1911 Grip Safety - is there an aftermarket product that eliminates this?

Skans · July 8, 2009, 09:56 AM

One of my pet peeves about the 1911 design is the grip safety. I hate the grip safety. IMHO, it's useless. I know what it's function is supposed to be, but the regular safety lever does the exact same thing, if you carry with one in the chamber, locked and cocked. If you don't keep the gun cocked, the grip safety doesn't do anything but add more moving parts and get in your way.

What I would like is a fixed piece that takes the place of a moving grip safety that fits flush and solid with the back of the pistol. Has anyone heard of such a modification to a 1911 style gun?

AirForceShooter · July 8, 2009, 10:07 AM

I happen to think just the opposite of you but it's your choice.
The grip safety can be pinned rendering it completely non-fuctional.
Any gun smith can do it.

I don't use the thumb safety.

AFS

VHinch · July 8, 2009, 10:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skans

I know what it's function is supposed to be, but the regular safety lever does the exact same thing

I know what you're getting at, but for the sake of clarity, the functions aren't exactly the same. The grip safety blocks the trigger, the thumb safety blocks the sear.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skans

What I would like is a fixed piece that takes the place of a moving grip safety that fits flush and solid with the back of the pistol.

Novak's The Answer-
http://www.gunsandammomag.com/cs/Sat...y_C/The+Answer
http://www.novaksights.com/1911.htm#...E_Installation

Christian James · July 8, 2009, 10:18 AM

Novak makes one. It's called the Answer. I don't think you can just buy the part, you'll have to send it into Novak's shop.

ReNtaPiG · July 8, 2009, 10:23 AM

I like the grip safety on the 1911 for novelty purposes only!!! Now if you ask me about the XD's I'll say I hate it!!!

csmsss · July 8, 2009, 10:26 AM

For the life of me, I cannot understand the objection to the 1911 grip safety. Take a solid grip of the thing, and you don't even notice it's there.

rduckwor · July 8, 2009, 10:39 AM

Quote:

For the life of me, I cannot understand the objection to the 1911 grip safety. Take a solid grip of the thing, and you don't even notice it's there.

I have to agree. It was put there for a reason and has worked well for >100 years. You are entitled to your personal opinion and desires, I just cannot understand the objection.

If this is a defensive gun, be careful modifying any manufacturers' safety device. It could be a liability if you have to use the gun for it's intended purpose.

Sarge43 · July 8, 2009, 10:46 AM

I wouldn't do that to a carry gun. Can you imagine that life takes a downhill turn for a moment and you actually have to use your weapon in self defense and shoot someone? You then have to face a jury who sees the pitiful plaintiff sitting there with his colostomy bag hanging on his chair, or worse, a picture of the now dead plaintiff and you have to explain why you willfully disabled one of the main safety devices on the weapon you used to shoot him? BAD scene.
Just another line of thought on it if it's a carry weapon.
Good luck!
Sarge

Chipperman · July 8, 2009, 10:54 AM

Quote:

It was put there for a reason and has worked well for >100 years

What year are we in again?

Dust Monkey · July 8, 2009, 10:57 AM

Novaks "Answer" looks like a good part. Might have to try it.

As far as having to use a modified firearm in self defense, I don't think the fact that you had a professional smith modify it will subject you to smoking a big **** in hades. If it's a good shoot, it's a good shoot. No matter what weapon is used. And don't reply with the 10mm incident of Mr Fish. That had nothing to do with a gun or caliber. That was a case of a lawyer having his head up, well you get the point.

skeezix · July 8, 2009, 11:21 AM

Quote:

What I would like is a fixed piece that takes the place of a moving grip safety that fits flush and solid with the back of the pistol. Has anyone heard of such a modification to a 1911 style gun?

