My First AD

[KPS]

Well, I finally did it.I had an accidental discharge in my home tonight.I just bought a Walther P-99 and was showing my wife how the chamber loaded indicator works.We did not see the red and the extractor seemed to be flush with the gun.Instead of decocking the gun, I pulled the trigger and it took a couple of seconds to realize I just shot the gun off.The magazine was out but I did load the gun earlier today.I've been carrying 1911's for 2 years and have always triple checked my guns before handling them.I've always been one of those people who said it couldn't happen to me.I can only thank God that the round went into the door frame and was lodged somewhere inside the wall instead of shooting a neigbor, my wife of myself.

[lonegunman]

It sounds like the loaded chamber indicator thing didnt tell you the truth.

Attempting to replace a brain with a mechanical device should seem like a bad idea to everyone, but lawyers and politicians seem to love it.

Quite interesting that this would happen with such a "modern" gun, dont you think?

Betcha never did that with your 1911....

[C.R.Sam]

Bet your wife was impressed with your ND.

Glad it not worse. Serious thinkin time tho.

Sam

[Dave P]

You are lucky! Is the wife gonna let you keep firearms in the house now?

[KPS]

You know, it's kind of ironic because the MA Attorney General won't allow new 1911's to be sold here but new Walthers are because they are safer to us consumers according to him.It's my own damn fault though because I shouldn't have loaded it until I got a chance to take it to the range tomorrow and learn all its new technological features.Fortunately the wife will let me keep firearms in the house still but I will never hear the end of it from my inlaws

[ATTICUS]

Glad to hear you're both OK. Welcome to the former "it will never happen to me club".

[jaysouth]

I've never had an AD. However i have had two ND's, that is negligent discharges. One was an incident that your's reminded me of. In 1970 I bought a new Colt GM. I loaded the gun when I got to the parking lot in front of the gun store, laid it on the seat and went about my business. A couple of days later, I finally got around to cleaning the gun. I loaded a round into the chamber via the slide release. When the slide went into battery, it discharged!! I took it to my department armorer and and asked him to check the gun over. I got the ass-chewing of a lifetime when I told him the story and attempted to label it a "gun accident" Reluctantly, I had to agree with him. Prudence would dictate that the gun be fired extensively at a range before relying upon it a defensive piece, or keeping it loaded indoors. Had I first fired the gun at a range, I would have disovered the "slam fire" feature of my new colt instead of cooking off a round in my soon-to-be-ex-girl friend's apartment. Since then I have resisted the temptation to play with any firearms before I get them to a safe place to shoot. A couple of years earlier to this incident, I cooked off a couple of rounds from a stolen black market Karl Gustav that i was attempting to repair, having never seen one before that precise moment!! Alcohol, teen age arrogance, and ignorance are a poor mix.

After a couple of decades of thinking about these incidents while continuing to handle loaded firearms on a daily basis, and seeing numerous other gun mishaps, I came to the conclusion that there are no accidental discharges, only negligent ones, at least in my case.


shoot safely


Jay

[WESHOOT2]

I handle guns-n-ammo lots; they scare the crap right out of me (still).

I check check check................

Glad, real glad, no one was hurt. Safety first.

[New_comer]

That's why I always rack the slide twice after mag release on any gun, just to be sure nothing was left behind. I know it's one rack too much, but it helps promote safety conciousness on my part.

Sorry about your door frame...

[KSFreeman]

TFL Chorus, ready? O.K. then, "All guns are always loaded!" Guns are loaded when the are empty, they are loaded on the range, they are loaded at the gunshop, they are loaded in a train, in a plane and on a boat with a goat.

Just because the silly soccermommie dohickey sez it ain't loaded, IT'S LOADED. Magic does not make you safer--training does.

1911s are against the law in the PRM? Wow, I'm an outlaw!!! Wait until I start telling chicks in bars that. I won't have any energy to read TFL after that!

Glad you are O.K. At least you followed #2! If someone gets hurt, there are always multiple violations.

[Will Beararms]

I think you have guts to post about this and I am thankful that no one was hurt but I catagorize this as a negligent discharge since I believe a the trigger on a handgun should never be pulled unless (a) you have verified and re-verified the weapon is empty and the trigger is being pulled for cleaning, function testing or cleaning or (b) you have identified a target and are aware of the surroundings to the flanks and beyond the target and intend to destroy said target. That said, it could happen to any of us.

[Will Beararms]

Funny thing We Shoot: I have been shooting for 28 years, (don't laugh CR SAM) and they still scare me too.

[Chad Young]

KPS-

Sorry dude, but you had an ND, not an AD.

