please post what gun you recommend ..

PPCLI 2 can. · April 9, 2006, 11:55 PM

Hello all im new to your forum
Im from Alberta , Canada ( we call it Texas north )
anywhoo

I am lookin for a handgun ( no revolvers please ) that will suit the following needs:

1 - Home protection to stop intruder / home invasion

2 - My Husky / Wolf cross dog and I spend alot of time in the woods and a few times have run into 7 - 8 foot tall grizzlies

and Moose that could walk over a small truck's hood ( honestly the moose are scarier :barf: ). luckily I was able to scare them off with noise or tread up hill in thick brush to get away but my time is comming that i meet an old / hungry grizzly or a rutting moose and the fight is on.

I had shot a beretta 92f in the army and it was the most comfortable gun i ever shot.
i shot a couple of sigs and cz's and they are nice as well.
i have been eye balling the .40 cal ( 10 mm )
which is more powerful the .45 or .40 ?

thanks in advance and keep in mind we cant buy ak 47's here as that would be my choice

1wildbill · April 10, 2006, 12:03 AM

Why not a revolver? In a magnum, plenty of choices.

Surefire_U2 · April 10, 2006, 12:09 AM

You're not going to find many semi-autos that would even be marginal defense against a bear or moose. The most powerful round that I can think of that is chambered in a common production gun is the 10mm (Glock 20). That round is effective on medium game, up to boar size, IMO....but probably would just irritate the grizzley that you describe.

If you have to have a semi-auto, get something that you are comfortable with, and it will serve you well for home defense. For bear defense, get a rifle...

enidpd804 · April 10, 2006, 01:06 AM

+1 on Surefire's post. 10mm is a great round but not enough for that kind of monster. Consider a revolver. A 44 mag would be much closer to the power you seek for bear. Still, you could use 44 spls for defense.

**44 AMP** · April 10, 2006, 01:42 AM

Mr Myagi say "Best defense, no be there!"

Beyond the aforementioned 10mm, the Desert Eagle is available in .44 Magnum and .50 Action Express. Desert Eagles are huge and heavy, going over 4 pounds unloaded. They have a very large grip and are not all that easy to hold if you have small hands. recoil of the .44 is mild compared to revolvers (more weight). Don't know anything about the .50, except it is supposed to make the .44 look puny.

For bear defense (not hunting), a 12 gauge shotgun (short/riot style) with slugs (sabot if you can get them), or a medium heavy rifle, like a Marlin .45-70, 444, or .450 Marlin would be a fair choice also. No handgun will deliver the close range punch of a 12 ga slug.

Just curious, why no revolver ?

MTMilitiaman · April 10, 2006, 02:08 AM

I carry a Glock 20 when I got hunting. A 180 gr JHP at around 1300 fps is capable of taking deer sized game and providing good protection against people and cougars. I think it would do the trick against black bears but really think there are precious few handguns applicable to grizzlies and even fewer people capable of wielding them with the skill necessary to get the job done with 600+ pounds of hair and teeth bearing down on you.

I think a 10mm Auto is about as close as you are going to find to a pistol that meets your needs. The Glock is a very fine pistol--durable, reliable, accurate, good mag capacity, lightweight, and simple--but some find the grip angle akward and/or bulky. There are other 10mms out there, most of them on the 1911 platform, but few have the reputation for out of the box reliability and service life of the Glock.

There is the Desert Eagle, which in my experience is rail gun accurate as well as extremely controllable in .44 Mag. My dad and my grandpa each have one and they have proven to be reliable and very durable. You just can't limp wrist them or shoot unjacketed ammunition through them. They are, however, rather heavy. Some might feel that if you're going to deal with the weight of a Desert Eagle or a .500 Smith or some other large monstrosity like that, you'd be better off with something along the lines of a short barreled shotgun loaded with Brennekes or a Marline Guide Gun with some Garrett or Buffalo Bore loaded solids. If you really intend to go head to head with a grizzly, I might concur.

4RHeritage · April 10, 2006, 02:33 AM

You know that AK-47s are illegal in Canada, but you don't know that carrying a handgun, or worse yet, using one for home defense, is illegal?

