Sign Of The Times?

roy reali · December 28, 2006, 10:01 AM

Our town here has a small gun shop. It is a hang out for all the locals. Yesterday I saw a sign the owner had placed near the entrance.

The sign was a notice to California residences. It states that if a resident of the Golden State purchases any clip or magazine of more then ten round capacity, they have committed a felony.

I didn't ask, but I wonder who requested that sign.

Jart · December 28, 2006, 10:05 AM

My wild guess is that they simply noticed that their neutered magazines weren't flying off the shelves.

...and decided it might be a good idea to remind people that buying a boxload in Nevada to bring back was a bad plan.

KSFreeman · December 28, 2006, 12:01 PM

I agree, business decision. They are sick of hearing about people going off to gun shows in Arizona and dragging back a big packing box of magazines.

Dino. · December 28, 2006, 12:31 PM

A deterent, maybe ... but I'm guessing it's more of a "CYA" to help protect the interest of the gunshop than anything else.

Whether it be a hi cap magazine, a full-auto machine gun, suppressor or whatever .... those who want them will find a way regardless.

JMO

roy reali · December 28, 2006, 12:50 PM

I was in a Carson City gunshop recently. The owner told me that the Fed's are enforcing the need for a physical address in Nevada. It seems that many Californians were setting up a PO box and then buying guns. Uncle Sam told them it was a no-no. There is a notice up in the shop to this effect. The letterhead on the notice is BATFE.

I don't why our gun shop has the magazine warning sign up. I don't know if it was a request by California or the Federal Government.

There is a bumper sticker that I've seen on several cars. I like it. I don't put them on our cars, but I'll make an exception this time. There is a small map of Nevada, and next to it is written,"I DON'T CARE HOW IT WAS DONE IN CALIFORNIA."

threegun · December 28, 2006, 03:09 PM

As FFL's we are forced to comply with many regulations. Here in Florida one regulation is to have a sign that warns of leaving a gun within easy access of a minor being unlawful. Some might think that we posted it to reduce the possibility of lawsuit....not true. I bet in the peoples Republic of Kalifornia the sigh became mandatory.

roy reali · December 28, 2006, 03:16 PM

So a sign in Nevada concerning California laws is probably due to Federal regulations?

Recon7 · December 28, 2006, 05:51 PM

wait a minute. California made what you do in another state illegal? So if I have a summer home in Nevada and I buy a 17 round mag for my gun and the mag stays in Nevada and never enters California I just committed a felony?

only in calif

rnia

roy reali · December 28, 2006, 07:10 PM

Good question, I am not sure. I haven't been back to the gun shop to ask. I assume it would be a felony once if you carried the magazine back across the state line. You are right in that California can't tell you what to do or not to do in another state. I don't know if there is a Federal law regulating this.

Besides, not too far from here we have "bunny" ranches. That activity is illegal in California. I wonder if any such signs are posted at their door.

MisterPX · December 28, 2006, 07:33 PM

He's trying to cover his butt.

RevolverLover · December 28, 2006, 07:41 PM

Quote:

wait a minute. California made what you do in another state illegal? So if I have a summer home in Nevada and I buy a 17 round mag for my gun and the mag stays in Nevada and never enters California I just committed a felony?

No, you can buy a hi-cap mag in Nevada but you just can't bring it into CA.

threegun · December 28, 2006, 09:42 PM

Roy,

Quote:

So a sign in Nevada concerning California laws is probably due to Federal regulations?

In your original post it made no mention of nevada.

Quote:

Sign Of The Times?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Our town here has a small gun shop. It is a hang out for all the locals. Yesterday I saw a sign the owner had placed near the entrance.

The sign was a notice to California residences. It states that if a resident of the Golden State purchases any clip or magazine of more then ten round capacity, they have committed a felony.

I didn't ask, but I wonder who requested that sign

roy reali · December 29, 2006, 01:48 PM

I went by the gun shop this morning. I talked to the owner about the high capacity magazine warning sign.

He told me that if a Nevada gun dealer knowingly sells one to a Californian they will be prosecuted for a felony. The California Department of Justice will go after them here in Nevada. The Feds have notified the dealers here that they will back up California in these cases.

If a person walks into his gunshop and purchases a twenty round magazine and doesn't disclose his home town, the dealer is in the clear. On the other hand, if the buyer mentions that he lives in Placerville, he would be on the hook if he makes the sale.

