Empty Case not chambering and locking

fpchief · June 10, 2010, 08:32 PM

Is there any reason a empty case that has been sized and trimmed will not allow a bolt rifle to fully lock? Just checking out the sizing of some match brass and have put it in the sizer. Tried a few pieces in a rem 700 and it will drop in the chamber fine, but when i go to lock the bolt, it will not cam all the way over, actually just about a 1/4 way is all it will go.

chris in va · June 10, 2010, 08:33 PM

Sized, but not trimmed yet I suspect.

Edit...sorry didn't see the first part. Are you trying to close the bolt over a 'round' already chambered?

mrawesome22 · June 10, 2010, 08:40 PM

You are not bumping the shoulder back far enough. Screw your size die in another 1/4 turn.

fpchief · June 10, 2010, 08:46 PM

Sized and trimmed.

fpchief · June 10, 2010, 08:52 PM

OK, very new to loading the .308. Never had this issue with needing to set the die (5.56) any different than just letting it hit the shellplate then locking down. So i assume that i simply set the die like normal, back off the shellholder and turn it 1/4 turn and lock it back down? Sorry for the questions, just never had this before.

briandg · June 10, 2010, 08:53 PM

When you return your bolt, is it returning the cartridge with it?
if not, your extractor is not pushing over the rim.

Just for grins, take one of those sized and prepped cases, and load a bullet into it to use as a test dummy. (no primer!) You can pull the bullet afterwards. See if it will close on this dummy of a completed round.

fpchief · June 10, 2010, 08:55 PM

the extractor is going over the rim, just not going into chamber enough for bolt to lock.

ScottRiqui · June 10, 2010, 08:58 PM

Are you using a neck-sizing die or a full-length sizing die?

fpchief · June 10, 2010, 09:06 PM

Full length.

SL1 · June 11, 2010, 06:58 AM

When you fire a cartridge in your chamber, the case diameter is increased (and the length may go either way, depending on a lot of factors). When you resize that case to a smaller diameter, it tends to make the case longer. If the die is not screwed in far enough, then the extra length ends up in the body between the head and the shoulder. If the die is screwed in further, then the extra length will end-up in the neck.

So, a case that WILL let the bolt lock (after firing, extraction and reinsertion) BEFORE sizing, but then will NOT let the bolt lock AFTER sizing is an indication that your die is not setting the case shoulder back enough when you resize.

If you have a reasonably tight chamber, so that the case diameter stretch is small when the cartridge is fired, you can usually shoot a case several times WITHOUT bumping the shoulder back when you resize for several reloads. But, if you have a gun with an overly-large chamber diameter or are shooting overly-hot powder charges, then you can easily need to bump the shoulder after a single firing.

SL1

GP100man · June 11, 2010, 08:10 AM

My Remington 700 chamber is tite also , if I don`t clean & lube the inside of the neck it`ll pull the shoulder back out on the expander ball just enuff to cause problems .

On certain brands & lots of brass the necks are thick enuff to cause this problem anyways , but few & far inbetween these days .

Hope this helps

steve4102 · June 11, 2010, 04:56 PM

Quote:

You are not bumping the shoulder back far enough. Screw your size die in another 1/4 turn.

Start here!

fpchief · June 11, 2010, 05:59 PM

Thanks for the help. WIll give it a try as soon as i get time.

TXGunNut · June 12, 2010, 07:33 PM

What brand dies? My new Super Grade has a tight chamber, cases sized in my new Redding dies seem to chamber better with it than my old Hornady's. Shoulder seems a bit sharper as well. Big fan of Hornady products but in this case Redding seems to be worth the few extra bucks. With the price of components these days dies seem cheap. I'll spring for the Redding again, they work great for me in .35 Remington as well.

oneoldsap · June 12, 2010, 08:17 PM

I started out with all different brands of dies , but over the years I've swapped 90% of them to Reddings !!

TXGunNut · June 12, 2010, 09:05 PM

Oneoldsap, I hate to think of all the money and trouble I'd have saved if I'd spent a few extra bucks on Redding dies every time I bought rifle dies over the years (OK, decades!). Other dies are a bit cheaper and easier to find but Redding's may very well be worth it. I suspect the competition and specialty dies are better but for the level of shooting I do they seem to be what I need.

June 10, 2010, 08:32 PM	#1
fpchief Senior Member Join Date: February 12, 2010 Posts: 122	Empty Case not chambering and locking Is there any reason a empty case that has been sized and trimmed will not allow a bolt rifle to fully lock? Just checking out the sizing of some match brass and have put it in the sizer. Tried a few pieces in a rem 700 and it will drop in the chamber fine, but when i go to lock the bolt, it will not cam all the way over, actually just about a 1/4 way is all it will go.

