10 mm vs. .45 for home defense

[RevJim]

Christmas is coming and I am developing that "itch." If our comrade is elected President, I am afraid prices of guns may go up. So I am trying to make my decision a little sooner than Christmas!

What caliber would be better in my situation for home defense: the 10 mm or .45? I have three young children whose rooms are at the front of the house, whereas my bedroom is at the back, but on the same side. I live in a neighborhood with houses all around. The closest house is 50 feet away. I currently have a 10-round .40 pistol, but I would like to increase the magazine capacity. I have read that the 10 mm will do everything the .40 will do, but so much more! So if I am going to buy a new weapon, why not go with the 10 mm!

I have a narrow hand with long fingers (I am 6'-2" and 170 lbs.). I have a small .40, so I am somewhat used to recoil. I would not be looking to carry this as a concealed weapon, nor am I looking to spend $1,000.

Which caliber would you recommend?

Jim

[BanditSRT8]

Maybe my thoughts are a bit antiquated, but I would never, ever consider a 10mm for a home defense weapon. I L-O-V-E 10mm for the range or even personal defense, but one of the reasons I love it is because it is such a devastating round with great penetration. Not ideal for the home though. Especially with a bunch of people living in the house with you.

I'm a "shotgun is the ONLY option for home defense" guy.

Call me paranoid.

[Webleymkv]

Your only two options for a high capacity 10mm would be a Glock (either 20 or 29) or EAA Witness. All the other handguns currently made in 10mm are either a single stack (lots of 1911's) or a revolver (S&W 610).You would have a much larger variety of pistols to choose from in .45 as almost every manufacterer makes one. Ammo cost and availability is another consideration. While 10mm can be had for tolerable prices ($17/box is the cheapest I've found online), it's not something you can run down to Wal-Mart and pick up a box of WWB on a whim. A well stocked gun shop should have ammo in stock, but you can expect to pay $20-30/box of 50 for Remington, CCI Blazer, or American Eagle FMJ. In order to get true full power 10mm, you'll have to order it from Buffalo Bore or Double Tap. Federal Hydra-Shoks are basically .40S&W level and Winchester Silvertips or Cor-Bons are basically warm .357 Magnum level. Now, if you're willing to deal with ammo costs and/or reload, the 10mm is a wonderful cartridge. While it is more penatrative than the .45, either one has plenty of overpenetration potential so I wouldn't worry too much about it.

[Deaf Smith]

Jim,

How good a shot are you? Are you going to practice enough to be effective with the 10mm or .45?

I've owned several 10mm and a bunch of .45s. But unless you reload or have understudy handguns (.22s that feel the same as the bigger ones) you will find it's hard to practice alot with either 10mm or .45.

If you get, say the 10mm, I heartly suggest a Dillion Square deal 'B' set up for 10mm. You can then practice quite a bit with your Christmas present.

[basbol13]

Go with a Remington 870 18" barrel and 00 and you won't go wrong. 6 shells ,8 .30 cal. pellets / shell by my calculations, that's 48 rounds. Is that high enough capacity for you?

[Harry Callahan]

I have both in my rotation, a S&W Model 1006 and a S&W Model 4506-1. Both use the same frame and feel great in my hand. I feel very comfortable with either. If you're going to use them for HD definitely use hollow points, so as not to overpenetrate. As previously stated there is nothing like a shotgun for HD but some feel more comfortable with a pistol. As long as you're proficient shooting with it, to each his own.

[basbol13]

Hi Harry
I just wanted to let you know that in the film Dirty Harry, Clint Eastwood is carrying was a model 57 in .41 mag. not a .44mag model 29

[JerryS1]

I love my S&W 1006 10mm, but it's not what I use for home defense. I have an IWB holster that I attached to the back of my nightstand which holds a Glock 22. Sixteen rounds of .40 should be enough to get me to my 12 gauge and a full ammo belt of 00 buck.

You might consider a larger .40 magazine and a grip extension....I believe they have extensions for the 13 and 15 round glock .40 magazines that work with the Glock 27......I have a 13 round mag with an extension that will fit on my glock 27. That gives me the choice of small, medium or high capacity depending on the situation.

