Help with Lehigh 90 grain Xtreme Defense Bullets

[Blazing_Oaks]

Hello-

Needing some help figuring out what I am doing wrong with my .355 90 grain Xtreme Defense Bullets. I am relatively new to reloading having only done it for about a year and a half so any advice would be appreciated.

Some context:

Made my first small test batch with them, using 5.5 grains of CFE Pistol, CCI Small Pistol Primer 500, and the 90 grain XD bullets with a COL of 1.100. Worked great so I went on and made another batch 60 rounds, which also worked great - 100% success with both batches.

Fast forward 1 month and I got to make another batch of 100, using the same recipe, shooting the same gun (M&P Shield). Nothing but problems - had some primers that wouldn't ignite, the rounds that did ignite wouldn't properly cycle the gun, and had constant jams.

So I went and disassembled the bullets and re-did everything. Double checked the primers were seated correctly, double checked the powder load was correct, double checked the COL, etc. The Re-done batch preformed even worse than the first- even ended up with several squib roads in the barrel. Yet everything appears to be in spec when I triple checked everything.

So set that project aside and made a bunch of 124 grain JHPs using the same primers, the same cases, the same powder, shot out of the same gun. All worked perfectly, no problems. So it does not appear to be a case of bad powder, bad primers, or the firearm.

Decided instead of redoing the failed 90 grain XD batch for the 3rd time, I would start new to see if I could pinpoint what was going on. Made more brand new ones today and still had issues - most wouldn't cycle properly and they burned super dirty. Even tried messing with the load from 5.5-5.9 grains and the COL from 1.100 to 1.125 with no success.

At this point I'm stumped. All my reloads using the SAME components, minus the 90 gr XD bullets work fine. My MP Shield seems to be working fine too with no issues. Plus I don't get why the first two batches using the recipe worked fine but now I get nothing but failures.

Any ideas what I am doing wrong?

[Marco Califo]

CFE Pistol is known for leaving residue due to incomplete burning.
So you are using a very slow powder to push a relatively light bullet. Many people have tried magnum SPP.
I load Barnes 95 gr Copper bullets in 9mm Luger, for Velocity. Auto Comp and Silhouette. CFE Pistol is up there in velocity, but leaves residue.

[stagpanther]

Just so happens they are some of my favorite bullets for 9mm loads. I find it alarming that a load that formerly worked great for you could produce repeated squibs--something major bad is going on here and I find it unlikely it's a choice of powder/primers etc that went from great to almost catastrophic failure. Some firearms have problems chambering the shape of XD bullets, but it sounds like that wasn't a problem with your's--at least at first.

My wild guess is that somewhere along the way your bullets might not have been gripped tightly enough and may have moved around--1.1" is pretty short compared to the standard 1.16" and the bullet may have started too soon or maybe even parted company with case entirely upon chambering (?)--one of the only ways I can come up with for reducing the pressure so much the bullet lodges in the bore.

[Shadow9mm]

According to Lehighs load data.

Listed COL 1.105

CFE pistol Start is 5.5g, Max is 6.1g

https://lehighdefense.com/ld-load-data

What comes to mind to me, is improper neck tension (sizing issue) and or improper crimp. Either could cause bullet setback during feeding which could cause jams. It could also allow gas leakage a reduce pressure causing an inconsistent or incomplete powder burn. could explain all your issues.

[Blazing_Oaks]

Thanks for the replies.

I think you might be on to something with the improper neck tension and/or improper crimp.

That is one factor I had not considered and it would explain the issues I am having.

What would be the best way to verify and then correct this problem?

[stagpanther]

I have also used longshot with these and have had very good results, especially long range through my PCC carbine. I also tend to wander into the +p+ zone a bit since I like to use shellshock cases. Lehigh also makes a .355 extreme penatrator in 90 gr for 380 auto; presumably a slightly smaller diameter than the xtreme defender--just thought I'd throw that out there to make sure you might not be using those instead.

[74A95]

Originally Posted by stagpanther

Lehigh also makes a .355 extreme penatrator in 90 gr for 380 auto; presumably a slightly smaller diameter than the xtreme defender--just thought I'd throw that out there to make sure you might not be using those instead.

Why would the .355 Xtreme penetrator in 90 gr for the 380 auto be a smaller diameter than the Xtreme defender?

[stagpanther]

Why would the .355 Xtreme penetrator in 90 gr for the 380 auto be a smaller diameter than the Xtreme defender?

Good question--the 380 auto bullets I have (I don't use the 90 gr x penatrators but do use the smaller ones) appear to have a heel for inside the case of .354 and a bearing surface of .355--whereas the ones designated 9mm are .355 throughout.

[stagpanther]

Just out of curiousity I called Lehigh to verify some info--and in the process also found out some very interesting new info. Lehigh apparently was purchased by and brought under the roof of Wilson Combat--so when you call for support that is who you will end up talking to. I asked about the .380 acp bullets and those remain unmodified since the buy-out (there was also a shuffling of principal bullet developers) and do have a taper for inside the case--but that shouldn't be an issue if the OP used the 9mm defender. I can also add they are eager to help with any issues anyone may be having with their bullets and I think it would be a great idea for the OP to call them.

[74A95]

Since the bearing surface of both bullets is .355, they are the same diameter.

[stagpanther]

Since the bearing surface of both bullets is .355, they are the same diameter.

The OP possibly has a neck tension issue--and that could possibly be explained if one of the 380 auto solids is used. Strictly speaking--yes; calling it "diameter" without specifically mentioning the part of the bullet that fits inside the case could be construed as stating as smaller bullet diameter over-all. I get the need for precision.

[Blazing_Oaks]

Good idea, I'll contact them. I double checked and I am using the 9mm defender, not the 380 bullets.

[stagpanther]

Good idea, I'll contact them. I double checked and I am using the 9mm defender, not the 380 bullets.

No worries then about the bullet being a bit loose--unless maybe the case itself may have been belled and then not crimped enough. But multiple squibbs would scare the daylight out of me. I use a lot of those as well so I'm kinda worried too though I've never had any problems with them in my guns.

[stagpanther]

I have used that same load recipe and have had very good results with it--but since it is published on their website after testing them it's probably a good idea to discuss your issues with them.

[stagpanther]

Sorry to drag this one out--but I'm kinda curious--to the OP: when you had the squibbs--were the bullets immediately in front of the chamber so that the next cartridge could not go into battery and be fired?

[Blazing_Oaks]

They were a little further than that - the next round barely couldn't chamber. So I don't think it was an issue of just the primer going off and not the powder?

As soon as I get a free day I plan to go through and double check and reset all my dies - especially the crimp die - and see if that solves the issue.

I have a feeling the neck tension problem is the source of my woes.

[stagpanther]

They were a little further than that - the next round barely couldn't chamber. So I don't think it was an issue of just the primer going off and not the powder?

As soon as I get a free day I plan to go through and double check and reset all my dies - especially the crimp die - and see if that solves the issue.

I have a feeling the neck tension problem is the source of my woes.

Not a whole lot of powder in 9mm to begin with--not too much more than a 22lr by weight. I had a squib like that once but luckily I caught it because the ignition report sounded noticeably different. Even commercial ammo I buy sometimes has extensive signs of gas leaking and running down the side of the ejected case.