June 11, 2010, 08:10 AM	#11
GP100man Senior Member Join Date: August 1, 2007 Location: Tabor City , NC. Posts: 1,969	clean & lube My Remington 700 chamber is tite also , if I don`t clean & lube the inside of the neck it`ll pull the shoulder back out on the expander ball just enuff to cause problems . On certain brands & lots of brass the necks are thick enuff to cause this problem anyways , but few & far inbetween these days . Hope this helps

June 12, 2010, 09:05 PM	#16
TXGunNut Senior Member Join Date: January 16, 2010 Location: If you have to ask... Posts: 2,860	Oneoldsap, I hate to think of all the money and trouble I'd have saved if I'd spent a few extra bucks on Redding dies every time I bought rifle dies over the years (OK, decades!). Other dies are a bit cheaper and easier to find but Redding's may very well be worth it. I suspect the competition and specialty dies are better but for the level of shooting I do they seem to be what I need. Last edited by TXGunNut; June 12, 2010 at 09:07 PM. Reason: because I always do it

June 10, 2010, 08:33 PM	#2
chris in va Senior Member Join Date: December 26, 2004 Location: Louisville KY Posts: 13,806	Sized, but not trimmed yet I suspect. Edit...sorry didn't see the first part. Are you trying to close the bolt over a 'round' already chambered?

June 10, 2010, 08:40 PM	#3
mrawesome22 Senior Member Join Date: November 9, 2005 Location: Ohio, Appalachia's foothills. Posts: 3,779	You are not bumping the shoulder back far enough. Screw your size die in another 1/4 turn.

June 10, 2010, 08:46 PM	#4
fpchief Senior Member Join Date: February 12, 2010 Posts: 122	Sized and trimmed.

June 10, 2010, 08:52 PM	#5
fpchief Senior Member Join Date: February 12, 2010 Posts: 122	OK, very new to loading the .308. Never had this issue with needing to set the die (5.56) any different than just letting it hit the shellplate then locking down. So i assume that i simply set the die like normal, back off the shellholder and turn it 1/4 turn and lock it back down? Sorry for the questions, just never had this before.

June 10, 2010, 08:53 PM	#6
briandg Senior Member Join Date: May 4, 2010 Posts: 5,468	When you return your bolt, is it returning the cartridge with it? if not, your extractor is not pushing over the rim. Just for grins, take one of those sized and prepped cases, and load a bullet into it to use as a test dummy. (no primer!) You can pull the bullet afterwards. See if it will close on this dummy of a completed round.

June 10, 2010, 08:55 PM	#7
fpchief Senior Member Join Date: February 12, 2010 Posts: 122	the extractor is going over the rim, just not going into chamber enough for bolt to lock.

June 10, 2010, 08:58 PM	#8
ScottRiqui Senior Member Join Date: January 27, 2010 Location: Norfolk, VA Posts: 2,905	Are you using a neck-sizing die or a full-length sizing die?

June 10, 2010, 09:06 PM	#9
fpchief Senior Member Join Date: February 12, 2010 Posts: 122	Full length.

June 11, 2010, 06:58 AM	#10
SL1 Senior Member Join Date: November 8, 2007 Posts: 2,001	When you fire a cartridge in your chamber, the case diameter is increased (and the length may go either way, depending on a lot of factors). When you resize that case to a smaller diameter, it tends to make the case longer. If the die is not screwed in far enough, then the extra length ends up in the body between the head and the shoulder. If the die is screwed in further, then the extra length will end-up in the neck. So, a case that WILL let the bolt lock (after firing, extraction and reinsertion) BEFORE sizing, but then will NOT let the bolt lock AFTER sizing is an indication that your die is not setting the case shoulder back enough when you resize. If you have a reasonably tight chamber, so that the case diameter stretch is small when the cartridge is fired, you can usually shoot a case several times WITHOUT bumping the shoulder back when you resize for several reloads. But, if you have a gun with an overly-large chamber diameter or are shooting overly-hot powder charges, then you can easily need to bump the shoulder after a single firing. SL1

June 11, 2010, 05:59 PM	#13
fpchief Senior Member Join Date: February 12, 2010 Posts: 122	Thanks for the help. WIll give it a try as soon as i get time.

June 12, 2010, 07:33 PM	#14
TXGunNut Senior Member Join Date: January 16, 2010 Location: If you have to ask... Posts: 2,860	What brand dies? My new Super Grade has a tight chamber, cases sized in my new Redding dies seem to chamber better with it than my old Hornady's. Shoulder seems a bit sharper as well. Big fan of Hornady products but in this case Redding seems to be worth the few extra bucks. With the price of components these days dies seem cheap. I'll spring for the Redding again, they work great for me in .35 Remington as well.

June 12, 2010, 08:17 PM	#15
oneoldsap Senior Member Join Date: September 16, 2009 Location: I live in the foot of the Green Mountains of Vermont Posts: 1,602	I started out with all different brands of dies , but over the years I've swapped 90% of them to Reddings !!