Personally, I'd stay with the glock 27 a couple high capacity mags and grip extension......buy a mossberg shotgun with an 18" barrel and have plenty of money left over for ammo or accessories (like a knox special ops stock and a tactical light for the shotgun). JMHO.

Jerry

[Smaug]

I vote 45.

Since you're in TX, your attackers aren't likely to be wearing heavy clothing, so I'd recommend Glaser blue ammo, at least for the first 6 rounds.

You can find testing on them at theboxotruth.com (I think that's right)

[Socrates]

I get really sick of people telling me 10mm over penetrates.
Here are the HOTTEST 10mm loads I know of, commercially.
DoubleTap .40 S&W Penetration / expansion
135gr. Nosler JHP @ 1375fps - 12.10" / .72"
155gr Gold Dot JHP @ 1275fps - 13.00" / .76"
165gr Gold Dot JHP @ 1200fps - 14.0" / .70"
180gr Gold Dot JHP @ 1100fps - 14.75" / .68"
200gr XTP @ 1050fps - 17.75" / .59"
DoubleTap 10mm
135gr JHP @ 1600fps - 11.0" / .70" frag nasty
155gr Gold Dot JHP @ 1475fps - 13.5" / .88"
165gr Gold Dot JHP @ 1400fps - 14.25" / 1.02"
165gr Golden Saber JHP @ 1425fps - 14.75" / .82"
180gr Golden Saber JHP @ 1330fps - 16.0" / .85"
180gr XTP @ 1350fps – 17.25” / .77”
180gr Gold Dot JHP @ 1300fps - 15.25" / .96"
200gr XTP @ 1250fps - 19.5" / .72"
230gr Equalizer @ 1040fps - 11.0" and 17.0" / .62" and .40"
The XTP's are the ONLY loads that look like they really penetrate a ton, and, they really don't go that far...considering the size of the guys around here...

If you look at these figures, you really don't need another gun. Just use double tap 40 ammo, and get a big mag for your gun.

[BillCA]

I'd stick with the .45 ACP standard velocity 185g to 230g ammo. Not only is it readily available, the lower velocity reduces the overpenetration hazard.

I like the 10mm, but most of the commercial loadings are glorified .40 S&W loads. It is not the fire-breather that the original 10mm loading was (a 200g FMJ at 1200 fps). And in the confines of your home, the full-house 10mm loads are overkill.

Using hollowpoints (of most any caliber) might make a difference on soft targets, however when penetrating sheetrock or plaster, they simply tend to fill up with material and act as FMJ. A standard velocity .45 ACP does not typically overpenetrate and when it does, the velocity is much lower.

In addition, if the spam hits the rotating air-mover, .45ACP ammo is common enough to find almost anywhere. And there is the useful argument that many police use the .45 ACP, which avoids some prosecutorial arguments.

To play devil's advocate for a moment, your existing .40 S&W 10-round pistol would be entirely adequate for HD. Most home defense shootings result in less than 4 rounds fired (would you stay if a homeowner was banging away at you?) As far as wall penetration is concerned, any round that is a fight-stopper will, by definition, penetrate sheetrock walls. You have to plan accordingly to reduce the risk to others.

[hoytinak]

Since I picked up my Glock 20 it's replaced my 17 as my nightstand gun. I keep it loaded with DoubleTap 180gr Gold Dots.

[zebulonsmith]

Find a gun in either caliber that you can shoot well and go with that. A .22 can drop a man in one shot if you can shoot it right. .45 and 10mm are both very potent handgun rounds, the deciding factor would be your aim.

[AZAK]

Both! .45 Auto and 10mm. One for each floor of the house.

Agree with the shotgun as a nice HD. And a couple of dogs too.

Also agree with if you are looking for a fight stopper, it will penetrate sheetrock.

[Stevie-Ray]

If you get, say the 10mm, I heartly suggest a Dillion Square deal 'B' set up for 10mm. You can then practice quite a bit with your Christmas present.

Better yet, get the SDB in one caliber, and buy an extra toolhead and dieset for the other like I did. Because whichever one you get, you'll eventually want the other, trust me.

For pure HD, I recommend and use .45 ACP. But I love my 10mm, also. My Delta Elite will be getting a Glock 29 companion for Christmas this year. It will be my main "vacation" gun.

[Officer's Match]

I like the 10 because I tend to like speed.

