Washington DC Council to Enact Sweeping New Gun Laws Tomorrow - Page 3

zukiphile · July 16, 2008, 10:21 AM

Quote:

Has ANYONE been prosecuted for violating the past statutes in D.C.?

I would be interested to know whether Carl Rowan was prosecuted.

Carl Rowan retired in the 1980s iirc. He, a DC resident, was a journalist and high profile proponent of gun control/banning. He heard kids swimming in his pool one night and shot at least one of them with his illegally kept and unregistered handgun.

brickeyee · July 16, 2008, 11:36 AM

Quote:

I would be interested to know whether Carl Rowan was prosecuted.

Carl Rowan retired in the 1980s iirc. He, a DC resident, was a journalist and high profile proponent of gun control/banning. He heard kids swimming in his pool one night and shot at least one of them with his illegally kept and unregistered handgun.

Rowan walked.
The elites in DC get a pass.:barf:

Musketeer · July 16, 2008, 11:42 AM

Quote:

Has ANYONE been prosecuted for violating the past statutes in D.C.?

That is a point of legalese I have never fully understood or agreed with what I have understood.

As explained to me, by Wayne LaPierre in person while discussing NO and the Katrina confiscations, in order to challenge something there must be proof that people are being acted against. To challenge a law one must prove it is being enforced.

That is ridiculous. The very principal that an unjust law exists should be grounds enough to challenge it. Why should a law abiding person have to run afoul of the law to challenge it when the law abiding people generally avoid running afoul of the law in the first place?

Any legal explanation would be appreciated.

Socrates · July 16, 2008, 12:06 PM

The court, in an ideal world, is a last resort. The belief is that a full litigation in the lower court provides fact finding on issues, and, that the lower court is closer to the evidence, and, the discovery is much better, and more timely. I think this part is correct.

You can file for an injunction, and, this maybe the fastest way to challenge the DC stuff, that the requirements violate the 2A, etc. on many different basis. It's likely that if the first Federal judge doesn't see it that way, the appellate court will.

Thanks to Bush, and Reagan, the Appellate division in D.C. is packed with conservative appointed judges, hoping to move to the S.C. NOT a good place for antis to be trying their Unconstitutional laws.

We could also all ask our congress people to act, and step in and stop the D.C. laws. Congress has direct jurisdiction over this area, as well.

brickeyee · July 16, 2008, 03:35 PM

Quote:

That is ridiculous. The very principal that an unjust law exists should be grounds enough to challenge it. Why should a law abiding person have to run afoul of the law to challenge it when the law abiding people generally avoid running afoul of the law in the first place?

A very touchy legal issue.
To bring suite you must have standing.
One way is by being charged under the statute.
Other ways are much more difficult but do exist.
Heller got standing since he tried to register his gun and was declined.

We do not allow anyone to decide they can challenge a law whenever they want.

Musketeer · July 16, 2008, 03:44 PM

Quote:

We do not allow anyone to decide they can challenge a law whenever they want.

and that is the problem. Laws by their nature are oppressive. Any citizen who obeys the law is oppressed but in obeying the law looses standing to challenge it.

It is like two people playing chicken. The only problem is Joe Citizen is on a Vespa Scooter and the U.S. Gov't is driving an M1 Tank. The citizen needs to HOPE that the Gov't chooses NOT to enforce the unjust law when there is little reason for them not to.

GPossenti · July 16, 2008, 03:44 PM

A written exam? I didn't know the 2nd amendment required a gun owner to be able to read. Hell, the 2nd amendment doesn't require them to be overly intelligent either. We enjoy this right because we are Americans, not because we are literate or smart, but because we are born here.

Will the written exam be in Spanish?

azredhawk44 · July 16, 2008, 03:52 PM

Quote:

We enjoy this right because we are Americans, not because we are literate or smart, but because we are born here.

Close, but not quite right.

We enjoy this right because We The People are endowed by our Creator with certain inalienable rights. We enumerated and acknowledged those rights with our system of government that we created under our authority as We The People.

All men enjoy this right. They just have to take up arms against those who would curtail this right in order to re-affirm it.