Sounds fishy to me. :barf:

threegun · April 10, 2006, 05:45 AM

If you are set on a (reasonably sized auto) go with the Glock 20. Use 200 grain fmj's for the deepest penetration for those animals you described. Make no mistake that the 10mm will do more than just irritate a bear and moose, it will kill them. I just hope they die before killing you. You should be looking for a revolver in 44 mag or bigger. S&W used to make a mountain revolver, 4inch light weight for backpacking, in 44 mag.

WillBrayjr · April 10, 2006, 06:17 AM

The Desert Eagle would work perfectly. A short Remington 870 12ga loaded with slugs would be best. Nothing hits harder at close range than a 12ga

TacticalDefense1911 · April 10, 2006, 06:52 AM

I would recommend a revolver, it will serve both purposes. You aren't going to find a semi-auto (other than a Desert Eagle...which is just a good looking waist of money) loaded in a caliber fit for protection against a grizzly bear. Look at the Taurus 608 with a 4" or 6" barrel (probably 4"). It is a .357 mag. (which is still a little light for a grizzly bear...load it with 180 soft points) and has an eight round cylinder capacity. When you come home from your walk load it with 125 grain JHP's for personal defense.

andymiesha · April 10, 2006, 10:32 AM

I second the other posts here. If you can go with a wheel gun in .44 mag or another magnum caliber.

isa268 · April 10, 2006, 10:55 AM

Quote:

2 - My Husky / Wolf cross dog and I spend alot of time in the woods and a few times have run into 7 - 8 foot tall grizzlies and Moose that could walk over a small truck's hood ( honestly the moose are scarier ). luckily I was able to scare them off with noise or tread up hill in thick brush to get away but my time is comming that i meet an old / hungry grizzly or a rutting moose and the fight is on.

desert eagle in .50AE!!!!!!

Tommy Vercetti · April 10, 2006, 11:12 AM

Sig 229/226 in .40 or .357 Sig

kymasabe · April 10, 2006, 12:16 PM

Buy the Ruger Alaska

Natty · April 10, 2006, 02:34 PM

12 ga pump with rifled slugs. Carry it across your back on a sling for best comfort.

If you really think a moose or griz will attack you, dont think a hangun can save you from getting the crap stomped out of you or getting shredded.

Your odds are much better with 12 gauge slugs at least 1oz.

silver-bullet · April 10, 2006, 06:17 PM

Hmmm.... well, let me ask you a question: Are you anticipating that the handgun you choose may have to DEFEND YOUR LIFE from an attacking grizzly, OR, are you anticipating that the weapon you choose should simply be powerful enough to SCARE the grizzly away?

If your answer is: "Silver, I need a weapon that should be able to defend me from an aggressive/attacking grizzly," then I echo the previous opinions that you definitely need something more powerful (a .44 magnum or .454 Casull revolver comes to mind). BUT, if you are only looking for something which might be powerful/loud enough to scare a grizzly away, or deter his intentions of snacking on you or your loved ones (and you're dead-set on getting a semiautomatic), then I would recommend a compact pistol chambered in .357 Sig. This is one of the LOUDEST auto-cartridges I've ever fired, and properly loaded, should provide greater penetration than almost ANY other autopistol round (the 10mm is good too, but there are just too few pistols out there chambered for this round). You might take a look at the Sig-Sauer p229 in .357 Sig, or the HK USP Compact. Both are world-class, and easy to carry. Best of luck!

Tommy Vercetti · April 10, 2006, 07:43 PM

If I was even remotely worried about big grizzlies then I would definitely carry a 12 gauge..like my Remington 870 but my Sig 229 would be comforting too

axslingerW · April 10, 2006, 07:43 PM

I think a handgun vs. grizzly match is going to make for a long day.

A good pair of running shoes might make more sense

A .500 magnum would be a good choice but you said no wheel guns, so...
maybe a kel-tec plr-16 with a couple of 30 round magazines?
[URL="http://www.kel-tec.com/plr16.html"]

PPCLI 2 can. · April 11, 2006, 01:32 AM

I think a handgun vs. grizzly match is going to make for a long day.