[mdell2]

I love the 10mm and have the Glock 29 but for what you are looking for, I would go with the 45 with some frangable loads so as not to penetrate one of the kids rooms. It will do the job on a bad guy but won't over penetrate and possibly hurt someone else. I agree that a shotgun for the home is best or even the Taurus "Judge" revolver that shoots 410 shotgun shells. Merry x-mas!

[Striker071]

I dont understand what is wrong with the .40 Caliber you have....? Capacity should not be a deciding factor... if you cant get it done in 2 or 3 shots you better go with option number 3. Get a big dog and have it sleep in the kids room. 870 pump 12 gauge with 00 buckshot... that might run you 400 bucks with the ammo.... Just think you have more options. If you (WANT) a 45 or 10mm then thats a different story. I always say get what you shoot well and what feels comfortable in your hand. In my opinion the 2 are closely connected. some people pick up a ruger and say that feels nice.... or a glock or a sig. If it feels like a natural extention of your hand and you practice with it ...you will shoot it well.

[RickB]

.45. The advantage in external ballistics of the 10mm won't translate to greater terminal performance inside a house. There are lots more choices in self-defense guns and ammo in .45. If you were shooting at some in the pasture yonder, then the 10 might be the better choice.

[Socrates]

OK. I'm getting real sick of people not reading Double taps loads in my posts. They allow you to tailor your ammunition to ANY situation, be it light fast, or heavier and more penetration. If 125 grains, at 1450, in 357 is such a great stopper, how about either a 135 .40 at 1350, or at 1600 fps???? The round does NOT penetrate well, but, leaves a spectacular hole...

[AZAK]

OK. I'm getting real sick of people not reading Double taps loads in my posts.

I read all of the info, and appreciate your input. (Take a breathe big boy!)

I am just glad that where I live, I don't really have to worry about "over penetration". The OP may have different concerns/interests than you or I.

I am a huge fan of the 10mm and recently started reloading for it. I also have a stockpile of "original type" factory loadings, including Cor Bon Penetrators; not the recent loads.

Regardless of what caliber, if I had three sleeping kids just on the other side of the sheetrock and neighbors 50 feet away, I might think differently about this topic.

[Firepower!]

10mm...everything that 45 can do but better.

[Musketeer]

I have a 10mm, reload for it, carry it with Double Tap ammo, and love it.

For home defense 10mm, 40, 45, 38+P, 9mm+P, 357Sig, 357Mag or any cartridge of a power level equal to or greater than 38+P with modern reliable expanding ammunition will work fine.

If you are concerned about over penetration look to the Double Tap 135grain load. That very closely replicates the vaunted Federal 357mag 125grain JHP (actually exceeding it) with only 11-12" of penetration, explosive expansion and manageable recoil.

Note: Any handgun round, and any serious defensive shotgun round, will penetrate sheet rock.

[BanditSRT8]

Socrates.. stop taking it personally. We're sick of hearing how sick you are.

The main issue for many of us is not that the round will overpenetrate and exit the human target... but that a missed shot will go through the walls and kill our sleeping children.

Yes, this is an extremely high probability with such a powerful round, I don't care what ammo you think is best.

This is why myself, and many others, prefer to use ONLY a shotgun for home defense scenarios. I would gladly carry 10mm for personal defense, but I will not use any handgun at all as my first choice for home defense.

[Sevens]

A couple points I'd like to make relevant to this discussion:

1) Not everyone is going to agree with the "shotgun for home defense" argument. A shotgun has a long barrel which severely limits your mobility and gives a close quarters attacker something to grab a hold of. It's also a two-hand weapon. If it works for you-- GREAT! But the OP didn't start a thread asking "10, .45 or 12 gauge?" Shotgun for HD is a whole different debate topic. Don't answer a handgun question with "Go buy a Chevy!"

2) Slinging bullets in every direction with children and all angles of the house? There's no firearm you can employ here that doesn't threaten them. Find a way to move the fight corridor to another level of the house instead of pulling out exterior ballistics charts to determine the distance and velocity your slugs will have when they start bouncing off headboards, eh? If there is a question, YOU DON'T PULL THE TRIGGER if you don't want to risk the children. Get a knife or a baseball bat. Or a taser.