Jart · December 29, 2006, 03:11 PM

I thought the sign was in California as well.

Still, no big surprise. The FFL regs that I get courtesy of my C&R make it pretty clear that non-neutered mags into California are a no-no.

The sign would appear to be what we used to call "due diligence". AKA "CYA".

threegun · December 29, 2006, 06:04 PM

Just learn to change mags real fast while and until you move the heck out of that liberal cesspool.

NCHornet · December 29, 2006, 07:32 PM

One of the thousands of reasons I am glad I left the republic of California years ago!!! Gee I wonder if the gang bangers or meth heads have read those signs and are obeying?

blume357 · December 30, 2006, 07:32 AM

and pull a 'Bloomberg' on the Nevada gun dealers. Send a few folks over to buy some mags... mention they are going surfing on saturday at their beach house after going to the range... and 'vola.... you're caught selling contraband!

roy reali · December 30, 2006, 09:31 AM

The gunshop owner in question here was dead serious about this.

I wonder if California has tried to go after anyone on this. I wonder if they were successful.

Abndoc · December 30, 2006, 10:11 AM

I have a daughter who still lives in Nevada, just a couple hours up the road from me. If I really wanted to, I COULD get that high cap magazine or AR or AK.

However, California is serious about their gunlaws. None of the banned items are worth prison time, fines and felony convictions. We have DA's in this state that would be more than happy to put you away for violations. They also have plenty of time and money to go after out of state gun dealers and internet dealers if they feel this is a problem.

I wouldn't be suprised if the state tried to make an example or two by Bloomberging someone. After all, why use resources to catch criminals when you can get a GUN OWNER or better yet, a GUN DEALER!

Webleymkv · December 30, 2006, 08:10 PM

Quote:

The California Department of Justice will go after them here in Nevada. The Feds have notified the dealers here that they will back up California in these cases.

Now this is crap, California doing this doesn't suprise me. But the Federal Government supporting one state's attempt to force their laws on to another state is infuriating to me. On the other hand, I think it would be kind of hard to enforce unless California pulled a "Bloomberg" as another poster mentioned as it would likely be the gunshop owner's word against the California resident's and therefore difficult to prove that the Store owner actually knew that the person in question was indeed from California. If California does pull a "Bloomberg" I'd think this would at least borderline on entrapment and have a possible legal backfire.

DonR101395 · December 30, 2006, 08:17 PM

I believe they would have a hard time coming after anyone. Their laws doesn't prohibit them from owning them anywhere on the planet. It prohibits them from importing and owning them in CA. That would be like telling them if they owned a car in Nevada that is registered and insured in Nevada that they would have to comply with CA emissions laws. As long as they don't bring them into CA they can't restrict ownership.

dakotashooter2 · January 2, 2007, 12:52 PM

I would be inclined to think that most judges would toss this out in a heartbeat but then we are dealing with CA and the 9th District Court.
Since the purchase of magazines has no residency requirements at the federal level I'm not sure that CA could effectively go after the shop owner. I suspect what the feds mean by "they will back CA" is that they will not interfere or probably even make an interpretation.

There may be an interstate commerce violation that is prosecutable but if the dealer is not REQUIRED to ask for ID I'm not sure how enforcable it would be.

RobW · January 2, 2007, 07:25 PM

Didn't know that Commifornia still belongs to the US

roy reali · January 3, 2007, 12:23 AM

I did talk to the owner of the gun shop in question here. He said that the California Deparment of Justice was going to pursue Nevada gun dealers that sold high capacity magazines to Californians, Why would he make this up? Why would he post a warning sign? We are almost 100 miles from the border.

Trust me, he was very serious in making these comments.

RevolverLover · January 3, 2007, 01:34 AM

Quote:

He said that the California Deparment of Justice was going to pursue Nevada gun dealers that sold high capacity magazines to Californians

The CADOJ, can't pursue Nevada gun dealers that sell high cap mags to Californians. It is NOT illegal to sell a high cap mag to a Californian. It is ONLY illegal to transport high cap mags into CA. If what your gun dealer is saying is true, then the CADOJ is just saying that as a scare tactic.

