TFL members!!-The Brady's now want our hunting rifles!!

[1BadF350]

This text was quoted from the Brady's myspace page. There is a big discussion going on now at ar15.com. Here is the link to the discussion:
http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=5&t=548749

I would like to take a moment to comment on the proliferation of Sniper Rifles.
Sniper Rifles are typically equipped with a high-powered scope, and every single one of them can blow through the body armor cops wear. They can even penetrate multiple police cars. Does the Second Amendment protect cop-killer Sniper Rifles? The NRA certainly thinks so, along with the powerful gun lobby that wants your children and your law enforcement officers to be at risk from these weapons of mass destruction. Some of these Sniper Rifles can even penetrate ballistic or armored glass, lightly armored vehicles, and armored limousines. Senator Ted Kennedy attempted to solve this with an important bill that would have banned armor piercing ammunition and protected lawful firearm commerce:

"Another rifle caliber, the 30.30 caliber, was responsible for penetrating three officers' armor and killing them in 1993, 1996, and 2002. This ammunition is also capable of puncturing light-armored vehicles, ballistic or armored glass, armored limousines, even a 600-pound safe with 600 pounds of safe armor plating.....

..It is outrageous and unconscionable that such ammunition continues to be sold in the United States of America.."

Should our elected officials live under the threat of reprisal on their lives from disgruntled constituents? The Gun Lobby seems to think so. We disagree.

Sniper Rifles can be equipped with precision optics above even what the Military uses, allowing a sniper to deliver rounds within millimeters of accuracy - enabling them to engage targets at distances of well over one hundred meters. Is there a pressing need to be able to kill with accuracy at that distance? It is too far to justify as self defense. It is too far for hunting. It is only useful for those who wish to murder from afar.

Large caliber Sniper Rifles such as the .50 Browning Machine Gun can derail freight cars, shoot down aircraft and helicopters, damage vital ground equipment such as power substations, fuel tanks, and air traffic control, and cause complete chaos. For more information on why large caliber machine-gun rounds must be banned, visit http://www.50caliberterror.com. A shipment of large caliber machine-gun round sniper rifles made by Steyr turned up in Iran, and are being used on our own soldiers, as the .50 bullets easily defeat their body armor, their up-armored humvees, and even APCs.

Many forward thinking, progressive politicians such as Ted Kennedy, Chuck Schumer, Barbara Boxer, Nancy Pelosi, Hillary Clinton, and Barack Obama have voted against Center-Fire Rifle Ammunition of types for Sniper Rifles, but due to the pressure and massive financial resources of the gun industry, the necessary steps to protect our homes and lives have not been attained.

Sniper Rifles have been used by murderers and spree killers for years, with notable incidents such as the Beltway Snipers, the Clocktower Sniper, and more.

ANY rifle configured and equipped as a sniper rifle has no sporting purpose especially as a hunting rifle. They are too big and heavy to take to the field. Designed for distance shooting, they are useless for the ranges at which game animals are normally shot, and when used on sporting sized game at range they often just wound the animal, inhumanely forcing it to die slowly while the would-be hunter tracks it to finish it off. Most Sniper Rifles fire atypically large cartridges and ultra high velocity ammunition that can travel much greater distances that standard ammunition. The danger imposed from missed shots and ricochetes from these specialty rounds is unreasonable.

Most of these rifles carry multiple rounds, with either an automatic mechanism, or a quick toggle action to rapidly move another bullet into the breech, ready to fire into another victim. In most states, they are nearly unrestricted. Anyone over the age of 18 can buy one. If they can't pass a background check, they skirt the NCIS system by going to a gunshow, or finding a private sale in the newspaper. A murderer camped at a distance from a public gathering could quickly turn it into a massacre dwarfing anything we have seen before in the United States, if they had a Sniper Rifle. If they adopted hit and run tactics, entire portions of our country could be shut down.

Sniper Rifles shoot a high powered bullet that is almost always fatal. They are designed for one thing- delivering powerful overkill with deadly precision. You don't need the kind of power and accuracy that can kill a man at five hundred yards for hunting rabbits or defending your house.

We should also give commendations to France because many years ago they designated any firearm capable of shooting military ammunition as a military arm, illegal to posess without a special permit and unlawful to use for hunting. The 223, 308, 7mm mauser, 30-06, and 6.5x55 have no place in the hunting fields of France. Firearms shooting these calibers are military weapons only designed for killing PEOPLE and should be kept out of the hands of the general population. Because they have no hunting purpose, there is no reason for civilians to own them.