Brett Bellmore · July 16, 2008, 04:16 PM

So, anybody heard what sort of gun Heller plans on trying to register? Given that the Supreme court directly ordered D.C. to register it?

I'm thinking that, since D.C. has made it so hard to buy firearms in the District, and anybody trying to use that amnesty to challenge the semi-auto ban is going to be at least somewhat compromised by the fact that they have to admit to having broken the law to make use of it, that what is really needed is for somebody to move to the District already owning a semi-automatic pistol.

Playboypenguin · July 16, 2008, 05:00 PM

Every single politician or council member that signs off on such a thing should be removed from office for neglect of duty. They should at the very least be held financially accountable/liable for the massive tax payer cost of defending the multiple lawsuits to which this type of game playing leads. All the money which will be wasted on losing court battle could have gone to maintain parks, fund schools, etc.

RDak · July 16, 2008, 07:24 PM

Quote:

Above, someone asked why Gura chose the DC law to challenge. He did so in order to avoid the question of whether the 2d Am. is subject to incorporation.

Quote:
This court is going to follow both this precedent, as well as the Heller decision, in interpreting the constitutionality of any new laws. Sure, the mayor can appeal past them again to the SC, but the SC is highly unlikely to agree to hear another, similar case and be toyed with.

Unless the composition of the court changes, and they want to revisit the question in order to give a different answer.

You're right. It got our "foot in the door" so to speak and we really did well IMHO.

It's been forty years since the 1968 Gun Control Act was passed and we took alot of hits during the interim IMHO.

The 2nd Amendment now stands for an individual right and self-defense is included in that individual right. To me, that is something that makes me smile all over.

It's a dream of a lifetime.

July 16, 2008, 04:16 PM	#59
Brett Bellmore Senior Member Join Date: March 17, 1999 Location: Capac, MI, USA Posts: 1,927	So, anybody heard what sort of gun Heller plans on trying to register? Given that the Supreme court directly ordered D.C. to register it? I'm thinking that, since D.C. has made it so hard to buy firearms in the District, and anybody trying to use that amnesty to challenge the semi-auto ban is going to be at least somewhat compromised by the fact that they have to admit to having broken the law to make use of it, that what is really needed is for somebody to move to the District already owning a semi-automatic pistol. __________________ Sic semper tyrannis!

July 16, 2008, 12:06 PM	#54
Socrates Junior member Join Date: January 5, 2005 Location: East Bay NorCal, People's Republik of Kalifornia Posts: 5,866	The court, in an ideal world, is a last resort. The belief is that a full litigation in the lower court provides fact finding on issues, and, that the lower court is closer to the evidence, and, the discovery is much better, and more timely. I think this part is correct. You can file for an injunction, and, this maybe the fastest way to challenge the DC stuff, that the requirements violate the 2A, etc. on many different basis. It's likely that if the first Federal judge doesn't see it that way, the appellate court will. Thanks to Bush, and Reagan, the Appellate division in D.C. is packed with conservative appointed judges, hoping to move to the S.C. NOT a good place for antis to be trying their Unconstitutional laws. We could also all ask our congress people to act, and step in and stop the D.C. laws. Congress has direct jurisdiction over this area, as well.

July 16, 2008, 03:44 PM	#57
GPossenti Senior Member Join Date: April 24, 2008 Location: Louisiana Posts: 295	A written exam? I didn't know the 2nd amendment required a gun owner to be able to read. Hell, the 2nd amendment doesn't require them to be overly intelligent either. We enjoy this right because we are Americans, not because we are literate or smart, but because we are born here. Will the written exam be in Spanish?

July 16, 2008, 05:00 PM	#60
Playboypenguin Junior member Join Date: February 27, 2006 Location: Great Pacific Northwest Posts: 11,515	Every single politician or council member that signs off on such a thing should be removed from office for neglect of duty. They should at the very least be held financially accountable/liable for the massive tax payer cost of defending the multiple lawsuits to which this type of game playing leads. All the money which will be wasted on losing court battle could have gone to maintain parks, fund schools, etc.