Duct Tape :-)

Sarge43 · July 8, 2009, 12:20 PM

Fair enough. I agree that a good shoot wouldn't be corrupted by the modification, but it seems it would serve to drag out the process by being one more thing they will bring up that will take time, which in turn is money burning through your pocket. I'm just thinking out loud. I wish you well! I'd love to see pics of the Novak modification if that's the direction you go.
Sarge

Huntergirl · July 8, 2009, 12:30 PM

Geez, I love the grip safety on my 1911's and that was a big motivator for me to get an XD45. But I understand that others may not like it.

jeffatus · July 8, 2009, 01:07 PM

Quote:

As far as having to use a modified firearm in self defense, I don't think the fact that you had a professional smith modify it will subject you to smoking a big **** in hades. If it's a good shoot, it's a good shoot. No matter what weapon is used. And don't reply with the 10mm incident of Mr Fish. That had nothing to do with a gun or caliber. That was a case of a lawyer having his head up, well you get the point.

How many times have you heard the media and ambulance chasers taking things out of context and using them against good people. Just the other day a reporter talked about how a man took his "Semi-Automatic Pistol" and shot someone. The way they said it, I would have thought they were talking about a machine gun. Now, take your modification and it could be reported that it was "altered to remove the manufacturers recommmended safety feature so it could be more deadly and kill people faster". Is any of that untrue? No, but it's rediculous and it's sometimes how it get's portrayed.

That's just me though

TenmaNeko · July 8, 2009, 01:09 PM

Quote:
"It was put there for a reason and has worked well for >100 years"

"What year are we in again?"

2009. The grip safety existed on the Colt 1903, so that's more than 100 years.

**Mike Irwin** · July 8, 2009, 01:11 PM

I can't say that the grip safety has ever bothered me, on either my 1911 or on my Vis 35 Radom.

drail · July 8, 2009, 01:19 PM

In my experience the grip safety is of questionable value since it only blocks the trigger. It can be a real problem for some people when the factory has fitted it in such a way that it requires being fully depressed to disengage. This problem is very easily corrected by a knowledgeable smith. Grip safeties can be adjusted to release with very little movement and many have had this done or had it completely deactivated. If you have a problem getting yours to release the trigger have a 1991 smith adjust it. You should not have to chicken choke your gun to make it fire. When it is adjusted properly you will not even know it is there.

**Mike Irwin** · July 8, 2009, 01:22 PM

The grip safety apparently came about because the Army, specifically the cavalry, wanted that extra layer of protection against a trooper putting a round into either his thigh or his mount.

At least that's the story I heard.

JM Browning didn't agree with them, but he added it to keep the gun moving through acceptance testing.

Browning dropped the grip safety on the High Power.

The Soviets, who copied liberally from the 1911, also dropped the grip safety in the TT-30 series of handguns.

TJH3781 · July 8, 2009, 01:23 PM

Sometimes available on the various auction sites.

Arminex 1 Piece Backstrap.

Skans · July 8, 2009, 01:24 PM

Thanks Vhinch and TJ - that's exactly what I am looking for. Need to do some reading up on this, but I think this might just be the answer. It would go a long way making it feel a little more like my Hi-Power.

TJH3781 · July 8, 2009, 01:53 PM

If you find an Arminex, make sure it comes with a sear spring.
It is different than a standard Colt spring.

jmr40 · July 8, 2009, 02:43 PM

I'm in the camp that believes the grip safety serves no purpose except to make people who do not understand how the gun works feel safer. John Browning didn't want one and virtually no other gun ever made except for the XD and a few others have managed to survive for decades with no problems. I would agree that it does not really cause any problems, it's just a useless addition to the gun.

Chipperman · July 8, 2009, 03:44 PM

Quote:

"It was put there for a reason and has worked well for >100 years"

"What year are we in again?"

2009. The grip safety existed on the Colt 1903, so that's more than 100 years.

Yeah, but we were talking about it in reference to the 1911.

I was just being a wiseguy.

TenmaNeko · July 8, 2009, 06:26 PM

That's okay, so was I!