A good pair of running shoes might make more sense

too funny

i knew i was going to get the ol get a revovler answer but i hate the way they look , feel and shoot . no insult intended

You know that AK-47s are illegal in Canada, but you don't know that carrying a handgun, or worse yet, using one for home defense, is illegal?

Sounds fishy to me.
__________________

yah yah tell me one person who ownes a handgun in canada that isnt for home/personal defence and ill show you a liar. im just not chicken to say that is what its for. plus carring one in the bush is not a concern since we have no one hanging out where i go.

good posts thanks
keep em comming..
silver i agree but putting 8 slugs from an auto into a bears ass should stop him if not ill start camping with a fat guy, that way i push him down and run

stupid question though... wouldnt a 10mm be more powerful than say a .357 with the same load?

SpookBoy · April 11, 2006, 03:25 AM

Due to your situation(no Revolvers) my top two choices are...

or

Ala Dan · April 11, 2006, 03:37 AM

Probably, the two pic's posted by my friend Spook Boy are the
only two choices I would even consider against Ole' Griz or Boo Moose~!

BTW, NO handgun will deliver a fatal shot all the time; not even on the
human torso.

Silvanus · April 11, 2006, 03:46 AM

Quote:

i knew i was going to get the ol get a revovler answer but i hate the way they look , feel and shoot . no insult intended

If you really want a handgun to protect yourself and your dogs from a grizzly, I would think that the most important thing is to have enough power to at least have a chance of seriously wounding the beast. The only affordable (that excludes Desert Eagles and the Auto Mag) handguns that can give you that are revolvers. I can't imagine that there is no revolver that feels and shoots good for you. And the look is not the most important thing to consider for your situation.

tom650604 · April 11, 2006, 07:53 AM

If you want to drop a grizzley or a moose. It has to be a revolver. I can't think of a semi-auto that I would fell comfortable when up against a grizzley. Well, maybe a Desert Eagle. It has to be a 44mag or larger for a grizz IMO. Because you want to make that one shot count!

9mm1033 · April 11, 2006, 07:59 AM

I didn't know you had crime in Canada.

I'd have to agree with the other posts. An auto for man and a big revolver for animals. They may not be pretty to you, but that grizzly or moose will be dead, and you'll have a better chance of coming out alive.

Socrates · April 11, 2006, 09:47 AM

Frankly, even with a high powered revolver, your chances of stopping brown bear aren't particularly good. 60% is I think the going statistics. You might consider getting a wood replica of a hunting rifle, and sling it over your shoulder. The bears don't get huge without knowing when hunting season starts, and, what a rifle looks like.

It would be light, easy to carry, and scare the bears away. That, and carry a large boom box, playing rap music at high volume. That would be enough to get ANY mother brown bear to get her cubs away from you, and consider you an undesireable influence. Course I'm not sure, but, bears may have a more direct way of dealing with undesireables then our legal systems.

S

April 9, 2006, 11:55 PM	#1
PPCLI 2 can. Member Join Date: April 9, 2006 Posts: 24	please post what gun you recommend .. Hello all im new to your forum Im from Alberta , Canada ( we call it Texas north ) anywhoo I am lookin for a handgun ( no revolvers please ) that will suit the following needs: 1 - Home protection to stop intruder / home invasion 2 - My Husky / Wolf cross dog and I spend alot of time in the woods and a few times have run into 7 - 8 foot tall grizzlies and Moose that could walk over a small truck's hood ( honestly the moose are scarier :barf: ). luckily I was able to scare them off with noise or tread up hill in thick brush to get away but my time is comming that i meet an old / hungry grizzly or a rutting moose and the fight is on. I had shot a beretta 92f in the army and it was the most comfortable gun i ever shot. i shot a couple of sigs and cz's and they are nice as well. i have been eye balling the .40 cal ( 10 mm ) which is more powerful the .45 or .40 ? thanks in advance and keep in mind we cant buy ak 47's here as that would be my choice