Every state in the USA has hunting equipment rules that limit the caliber of firearm used to take game. They also limit the types of rifles, length, magazine capacity, etc. States should amend these hunting regulations to restrict the use of "sniper" rifles, specialty "sniper" cartridges, and "sniper" ammunition. Limits on weight, barrel length, bipods and tripods, thumbhole stocks and pistol grips, night vision type scopes, scopes of excessive magnification, super magnum and high velocity ammunition, and military slings should be imposed. They have no place in the hunting fields of America and hunting usage should not be used as an argument for civilians to own such firearms and weapons. There are more than ample hunting rifles, cartridges, and rounds of ammunition to choose from without them.

Let us hope that in a safer, saner America, we will succeed in our efforts to restrict the deadly spread of long distance murder rifles.

[Wildalaska]

6.5X55? now Im mad

Wildivebeenreadingthatfluffsince1965Alaska

[Csspecs]

If they really did that (I don't doubt it) they just did the best thing ever for us. They are going to shake up hunters as well as every target shooter in the US.

[Jart]

I just posted my misgivings regarding the authenticity of the myspace connection on another forum.

To my delight and chagrin, it's for real:
Brady Link

Dependent on the degree to which the "real" Brady has insulated themselves from the blog and/or the amount of plausible deniability, this has got to be the single biggest gaffe they've ever been party to.

Ban Wild's scoped Swede? The temerity!

Bundling uncle Ned's scoped model 94 in .30-.30 right along with Barrett's finest... Including every scoped centerfire in the ban wagon... Perfect. I don't know of anyone who could have scripted a better "coming out of the closet" statement for Brady - it reads like a parody - I thought it was the Onion.

I had a forlorn hope that they would have piled on the Cheney's 20K bird gun, but no such luck - that would have gotten the skeeters attention at my club. This may well be better.

If they don't pull it.

[rantingredneck]

So they want to ban the .30-30 and the .30-06. Arguably the two most popular deer hunting calibers in America. So Jim Zumbo, what ya got to say about that?

I love how they refer to a "quick toggle action" in a rifle's action to "rapidly move another bullet into the breech" Could that be a BOLT ACTION perhaps?

[TimRB]

The authenticity of the writing notwithstanding, the Brady Bunch has always wanted everyone's hunting rifles. They hate guns. This can't be news to anyone here. (?)

Tim

[JR47]

The Washington Post began calling the bolt-action, scoped, hunting rifle a "Deadly Sniper Rifle" in the 1970s. I'm amazed that it's taken this long to get where this is today.

The Beltway Snipers used the .223, while the Clocktower Killer used an M1 Carbine. The M1 Carbine is about as powerful as some .357 Magnum rounds. That would set an awfully low energy level barrier for hunting. Heck, many states won't let you hunt deer with a .223.

There are more than ample hunting rifles, cartridges, and rounds of ammunition to choose from without them.

With the base cartridges mentioned, I wouldn't be so sure of that.

Just curious, but what would a thumb-hole stock do to help a sniper? I don't see any issued in the world's military. Besides, God knows that the military sling is much more useful in sniper-only applications.

[Jart]

The authenticity of the writing notwithstanding, the Brady Bunch has always wanted everyone's hunting rifles. They hate guns. This can't be news to anyone here. (?)

I doubt it's news to anyone here. It might be news to a fair number of hunters as Brady has always disavowed their intention to ban all guns.

From Brady's "real" site:

Q. Is Brady a "gun ban" organization? Are you really just trying to make all guns illegal in America?

Brady believes that a safer America can be achieved without banning guns. Our stand is simple. We believe that law-abiding citizens should be able to buy and keep firearms.

<snippage>

... there are certain classes of weapons that should be out of bounds for private ownership. They include Saturday-night specials, which are used almost exclusively for crime, military-style assault weapons like Uzis and AK-47s, and .50-caliber sniper rifles, which serve no ordinary sporting purpose.
...

So, if you're not looking for a Jennings, a Barrett or an UZI or AK, you're good to go. But wait. Now your Dakota with Leopold is on the block.

IMHO, they've done a workmanlike job of lulling portions of the bolt-action and clay-gun crowd into a "mine are safe" mindset. It may not have worked on members here but I don't think we're representative of the majority.

Somehow I picture benchrest competitors getting a real case of the vapors over the new and improved definition of "sniper rifle". I don't see any exemptions for a Stolle Panda in that blog. If centerfire bolt actions are on the menu, it's a short hop to all semi-auto and pump shotguns.