**Mike Irwin** · July 8, 2009, 07:59 PM

I seem to recall early Lugers having a grip safety, which was eliminated on the German military version...

July 8, 2009, 09:56 AM	#1
Skans Senior Member Join Date: November 20, 2008 Posts: 11,132	1911 Grip Safety - is there an aftermarket product that eliminates this? One of my pet peeves about the 1911 design is the grip safety. I hate the grip safety. IMHO, it's useless. I know what it's function is supposed to be, but the regular safety lever does the exact same thing, if you carry with one in the chamber, locked and cocked. If you don't keep the gun cocked, the grip safety doesn't do anything but add more moving parts and get in your way. What I would like is a fixed piece that takes the place of a moving grip safety that fits flush and solid with the back of the pistol. Has anyone heard of such a modification to a 1911 style gun?

July 8, 2009, 10:46 AM	#8
Sarge43 Senior Member Join Date: November 6, 2008 Location: Kansas City Posts: 503	I wouldn't do that to a carry gun. Can you imagine that life takes a downhill turn for a moment and you actually have to use your weapon in self defense and shoot someone? You then have to face a jury who sees the pitiful plaintiff sitting there with his colostomy bag hanging on his chair, or worse, a picture of the now dead plaintiff and you have to explain why you willfully disabled one of the main safety devices on the weapon you used to shoot him? BAD scene. Just another line of thought on it if it's a carry weapon. Good luck! Sarge __________________ Exotic wood addict and grip maker www.shop.thefinergrain.com

July 8, 2009, 10:57 AM	#10
Dust Monkey Senior Member Join Date: April 24, 2007 Posts: 723	Novaks "Answer" looks like a good part. Might have to try it. As far as having to use a modified firearm in self defense, I don't think the fact that you had a professional smith modify it will subject you to smoking a big ** in hades. If it's a good shoot, it's a good shoot. No matter what weapon is used. And don't reply with the 10mm incident of Mr Fish. That had nothing to do with a gun or caliber. That was a case of a lawyer having his head up, well you get the point. __________________ Civilian Date: 14 Century 1 : a specialist in Roman or modern civil law. If you are not subject to the UCMJ, you are a Civilian. I don't care one bit what updated dictionaries say.**

July 8, 2009, 12:20 PM	#12
Sarge43 Senior Member Join Date: November 6, 2008 Location: Kansas City Posts: 503	Fair enough. I agree that a good shoot wouldn't be corrupted by the modification, but it seems it would serve to drag out the process by being one more thing they will bring up that will take time, which in turn is money burning through your pocket. I'm just thinking out loud. I wish you well! I'd love to see pics of the Novak modification if that's the direction you go. Sarge __________________ Exotic wood addict and grip maker www.shop.thefinergrain.com

July 8, 2009, 01:11 PM	#16
Mike Irwin Staff Join Date: April 13, 2000 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 41,383	I can't say that the grip safety has ever bothered me, on either my 1911 or on my Vis 35 Radom. __________________ "The gift which I am sending you is called a dog, and is in fact the most precious and valuable possession of mankind" -Theodorus Gaza Baby Jesus cries when the fat redneck doesn't have military-grade firepower.

July 8, 2009, 10:07 AM	#2
AirForceShooter Senior Member Join Date: December 21, 2005 Location: Sarasota (sort of) Florida Posts: 1,296	I happen to think just the opposite of you but it's your choice. The grip safety can be pinned rendering it completely non-fuctional. Any gun smith can do it. I don't use the thumb safety. AFS

July 8, 2009, 10:18 AM	#4
Christian James Senior Member Join Date: July 5, 2007 Posts: 168	Novak makes one. It's called the Answer. I don't think you can just buy the part, you'll have to send it into Novak's shop.

July 8, 2009, 10:23 AM	#5
ReNtaPiG Senior Member Join Date: June 18, 2009 Posts: 310	I like the grip safety on the 1911 for novelty purposes only!!! Now if you ask me about the XD's I'll say I hate it!!!