April 10, 2006, 12:03 AM	#2
1wildbill Member Join Date: March 28, 2006 Location: Texas Posts: 21	Why not a revolver? In a magnum, plenty of choices. __________________ "Maybe one of these days I'll tell you the story of my Great-Great-Grandpappy, the "real" wildbill." NRA & TSRA Member Texas CHL

April 10, 2006, 01:42 AM	#5
44 AMP Staff Join Date: March 11, 2006 Location: Upper US Posts: 28,824	Bear defense? Mr Myagi say "Best defense, no be there!" Beyond the aforementioned 10mm, the Desert Eagle is available in .44 Magnum and .50 Action Express. Desert Eagles are huge and heavy, going over 4 pounds unloaded. They have a very large grip and are not all that easy to hold if you have small hands. recoil of the .44 is mild compared to revolvers (more weight). Don't know anything about the .50, except it is supposed to make the .44 look puny. For bear defense (not hunting), a 12 gauge shotgun (short/riot style) with slugs (sabot if you can get them), or a medium heavy rifle, like a Marlin .45-70, 444, or .450 Marlin would be a fair choice also. No handgun will deliver the close range punch of a 12 ga slug. Just curious, why no revolver ?

April 10, 2006, 02:08 AM	#6
MTMilitiaman Senior Member Join Date: October 14, 2004 Location: NW Montana Posts: 1,875	I carry a Glock 20 when I got hunting. A 180 gr JHP at around 1300 fps is capable of taking deer sized game and providing good protection against people and cougars. I think it would do the trick against black bears but really think there are precious few handguns applicable to grizzlies and even fewer people capable of wielding them with the skill necessary to get the job done with 600+ pounds of hair and teeth bearing down on you. I think a 10mm Auto is about as close as you are going to find to a pistol that meets your needs. The Glock is a very fine pistol--durable, reliable, accurate, good mag capacity, lightweight, and simple--but some find the grip angle akward and/or bulky. There are other 10mms out there, most of them on the 1911 platform, but few have the reputation for out of the box reliability and service life of the Glock. There is the Desert Eagle, which in my experience is rail gun accurate as well as extremely controllable in .44 Mag. My dad and my grandpa each have one and they have proven to be reliable and very durable. You just can't limp wrist them or shoot unjacketed ammunition through them. They are, however, rather heavy. Some might feel that if you're going to deal with the weight of a Desert Eagle or a .500 Smith or some other large monstrosity like that, you'd be better off with something along the lines of a short barreled shotgun loaded with Brennekes or a Marline Guide Gun with some Garrett or Buffalo Bore loaded solids. If you really intend to go head to head with a grizzly, I might concur. __________________ "...nothing says 'I WILL shoot every last one of you before you have time to reconsider your poor choices in life' like an AK." ~Dave R.

April 10, 2006, 02:33 AM	#7
4RHeritage Member Join Date: March 18, 2005 Location: British Columbia, Canada Posts: 17	You know that AK-47s are illegal in Canada, but you don't know that carrying a handgun, or worse yet, using one for home defense, is illegal? Sounds fishy to me. :barf: __________________ MOLON LABE

April 10, 2006, 12:09 AM	#3
Surefire_U2 Senior Member Join Date: November 26, 2004 Posts: 197	You're not going to find many semi-autos that would even be marginal defense against a bear or moose. The most powerful round that I can think of that is chambered in a common production gun is the 10mm (Glock 20). That round is effective on medium game, up to boar size, IMO....but probably would just irritate the grizzley that you describe. If you have to have a semi-auto, get something that you are comfortable with, and it will serve you well for home defense. For bear defense, get a rifle...

April 10, 2006, 01:06 AM	#4
enidpd804 Member Join Date: September 26, 2005 Location: OK Posts: 29	+1 on Surefire's post. 10mm is a great round but not enough for that kind of monster. Consider a revolver. A 44 mag would be much closer to the power you seek for bear. Still, you could use 44 spls for defense.

