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Old August 3, 2007, 01:22 PM   #1
rantingredneck
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Another 9mm Luger Vs. .45 ACP thread...

....but this time comparing shotshells

Be honest, when you saw the thread title you rolled your eyes didn't you?

I was browsing through Walmart one evening recently and ran across some boxes of CCI shotshells for 9mm and .45 for 4.50 per box of 10. I have always wondered how well these things would actually work for snake duty around the house so I picked up a couple boxes each of CCI 9mm and .45ACP and I thought I'd do some pattern testing and a range report here for those interested.

My targets were improvised using standard notebook paper from my shooting log book with orange target stickers for aiming points.

The 9mm shells use 64gr. of #11 birdshot in a plastic rounded capsule. The .45ACP loads are an aluminum extended length shell with plastic cap containing 117 gr. of #9 shot.

All targets were shot off hand at a distance of 10 ft. I picked this distance arbitrarily as about as close as most people want to get to a snake.

I loaded all magazines tested with one shotshell followed by standard FMJ target loads in the magazine. All weapons successfully cycled the shotshell out and the FMJ load in.

The first weapon tested was my P89:



Not impressed. I would think that most snakes would shrug that off and keep on slithering.

I decided to try my PC9 to see if the longer barrel would help at all with patterning.



I didn't think it would. Again I don't see 9mm shotshells being useful for much of anything.

Moving on to .45ACP in my P90:



Now that's better. I would think that would actually do some harm to a snake, possibly killing it without further shots needed.

Now the best of the batch was my P345 in .45ACP.




Thats what I'm talking about. Bye bye Mr. Serpent.

I'm not exactly sure why the P345 did better than the P90. The only thing I can think, and this is pure speculation, is that the slightly shorter barrel hits right at the sweet spot in the pressure curve for this particular round. Any thoughts on that gentlemen?

Overall at 10ft the .45ACP loads appear to significantly outperform the 9mm loads. That's to be expected, though given the smaller shot size and smaller shot charge of the 9mm. Now 10ft may be a bit long for shooting snakes. If you can get closer I would expect better patterns from any of these rounds. I still think the 9mm's are pointless for this, though.
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Old August 3, 2007, 01:41 PM   #2
davlandrum
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Nice report! I guess I was always too lazy to actually test and was satisfied just to wonder how effective they were.

I guess I will pick some up for my P345 to carry during deer season
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Old August 3, 2007, 02:09 PM   #3
rantingredneck
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By the time we're allowed to carry sidearms during deer season here it is Nov. and the snakes are tucked away in hibernation. We can't carry during bow or muzzleloader seasons, unfortunately.
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Old August 3, 2007, 02:48 PM   #4
Frederic
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Shot Shells

Interesting report RRN. I just wondered, did both 9mm and 45acp shotshells cycle the pistols ok? I have tried them in a revolver but not a semiauto. I have heard various people say that they wound not cycle a semiauto pistol.
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Old August 3, 2007, 03:01 PM   #5
rantingredneck
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Yes they did.

You probably missed this part

Quote:
I loaded all magazines tested with one shotshell followed by standard FMJ target loads in the magazine. All weapons successfully cycled the shotshell out and the FMJ load in.
I had heard the same thing before. On the box these came in it states that they are made to fully function in automatic pistols. I was skeptical but they functioned fine. What I didn't test though was whether they would feed one shotshell behind another. I only loaded the shotshell as the top round in the mag. Everything below it was FMJ. All shots were from full mags, too. I don't know how feed reliable they would be once you get down to the bottom of the mag.
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Old August 3, 2007, 04:10 PM   #6
davlandrum
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They changed our regs a few years ago to allow carry during archery season. Where I bow hunt, there aren't enough snakes (read none) to worry. Rifle, when I go where the snakes live, can really be hit or miss on average temp - sweat to death some years, freeze to death others.
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Old August 3, 2007, 04:16 PM   #7
BigJimP
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Nice analysis - thanks very much.

I've tested some "snake shot" in .357 Mag and .44 Mag revolvers as well - and they both have a good solid dense pattern, maybe a little more dense than the .45 ACP load you showed. I was using a 6" and an 8 3/8" barrel on the revolvers ( they're easier for me to carry in a shoulder holster, when I'm fishing, hiking, etc ). I used to carry 3 snake loads / 3 standard loads in the gun when I was fishing up north.
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Old August 3, 2007, 04:29 PM   #8
shooter1
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I can testify to the efectiveness of the CCI shot caps stuffed with #9 shot over 2.5gr of Bullseye. From a 2" S&W revolver at a range of 5'-6' they are VERY effective. I think that is a much more realistic range than the 10' in the test. I think the shorter barrel delivers better patterns due to less spin on the shot to open the pattern.
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Old August 3, 2007, 04:56 PM   #9
David the Gnome
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The biggest reason one did better than the other is probably:

Quote:
The 9mm shells use 64gr. of #11 birdshot in a plastic rounded capsule. The .45ACP loads are an aluminum extended length shell with plastic cap containing 117 gr. of #9 shot.
If you load the .45 with #11 birdshot you're going to get similar results to the 9mm and vice versa. I'd like to see a test with both using the same size shot.

Also, I won't be using 9mm shot shells with #11 birdshot for anything.
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