July 8, 2009, 10:26 AM	#6
csmsss Senior Member Join Date: October 24, 2008 Location: Orange, TX Posts: 3,078	For the life of me, I cannot understand the objection to the 1911 grip safety. Take a solid grip of the thing, and you don't even notice it's there.

July 8, 2009, 12:30 PM	#13
Huntergirl Senior Member Join Date: January 8, 2005 Location: Wyoming Posts: 907	Geez, I love the grip safety on my 1911's and that was a big motivator for me to get an XD45. But I understand that others may not like it.

July 8, 2009, 01:09 PM	#15
TenmaNeko Member Join Date: June 10, 2009 Location: Ohio Posts: 62	Quote: "It was put there for a reason and has worked well for >100 years" "What year are we in again?" 2009. The grip safety existed on the Colt 1903, so that's more than 100 years.

July 8, 2009, 01:19 PM	#17
drail Junior member Join Date: February 2, 2008 Posts: 3,150	In my experience the grip safety is of questionable value since it only blocks the trigger. It can be a real problem for some people when the factory has fitted it in such a way that it requires being fully depressed to disengage. This problem is very easily corrected by a knowledgeable smith. Grip safeties can be adjusted to release with very little movement and many have had this done or had it completely deactivated. If you have a problem getting yours to release the trigger have a 1991 smith adjust it. You should not have to chicken choke your gun to make it fire. When it is adjusted properly you will not even know it is there.

July 8, 2009, 01:22 PM	#18
Mike Irwin Staff Join Date: April 13, 2000 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 41,383	The grip safety apparently came about because the Army, specifically the cavalry, wanted that extra layer of protection against a trooper putting a round into either his thigh or his mount. At least that's the story I heard. JM Browning didn't agree with them, but he added it to keep the gun moving through acceptance testing. Browning dropped the grip safety on the High Power. The Soviets, who copied liberally from the 1911, also dropped the grip safety in the TT-30 series of handguns. __________________ "The gift which I am sending you is called a dog, and is in fact the most precious and valuable possession of mankind" -Theodorus Gaza Baby Jesus cries when the fat redneck doesn't have military-grade firepower.

July 8, 2009, 01:23 PM	#19
TJH3781 Senior Member Join Date: June 17, 2009 Location: Rockford IL Posts: 149	Sometimes available on the various auction sites. Arminex 1 Piece Backstrap.

July 8, 2009, 01:24 PM	#20
Skans Senior Member Join Date: November 20, 2008 Posts: 11,132	Thanks Vhinch and TJ - that's exactly what I am looking for. Need to do some reading up on this, but I think this might just be the answer. It would go a long way making it feel a little more like my Hi-Power.

July 8, 2009, 01:53 PM	#21
TJH3781 Senior Member Join Date: June 17, 2009 Location: Rockford IL Posts: 149	If you find an Arminex, make sure it comes with a sear spring. It is different than a standard Colt spring.

July 8, 2009, 02:43 PM	#22
jmr40 Senior Member Join Date: June 15, 2008 Location: Georgia Posts: 10,806	I'm in the camp that believes the grip safety serves no purpose except to make people who do not understand how the gun works feel safer. John Browning didn't want one and virtually no other gun ever made except for the XD and a few others have managed to survive for decades with no problems. I would agree that it does not really cause any problems, it's just a useless addition to the gun.

July 8, 2009, 06:26 PM	#24
TenmaNeko Member Join Date: June 10, 2009 Location: Ohio Posts: 62	That's okay, so was I!

July 8, 2009, 07:59 PM	#25
Mike Irwin Staff Join Date: April 13, 2000 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 41,383	I seem to recall early Lugers having a grip safety, which was eliminated on the German military version... __________________ "The gift which I am sending you is called a dog, and is in fact the most precious and valuable possession of mankind" -Theodorus Gaza Baby Jesus cries when the fat redneck doesn't have military-grade firepower.