December 28, 2006, 10:01 AM	#1
roy reali Senior Member Join Date: August 23, 2005 Posts: 2,670	Sign Of The Times? Our town here has a small gun shop. It is a hang out for all the locals. Yesterday I saw a sign the owner had placed near the entrance. The sign was a notice to California residences. It states that if a resident of the Golden State purchases any clip or magazine of more then ten round capacity, they have committed a felony. I didn't ask, but I wonder who requested that sign.

December 28, 2006, 12:01 PM	#3
KSFreeman Senior Member Join Date: June 9, 2001 Location: Lafayette, Indiana--American-occupied America Posts: 5,404	I agree, business decision. They are sick of hearing about people going off to gun shows in Arizona and dragging back a big packing box of magazines. __________________ "Arguments of policy must give way to a constitutional command." Payton v. New York, 445 U.S. 573, 602 (1980).

December 28, 2006, 12:50 PM	#5
roy reali Senior Member Join Date: August 23, 2005 Posts: 2,670	Physical Address I was in a Carson City gunshop recently. The owner told me that the Fed's are enforcing the need for a physical address in Nevada. It seems that many Californians were setting up a PO box and then buying guns. Uncle Sam told them it was a no-no. There is a notice up in the shop to this effect. The letterhead on the notice is BATFE. I don't why our gun shop has the magazine warning sign up. I don't know if it was a request by California or the Federal Government. There is a bumper sticker that I've seen on several cars. I like it. I don't put them on our cars, but I'll make an exception this time. There is a small map of Nevada, and next to it is written,"I DON'T CARE HOW IT WAS DONE IN CALIFORNIA."

December 28, 2006, 03:16 PM	#7
roy reali Senior Member Join Date: August 23, 2005 Posts: 2,670	Re:threegun So a sign in Nevada concerning California laws is probably due to Federal regulations?

December 28, 2006, 07:10 PM	#9
roy reali Senior Member Join Date: August 23, 2005 Posts: 2,670	Re:recon7 Good question, I am not sure. I haven't been back to the gun shop to ask. I assume it would be a felony once if you carried the magazine back across the state line. You are right in that California can't tell you what to do or not to do in another state. I don't know if there is a Federal law regulating this. Besides, not too far from here we have "bunny" ranches. That activity is illegal in California. I wonder if any such signs are posted at their door.

December 28, 2006, 10:05 AM	#2
Jart Senior Member Join Date: December 24, 2001 Location: Grand Prairie, TX Posts: 1,592	My wild guess is that they simply noticed that their neutered magazines weren't flying off the shelves. ...and decided it might be a good idea to remind people that buying a boxload in Nevada to bring back was a bad plan.

December 28, 2006, 12:31 PM	#4
Dino. Senior Member Join Date: November 2, 2006 Posts: 156	A deterent, maybe ... but I'm guessing it's more of a "CYA" to help protect the interest of the gunshop than anything else. Whether it be a hi cap magazine, a full-auto machine gun, suppressor or whatever .... those who want them will find a way regardless. JMO

December 28, 2006, 03:09 PM	#6
threegun Senior Member Join Date: March 1, 2006 Location: Tampa,Fl Posts: 2,544	As FFL's we are forced to comply with many regulations. Here in Florida one regulation is to have a sign that warns of leaving a gun within easy access of a minor being unlawful. Some might think that we posted it to reduce the possibility of lawsuit....not true. I bet in the peoples Republic of Kalifornia the sigh became mandatory.

December 28, 2006, 05:51 PM	#8
Recon7 Senior Member Join Date: December 10, 2005 Posts: 700	wait a minute. California made what you do in another state illegal? So if I have a summer home in Nevada and I buy a 17 round mag for my gun and the mag stays in Nevada and never enters California I just committed a felony? only in calif rnia

December 28, 2006, 07:33 PM	#10
MisterPX Senior Member Join Date: April 25, 2006 Location: Amerika's Doyleland Posts: 743	He's trying to cover his butt.

December 29, 2006, 01:48 PM	#13
roy reali Senior Member Join Date: August 23, 2005 Posts: 2,670	More Info I went by the gun shop this morning. I talked to the owner about the high capacity magazine warning sign. He told me that if a Nevada gun dealer knowingly sells one to a Californian they will be prosecuted for a felony. The California Department of Justice will go after them here in Nevada. The Feds have notified the dealers here that they will back up California in these cases. If a person walks into his gunshop and purchases a twenty round magazine and doesn't disclose his home town, the dealer is in the clear. On the other hand, if the buyer mentions that he lives in Placerville, he would be on the hook if he makes the sale.