April 10, 2006, 05:45 AM	#8
threegun Junior member Join Date: March 1, 2006 Location: Tampa,Fl Posts: 4,000	If you are set on a (reasonably sized auto) go with the Glock 20. Use 200 grain fmj's for the deepest penetration for those animals you described. Make no mistake that the 10mm will do more than just irritate a bear and moose, it will kill them. I just hope they die before killing you. You should be looking for a revolver in 44 mag or bigger. S&W used to make a mountain revolver, 4inch light weight for backpacking, in 44 mag.

April 10, 2006, 06:17 AM	#9
WillBrayjr Junior member Join Date: September 26, 2004 Location: Northern Indiana Posts: 1,881	The Desert Eagle would work perfectly. A short Remington 870 12ga loaded with slugs would be best. Nothing hits harder at close range than a 12ga

April 10, 2006, 06:52 AM	#10
TacticalDefense1911 Senior Member Join Date: April 4, 2006 Location: Ohio Posts: 1,277	I would recommend a revolver, it will serve both purposes. You aren't going to find a semi-auto (other than a Desert Eagle...which is just a good looking waist of money) loaded in a caliber fit for protection against a grizzly bear. Look at the Taurus 608 with a 4" or 6" barrel (probably 4"). It is a .357 mag. (which is still a little light for a grizzly bear...load it with 180 soft points) and has an eight round cylinder capacity. When you come home from your walk load it with 125 grain JHP's for personal defense.

April 10, 2006, 10:32 AM	#11
andymiesha Member Join Date: February 7, 2005 Posts: 97	I second the other posts here. If you can go with a wheel gun in .44 mag or another magnum caliber. __________________ A Eruchîn, ú-dano i faelas a hyn an uben tanatha le faelas. "Show them no mercy for you shall receive none"

April 10, 2006, 11:12 AM	#13
Tommy Vercetti Senior Member Join Date: June 26, 2004 Location: Fairhope, Alabama Posts: 1,119	Sig 229/226 in .40 or .357 Sig __________________ "When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying the cross." Sinclair Lewis, (It Can't Happen Here, 1935) "Orators are most vehement when their cause is weak" Marcus Tullius Cicero

April 10, 2006, 12:16 PM	#14
kymasabe Senior Member Join Date: June 10, 2005 Location: SW Florida Posts: 2,747	Buy the Ruger Alaska __________________ God's creatures big and small, eat them one, eat them all.

April 10, 2006, 02:34 PM	#15
Natty Junior member Join Date: January 28, 2006 Posts: 9	12 ga pump with rifled slugs. Carry it across your back on a sling for best comfort. If you really think a moose or griz will attack you, dont think a hangun can save you from getting the crap stomped out of you or getting shredded. Your odds are much better with 12 gauge slugs at least 1oz.

April 10, 2006, 06:17 PM	#16
silver-bullet Senior Member Join Date: July 8, 2005 Posts: 515	Hmmm.... well, let me ask you a question: Are you anticipating that the handgun you choose may have to DEFEND YOUR LIFE from an attacking grizzly, OR, are you anticipating that the weapon you choose should simply be powerful enough to SCARE the grizzly away? If your answer is: "Silver, I need a weapon that should be able to defend me from an aggressive/attacking grizzly," then I echo the previous opinions that you definitely need something more powerful (a .44 magnum or .454 Casull revolver comes to mind). BUT, if you are only looking for something which might be powerful/loud enough to scare a grizzly away, or deter his intentions of snacking on you or your loved ones (and you're dead-set on getting a semiautomatic), then I would recommend a compact pistol chambered in .357 Sig. This is one of the LOUDEST auto-cartridges I've ever fired, and properly loaded, should provide greater penetration than almost ANY other autopistol round (the 10mm is good too, but there are just too few pistols out there chambered for this round). You might take a look at the Sig-Sauer p229 in .357 Sig, or the HK USP Compact. Both are world-class, and easy to carry. Best of luck!

