Help me with a 2nd ammendment issue debate on this forum.

[MitchSchaft]

This site is basically and off topic type of board where any kind of discussion is allowed. I can feel a 2nd ammendment type of argument starting to brew up and am asking for you guys' backup. If you know laws/statistics from Mexico, please help me out here. This would be my first stand-off when it comes to a firearms banning issue and I could use all the help I can get.
This thread basically started when the whole Germany shooting came about. Then, this guy from Mexico started posting about how they need to ban guns and how he's proud of his country for banning guns. Anyway, check it out when you get a chance and give me some suggestions or make some actual posts yourself. I would really appreciate it.

[MitchSchaft]

Thx, man

[Thumper]

This might be fun.

Come on in, folks...the water's warm. Registering is also pretty painless.

[jimpeel]

Here are your stats.

Source: http://www.guncite.com/gun_control_gcgvinco.html

Rates per 100,000

Country------Homicide---Rate--firearms

South Africa--75.30----------26.60

Colombia------64.60----------50.60

Estonia-------28.21-----------8.07

Brazil--------19.04----------10.58

Mexico--------17.58-----------9.88

Philippines---16.20-----------3.50

Taiwan---------8.12-----------0.97

N. Ireland-----6.09-----------5.24

United States--5.70-----------3.72

Note that the homicide rate for tthe United Sates is 5.7/100,000 overall and 3.72/100,000 for firearms specific homicides.

Mexico has a homicide rate of 17.58/100,000 overall and 9.88/100,000 for firearm specific homicides.

Ask him how proud he is of that.

[MitchSchaft]

You guys are awesome.

[jimpeel]

that was at my fingertips because I had just used it at another board where SkySlash was having some trouble with the local aristocracy.

http://arstechnica.infopop.net/OpenT...562&f=28609695

[MitchSchaft]

I know that place, jim

[Jim March]

OK, you wanna put a SERIOUS crimp in this guy Luis' style?

I don't have time to go do it myself, but here's your ammo, fire when ready:

Start with the US Department Of State travel advisories for Mexico:

http://travel.state.gov/mexico.html

Quote from it liberally and in depth. You'll see what I mean. Be sure and include the source URL. THIS is his "gun free paradise" - it's uuuugly.

This article:

http://www.solutionsabroad.com/a_security.asp

...talks about the crime rates, and mentions that per-capita murder rates (across Mexico) are actually less than in some US cities - WashDC is mentioned. But this is a silly comparison, because DC is one of two cities (the other being Chicago) where handguns and legally armed self defense is completely banned and the two trade off on a regular basis for the title of "most dangerous city in the US".

As long as you mention that proviso, it's good ammo.

In 1997, some people on the pro-gun side tried to work out comparative national murder rates into a chart:

http://www.gunfacts.org/international.htm

Two obvious problems: since getting this data is HARD as hell, they were only able to get one year's worth - and in some cases, not even the same year (although I don't think that matters too much, they could be accused of "selecting the right years" to get the results they wanted).

More good data: http://www.guncite.com/gun_control_gcgvintl.html - this covers different years than the comparison above, but the net conclusions one might draw (and the CRAZY violence levels in Mexico) are still obvious.

The Guncite pages include links to their scholarly and governmental source data, most of which is online. The best of these is from the International Journal of Epidemiology, published in *Britain*:

http://ije.oupjournals.org/cgi/reprint/27/2/214.pdf

Mexican gun-death-data is included, and will blow Luis totally out of the water!!!

I managed to find an article by a VP of a major insurance company, on how to underwrite the risk to overseas travellers. It includes a short table of the danger level of various cities:

http://www.urmia.org/Report/1&2-00-E...Unexpected.htm

As you can see, Mexico City's ranking of "6" is higher (worse crime) than the "5s" pulled by New York and LA - and those two towns pretty much ban all legal street-carry (to a handful of very rich and influential), and NYC radically limits the number of handguns owned at homes.

In other words, it backs up the "gunnie data" to a "T".

Feel free to plagarize my words, or prep up your own post with this data.

Jim

[C.R.Sam]

Jim be awesome.

Sam

[DMK]

Country------Homicide---Rate--firearms

South Africa--75.30----------26.60



I don't know about Mexico, but I sure as heck am not going to be wandering around South Africa unarmed! Although I hear their laws are pretty draconian also.

[MitchSchaft]

How do you guys think I did?

[Thumper]

Hey!

I helped!

[MitchSchaft]

Yeah, you initiated it. I think you did a good job.

[jimpeel]

You killed the thread over there. You think they are stewing in their own juices so their hands don't work to type a response?

I just ran some clown's shorts up the flagpole over at arstechnica http://arstechnica.infopop.net/OpenT...444#7110977444

[MitchSchaft]

That's a good idea! I'm gonna steal that idea, too!

[MitchSchaft]

I need your help again, quick! I'm being challenged and I really don't know how to answer. Same thread as posted above.

[MitchSchaft]

my cover is blown!