720
|
Quote:
__________________
"Everything they do is so dramatic and flamboyant. It just makes me want to set myself on fire!" —Lucille Bluth |
|
August 21, 2008, 11:28 AM | #31 |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 20, 2006
Posts: 925
|
The sound of my mossberg 500 is distinctive. But IMHO racking to scare is like a threat and I don't believe in threats, it tips off your intentions. If you have picked up your shot gun, are you still indecisive on what you will do? If you were about to brawl would you tell the guy, "I am going to break your jaw"? That just giving them a chance, in a combative situation I don't believe in giving chances. What if in racking to scare the one time in fifty the guy turns and starts shooting at the sound. I like the sound of a racking shotgun as much as anyone else but isn't it just giving away your position and intention.
|
August 21, 2008, 12:11 PM | #32 |
Senior Member
Join Date: April 7, 2007
Posts: 342
|
The sound or a racking shotgun tells an aggressor that you're so far behind the curve that you only just then decided that the gun should actually be loaded.
|
August 21, 2008, 12:24 PM | #33 |
Junior member
Join Date: January 26, 2007
Location: South-Western North Carolina
Posts: 1,124
|
I suppose that could be argued - that said I have SXS 12ga mag leaned in near corner of my bed, a Makarov in spare holster velcroed to bedpost and my Camp .45acp w/10 rd mag hanging on wall hook near shotgun. the only sounds they'll hear is me telling them - I have a pistol pointed your way - then it fireing.
|
August 21, 2008, 12:35 PM | #34 |
Member
Join Date: August 17, 2008
Location: CT (People's Republic of Konnecticut
Posts: 65
|
+1 Stagger Lee. My point zackly.
|
August 21, 2008, 12:48 PM | #35 | |
Junior member
Join Date: January 24, 2005
Location: SW Louisiana
Posts: 2,289
|
Quote:
|
|
August 21, 2008, 12:59 PM | #36 |
Member
Join Date: August 17, 2008
Location: CT (People's Republic of Konnecticut
Posts: 65
|
Reminds me of Archie Bunker's taped recording of a barking dog in lieu of a real security system...
|
August 21, 2008, 01:05 PM | #37 | |
Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: June 25, 2008
Location: Austin, CO
Posts: 19,578
|
Quote:
All though I'm sure it wouldn't be the first time somebody came from S. Africa to America. Like I said, to each his own. ANY city is no place I want to live. My town now has about 3500 people within a 5 mile radius and that about 3497 too many in my opinion.
__________________
Nobody plans to screw up their lives... ...they just don't plan not to. -Andy Stanley |
|
August 21, 2008, 01:07 PM | #38 | |
Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: June 25, 2008
Location: Austin, CO
Posts: 19,578
|
Quote:
I'm not saying I doubt you but have you ever actually KNOWN this to work? I've never seen or heard of it outside of Hollywood and internet lore.
__________________
Nobody plans to screw up their lives... ...they just don't plan not to. -Andy Stanley |
|
August 21, 2008, 02:21 PM | #39 |
Senior Member
Join Date: June 19, 2007
Location: san diego, ca
Posts: 354
|
it's an intimidating sound, for sure. so you pump it, yell "stop", and if the bad guy doesn't put his hands up, or if he makes a sudden move, you'd better be prepared to pull the trigger. if he freezes, even better, you didnt' have to take a life.
|
August 21, 2008, 02:33 PM | #40 |
Senior Member
Join Date: October 26, 2005
Location: Houston area
Posts: 1,823
|
Wildebees' post is a reminder of something I've read from Jeff White any number of times...that, despite all the time we spend worrying about being armed 24/7/365, most of us live in what is the safest country in the world, with the lowest possibility of personal violence. Even where I live, where home invasions are dismayingly common, they are NOTHING like what he describes.
It does give you a reason to be thankful to be where you are, if you're here. For those of you who are THERE, I cannot imagine what you go through, and I wish you all the best. Wow. I have to think I'd have my KIDS packing 24/7/365, not to mention every adult in the house. And from what you say, that wouldn't necessarily do either. Springmom
__________________
I will not be a victim home on the web: www.panagia-icons.net (my webpage) www.nousfromspring.blogspot.com (Orthodoxy) "I couldn't hear you. Stop firing the gun while you're talking!" Frank Drebin, The Naked Gun |
August 21, 2008, 02:34 PM | #41 |
Member
Join Date: August 9, 2008
Location: Pretoria, South Africa
Posts: 89
|
Saab911
But more to the point, would the attackers you mention be scared away
when you simply rack the pump on your shotgun? This is Pretoria, South Africa. He is a trained terrorist, you are a law abiding citizen. They come into your home, having the initiative. The AK's or 9mm's are cocked and aimed at you or your kids or your wife. Merely racking your pump shall have no intimidating result. If you do not shoot as a first action, they shall. No. there is no reason for dramatics. Only immediate and hard and violent action. The perpetrators, being who they are and from which principle they operate expects immediate surrender or an equal play of showmanship. They do not expect a hard and immediate counter attack. That you can only do if you are armed and only need to pull the trigger. My Winchester Defender is loaded with slugs and I can shoot it off the hip where I want to at 6-10 m. My double action revolver is in the small of my back and I need to only pull the trigger, no cocking and saying "OK boy, put you AK down and let me straighten you out." Then, on top of this, when the police come to investigate the crime after you have shot and killed the main threat, they charge you with murder and lock you up until your innocence is proved. No kidding.