[LAK Supply]

How do we stop organizations such as this? Their sole purpose for existence is to degrade the constitution; what action can we take (this might be handy for groups such as the ACLU as well)?

[Kreyzhorse]

I really thought that this was a hoax. Not new to anyone here, but the utter spin and disregard for the truth that the Brady bunch throws around is disgusting.

[SecDef]

I had no problem with the 5 day waiting period in 1993. Definitely no problem with it expiring and replaced by instant background checks in 1998. That's just moving with the times as computers enrich our lives.

I've got a huge problem with misrepresenting the argument with terms like "sniper rifles" and "Assault weapons".

[rantingredneck]

I would think that because I've killed six deer with it, it would be a DEER rifle.....

[Stretchman]

I would think that because I've killed six deer with it, it would be a DEER rifle.....

Does that mean that if the rifles they want outlawed are sniper rifles, that they had to be used to kill snipers?

[rantingredneck]

you raise a good point............lol......

[gunslinger555]

Wow so many lies in such a small space.

[ATW525]

How do we stop organizations such as this?

Clearly they have a pretty good idea on how people can stop them. Why do you think they want to ban "sniper" rifles?

[JLelli]

I am kinda shocked on how the Brady bunch seems intent on throwing their own organization into a death-spiral. I mean, this weekend one of the "gun community's" own *cough*Zumbo*cough* hangs a curveball over the heart of the plate, and the Brady pukes respond with an infield fly. You know, when I first heard the phrase "The government will never ban your hunting rifles; they'll first call them 'sniper rifles'", I thought it was witty satire. Hard to believe that a national organization would fall for the bait.

Stick a fork in the Bradys, they're finished. Now that they've actually called to ban 110-year-old deer hunting rifles, they can now be declared "irrelevant." All we need to do now is mop up the remains and make sure that they never re-surge.

[Haterade]

Large caliber Sniper Rifles such as the .50 Browning Machine Gun can derail freight cars, shoot down aircraft and helicopters, damage vital ground equipment such as power substations, fuel tanks, and air traffic control, and cause complete chaos.

Derail freight cars? Even a car or truck in front of a train will rarely derail one... let alone a .5 inch bullet....ha! Complete chaos? ha!

I hope their idiocy continues in this direction... even the non-gun types can see right through this drivel.

They DO have 5 'friends' as of now though... we should tread softly.

[alan]

Re the heading of originating post, if correct, and likely it is, is the idea anything at all new. The answer to that is HELL NO.

Take a brief look at history, and you will plainly see that the often stated ultimate goals of the anti gunners, which obviously include The Brady Bunch are, have been and remain The Total Proscription of Firearms.

How many times do people have to hear about and sometimes actually see rattle snakes bite others before thet come to believe that rattle snakes are dangeropus creatures.

[dasmi]

Should our elected officials live under the threat of reprisal on their lives from disgruntled constituents? The Gun Lobby seems to think so. We disagree.

The founding fathers seemed to think so.

[Crosshair]

The founding fathers seemed to think so.

+1 Many times I have heard the saying about various tyrants, "The Nobel Peace prize should go to whoever puts a bullet in his head." I think that particular saying started when people were describing Robert Mugabe, then man who has single handedly destroyed Zimbabwe.

If a politician is doing their job properly then they should have very little to fear. Every job has it's risks.

[Indrid Cold]

Does the Second Amendment protect cop-killer Sniper Rifles? The NRA certainly thinks so, along with the powerful gun lobby that wants your children and your law enforcement officers to be at risk from these weapons of mass destruction.

I have to laugh at this. Apparently "sniper rifles" are right up there with tactical nuclear weapons in their capacity to cause death and destruction. Nuclear cop-killing rifles... Wow. How accurate

[mxwelch]

Didn't ya know? My .30-30 will punch holes through a M1 Abrams at 500 yards.

[1BadF350]

We need to seriously unite against these people just like we did against Zumbo's remarks.
We're fighting a proposed AWB in Md. as we speak. Don't buy into the "we've been hearing this for 30 years" an get complacent. Sooner or later the Brady's will get what they want. It will happen if we give up the fight.

[Te Anau]

Should our elected officials live under the threat of reprisal on their lives from disgruntled constituents?

ABSOLUTELY!!!
As Thomas Jefferson once said...."The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants".
The Brady bunch and their ilk are clearly the tyrants in modern America.