December 29, 2006, 03:11 PM	#14
Jart Senior Member Join Date: December 24, 2001 Location: Grand Prairie, TX Posts: 1,592	I thought the sign was in California as well. Still, no big surprise. The FFL regs that I get courtesy of my C&R make it pretty clear that non-neutered mags into California are a no-no. The sign would appear to be what we used to call "due diligence". AKA "CYA".

December 29, 2006, 06:04 PM	#15
threegun Senior Member Join Date: March 1, 2006 Location: Tampa,Fl Posts: 2,544	Just learn to change mags real fast while and until you move the heck out of that liberal cesspool.

December 29, 2006, 07:32 PM	#16
NCHornet Senior Member Join Date: December 20, 2006 Posts: 1,001	One of the thousands of reasons I am glad I left the republic of California years ago!!! Gee I wonder if the gang bangers or meth heads have read those signs and are obeying? __________________ When seconds count, the cops are just minutes away!! Carry ON!! NCHornet

December 30, 2006, 07:32 AM	#17
blume357 Senior Member Join Date: August 2, 2005 Location: Greenville, SC Posts: 3,156	Sounds to me like some zelots in California are going to try and pull a 'Bloomberg' on the Nevada gun dealers. Send a few folks over to buy some mags... mention they are going surfing on saturday at their beach house after going to the range... and 'vola.... you're caught selling contraband!

December 30, 2006, 09:31 AM	#18
roy reali Senior Member Join Date: August 23, 2005 Posts: 2,670	Dead Serious The gunshop owner in question here was dead serious about this. I wonder if California has tried to go after anyone on this. I wonder if they were successful.

December 30, 2006, 10:11 AM	#19
Abndoc Senior Member Join Date: January 28, 2006 Location: Kalifornia Posts: 702	I have a daughter who still lives in Nevada, just a couple hours up the road from me. If I really wanted to, I COULD get that high cap magazine or AR or AK. However, California is serious about their gunlaws. None of the banned items are worth prison time, fines and felony convictions. We have DA's in this state that would be more than happy to put you away for violations. They also have plenty of time and money to go after out of state gun dealers and internet dealers if they feel this is a problem. I wouldn't be suprised if the state tried to make an example or two by Bloomberging someone. After all, why use resources to catch criminals when you can get a GUN OWNER or better yet, a GUN DEALER!

December 30, 2006, 08:17 PM	#21
DonR101395 Senior Member Join Date: October 30, 2005 Location: NWFL Posts: 2,998	I believe they would have a hard time coming after anyone. Their laws doesn't prohibit them from owning them anywhere on the planet. It prohibits them from importing and owning them in CA. That would be like telling them if they owned a car in Nevada that is registered and insured in Nevada that they would have to comply with CA emissions laws. As long as they don't bring them into CA they can't restrict ownership.

January 2, 2007, 12:52 PM	#22
dakotashooter2 Senior Member Join Date: January 13, 2005 Posts: 474	I would be inclined to think that most judges would toss this out in a heartbeat but then we are dealing with CA and the 9th District Court. Since the purchase of magazines has no residency requirements at the federal level I'm not sure that CA could effectively go after the shop owner. I suspect what the feds mean by "they will back CA" is that they will not interfere or probably even make an interpretation. There may be an interstate commerce violation that is prosecutable but if the dealer is not REQUIRED to ask for ID I'm not sure how enforcable it would be.

January 2, 2007, 07:25 PM	#23
RobW Senior Member Join Date: December 15, 2000 Location: Henderson, NV Posts: 257	Didn't know that Commifornia still belongs to the US __________________ We learn from our experience that we don't learn from our experience.

January 3, 2007, 12:23 AM	#24
roy reali Senior Member Join Date: August 23, 2005 Posts: 2,670	His Words I did talk to the owner of the gun shop in question here. He said that the California Deparment of Justice was going to pursue Nevada gun dealers that sold high capacity magazines to Californians, Why would he make this up? Why would he post a warning sign? We are almost 100 miles from the border. Trust me, he was very serious in making these comments.