__________________
"Do you not know that all human ills and mean-spiritedness and cowardice arise not from death but from fear of death? Against this therefor fortify yourself....then you shall find that by this alone are men made free." |
August 21, 2008, 02:54 PM | #42 |
Member
Join Date: August 9, 2008
Location: Pretoria, South Africa
Posts: 89
|
East Africa...
"We also try to take good care of our house staff (they have been with us for many years) and make sure we stay friendly and close with the neighbors".
Good, that; but in each instance where my friends were killed in what was Rhodesia, and here now in South Africa, it was the loyal house staff that either willingly or under threat of death supplied ALL the information. Who is the insider in any event? That is the reason in SA households do not have house staff anymore. I lived in Nairobi for a year and was robbed at gunpoint in my rented property. My "security guard" just happened to suddenly ask for leave for the weekend...
__________________
"Do you not know that all human ills and mean-spiritedness and cowardice arise not from death but from fear of death? Against this therefor fortify yourself....then you shall find that by this alone are men made free." |
August 21, 2008, 03:04 PM | #43 |
Member
Join Date: August 9, 2008
Location: Pretoria, South Africa
Posts: 89
|
Springmom (rather nice, that!)
"...that, despite all the time we spend worrying about being armed 24/7/365, most of us live in what is the safest country in the world, with the lowest possibility of personal violence...."
Why does the USA have such a safe society? Why did South Africa used to have an even safer society? Because of the love of guns, the general ownership, and the knowledge and skill of how to use them. We are being disarmed at the moment with new and silly gun laws. Some of us still have our guns and go through the most unthinkable rigmarole to keep them licenced and in our posession. You live in a democratic country, we do not. Stick to your guns in every sense of the term.
__________________
"Do you not know that all human ills and mean-spiritedness and cowardice arise not from death but from fear of death? Against this therefor fortify yourself....then you shall find that by this alone are men made free." |
August 21, 2008, 03:10 PM | #44 |
Senior Member
Join Date: December 20, 2004
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 170
|
I trained my dog to bark like the sound of my Remington 870 being racked.
|
August 21, 2008, 03:31 PM | #45 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: July 1, 2008
Location: Los Angeles, Kalifornia
Posts: 1,176
|
Quote:
European Countries, and so on. The U.S. has one of the highest incidence of violent crime in the industrialized world. |
|
August 21, 2008, 03:45 PM | #46 | |
Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: June 25, 2008
Location: Austin, CO
Posts: 19,578
|
Quote:
I think the reason those other countries have lower rates in because guns are essentially non-existent to good and evil folk.
__________________
Nobody plans to screw up their lives... ...they just don't plan not to. -Andy Stanley |
|
August 21, 2008, 04:09 PM | #47 | |
Junior member
Join Date: April 6, 2008
Location: Spartanburg, SC
Posts: 2,933
|
Quote:
As has been mentioned, large, densely populated city areas are quite different from rural or farmland. |
|
August 21, 2008, 05:10 PM | #48 |
Junior member
Join Date: December 16, 1998
Location: Titusville, FL, USA
Posts: 1,030
|
The claim assumes the badguy is in his right mind. He may be completely irrational.
He may be drunk, drugged, psychotic or any combination and not act like a "normal" person. Don't fall into the trap of believing the badguy has the mental capacity to rationalize. |
August 21, 2008, 05:16 PM | #49 |
Senior Member
Join Date: December 10, 2005
Posts: 707
|
Instant laxative, take your laptop into the bathroom and open link.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YoN2jTURi_k |
August 21, 2008, 05:21 PM | #50 |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 22, 2007
Location: The shores of Lake Huron
Posts: 4,783
|
Well, as far as murder goes the US of A ranks 24th in the world per capita. South Africa ranks 2nd behind only Colombia. (Not surprising this was 1st) I spent some vacation time in Venezuela quite a while ago, and hated it, as it scared the crap out of me. I also wasn't surprised it was ranked 4th. 3rd wasn't much of a surprise either, as I've always heard to stay in the resort areas of Jamaica if you want to keep your skin. We ventured as far as Ferngully while we were in Jamaica, but we were with an entire group and were whisked back to Ocho Rios, post haste. A trip to Kingston to "see how the people live, mon" as the cab drivers would like from every tourist, is completely out of the question. Biggest surprise for me? Ireland is ranked 55th which is 11 spots better than Canada.
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cr...ers-per-capita
__________________
Stevie-Ray Join the NRA/ILA I am the weapon; my gun is a tool. It's regrettable that with some people those descriptors are reversed. |
|
|