April 10, 2006, 07:43 PM	#17
Tommy Vercetti Senior Member Join Date: June 26, 2004 Location: Fairhope, Alabama Posts: 1,119	I was born and raised in Alaska If I was even remotely worried about big grizzlies then I would definitely carry a 12 gauge..like my Remington 870 but my Sig 229 would be comforting too __________________ "When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying the cross." Sinclair Lewis, (It Can't Happen Here, 1935) "Orators are most vehement when their cause is weak" Marcus Tullius Cicero

April 10, 2006, 07:43 PM	#18
axslingerW Senior Member Join Date: May 8, 2005 Location: St. louis Posts: 249	I think a handgun vs. grizzly match is going to make for a long day. A good pair of running shoes might make more sense A .500 magnum would be a good choice but you said no wheel guns, so... maybe a kel-tec plr-16 with a couple of 30 round magazines? [URL="http://www.kel-tec.com/plr16.html"]

April 11, 2006, 01:32 AM	#19
PPCLI 2 can. Member Join Date: April 9, 2006 Posts: 24	I think a handgun vs. grizzly match is going to make for a long day. A good pair of running shoes might make more sense too funny i knew i was going to get the ol get a revovler answer but i hate the way they look , feel and shoot . no insult intended You know that AK-47s are illegal in Canada, but you don't know that carrying a handgun, or worse yet, using one for home defense, is illegal? Sounds fishy to me. __________________ yah yah tell me one person who ownes a handgun in canada that isnt for home/personal defence and ill show you a liar. im just not chicken to say that is what its for. plus carring one in the bush is not a concern since we have no one hanging out where i go. good posts thanks keep em comming.. silver i agree but putting 8 slugs from an auto into a bears ass should stop him if not ill start camping with a fat guy, that way i push him down and run stupid question though... wouldnt a 10mm be more powerful than say a .357 with the same load?

April 11, 2006, 03:25 AM	#20
SpookBoy Senior Member Join Date: January 29, 2006 Location: mid tennessee Posts: 430	Due to your situation(no Revolvers) my top two choices are... or

April 11, 2006, 03:37 AM	#21
Ala Dan Member in memoriam Join Date: August 13, 1999 Location: In The HOT, Humid, and Mu Posts: 6,116	Probably, the two pic's posted by my friend Spook Boy are the only two choices I would even consider against Ole' Griz or Boo Moose~! BTW, NO handgun will deliver a fatal shot all the time; not even on the human torso.

April 11, 2006, 07:53 AM	#23
tom650604 Senior Member Join Date: January 29, 2005 Location: Twin Cities, MN USA Posts: 315	If you want to drop a grizzley or a moose. It has to be a revolver. I can't think of a semi-auto that I would fell comfortable when up against a grizzley. Well, maybe a Desert Eagle. It has to be a 44mag or larger for a grizz IMO. Because you want to make that one shot count! __________________ (\__/) (\__/) (\__/) (\__/) (='.'=) (='.'=) (='.'=) (='.'=) (")_(") (")_(")(")_(") (")_(")

April 11, 2006, 07:59 AM	#24
9mm1033 Senior Member Join Date: April 18, 2005 Location: A big city with far too many cars and people. Posts: 932	I didn't know you had crime in Canada. I'd have to agree with the other posts. An auto for man and a big revolver for animals. They may not be pretty to you, but that grizzly or moose will be dead, and you'll have a better chance of coming out alive. __________________ No one reads or cares what is written in ones signature box. So I'm not writing anything worth reading or remembering.

April 11, 2006, 09:47 AM	#25
Socrates Junior member Join Date: January 5, 2005 Location: East Bay NorCal, People's Republik of Kalifornia Posts: 5,866	Frankly, even with a high powered revolver, your chances of stopping brown bear aren't particularly good. 60% is I think the going statistics. You might consider getting a wood replica of a hunting rifle, and sling it over your shoulder. The bears don't get huge without knowing when hunting season starts, and, what a rifle looks like. It would be light, easy to carry, and scare the bears away. That, and carry a large boom box, playing rap music at high volume. That would be enough to get ANY mother brown bear to get her cubs away from you, and consider you an undesireable influence. Course I'm not sure, but, bears may have a more direct way of dealing with undesireables then our legal systems. S