An AD is where the gun fails or some external event causes the gun to fire.

Your was an ND (negligent discharge). Your finger pulled the trigger. The gun did what it was designed to do.

I am glad to hear no one was injured. I have had one true AD and a few NDs myself. Thankfully, I had the gun in a safe direction and no one got hurt. Scared the S*&t out of me though!!!

[Rovert]

Wow. Really glad to hear nobody was hurt. Probably scared the crap out of you, though. Look at the bright side. Consider the value of what you learned, and the fact that it was a lesson learned without a high price tag.

I also own a P99, and my assumption is that it can ALWAYS happen to ANY of us, so I treat my guns with the same philosophy as I do when I drive my car... buckle my seat belt, because you should always expect the unexpected.

[Arcadian62]

My First AD

Some fellow TFL'ers beat me to it on incorrect nomenclature, but again:

ACCIDENT: An unexpected and undesirable event caused by circumstances beyond the control of the participant(s). The term Accidental Discharge or AD is often improperly used to describe a Negligent Discharge or ND. (aka- Gun's fault)

NEGLIGENT DISCHARGE (ND): The unplanned discharge of a firearm caused by a failure to observe basic safety rules. Firearms related injuries or property damage are almost always due to negligent discharges, not accidents. (aka- Shooter's fault)

Good thing you were consciously following this rule( I think ):
Never let the muzzle of a firearm point at anything you are not willing to destroy.

We are all human and s**t happens. Hopefully it will harden you in the future, and serve as a lesson whenever you pick up a gun from now on.

[4V50 Gary]

First, I'm glad that no one was hurt. Now, let's start a defective product lawsuit against Walther for making a loaded chamber indicator that isn't obvious enough. Kidding.

[355sigfan]

That was a Negligent discharge an accident is if the gun fired without the trigger being pulled.
PAT

[Ryder]

Happened to me on a new gun which was supposed to be safe to drop the hammer on. Safety was designed to function as a hammer block. I was told it was safe to pull the trigger to decock. I was anxious to try it cause I never had a decocker before but I really didn't trust it and retreated to the basement to get away away from the family and check out the function. More fun than I ever expected! Figured out after my ears stopped ringing that I did not have the lever 100% of the way down, even though I pushed it as hard as I could but did not realize my thumb was hanging up on a ridge along the top of the slide slide.

Familiarization is a very important thing. Best performed with an empty gun. It's only negligent if you knew better. Now you know better.

[BobR]

AD.......ND.........whatever!

let's not get lost in the terminology here, a weapon was fired or fired when it was not supposed to. Whether accidental or on purpose at least the gun was not pointed at his wife, kids, etc.

I am sure a very valuable lesson was learned, and the only thing injured was the wall and his pride, for that we can all be thankful.

bob

[TheActor]

I'm glad you both survived. Frankly, loaded chamber indicators and firing pin indicators are useless and fill a niche to satisfy anti gun laws. If you follow the rules you don't need either one. Using either one requires you have your hand on the gun and if you have a gun in your hand its ALWAYS loaded and ready to fire. This is not about the gentleman who had the ND but about the laws that are endangering lawful gunowners.

[KPS]

Yes, for those of you that mentioned it, I had a ND.I never quite knew what the difference between the two were and now I know.I also ignored the first rule of "the gun is always loaded".The strange thing is that it wasn't that loud and my ears didn't ring after my adrenaline stopped rushing.That's why it took me a couple of seconds to realize the gun went off.My wife handed me the casing and then it sunk in.For those that had ND's, did you call the police?We did just because we didn't want to make any legal mistakes but the cop was very cool about the whole thing and we're thankful for that.

[Ewok_Guy]

Glad you are OK.

[355sigfan]

let's not get lost in the terminology here
END

It is a terminology thing but its also a point about taking responsibility for ones own actions. We all make mistakes yes but when we say we had an accident it takes the blame off our shoulders and we think we are less accountable. This is a bad way to think. If you were negligent admit it correct the behavior and don't do it again.
PAT

[KPS]

I was negligent and am 100% responsible for my own actions as I stated above.

Yes, for those of you that mentioned it, I had a ND.I never quite knew what the difference between the two were and now I know.I also ignored the first rule of "the gun is always loaded".

[Arcadian62]

let's not get lost in the terminology here

AD.......ND.........whatever!

Don't mean to be a smarta** newbie poster, but I don't think anyone is getting lost. Just a SIMPLE correction. It's not like we are debating nuclear physics. Do you also refer to magazines as clips?

I'll leave you with this:

"The first step to understanding is to call things by their right names."-- Lu Tse, Chinese Philospher, c. 600 BC