Barrel Life, general

dburkhead · August 27, 2008, 09:29 AM

How long do rifle barrels usually last? (I know, that's probably a "how long is a piece of string" or "how high is up" type question.) And how do you determine that a barrel is worn out? Someone in another forum somewhere (yeah, real good cite there

)mentioned AR barrels lasting 3-5,000 rounds before needing to be replaced.

Well, I've probably already run that much through my 10/22. So am I likely at or near "new barrel" territory?

dipper · August 27, 2008, 09:38 AM

Depends on a number of things---caliber, cleaning procedures, powder choice are some.

If you are talking about a rifle barrel in standard or stainless steel ( not chrome lined) a "very general" estimate would be between 1,200 rounds to 6,000 or so rounds again depending on above listed factors.
People have burned up a barrel in as little as 800 or less rounds---I saw a 220 swift shot out in 2 varmit hunts with about 800 or so rounds down the tube.

22 rimfire barrels last "almost" forever.

Brian Pfleuger · August 27, 2008, 09:38 AM

Barrel life is strongly linked to the velocity of the round, a 10/22 barrel will last a mighty long time practically unlimited, especially if your not talking about competition type accuracy.

Your shooting low speed, low pressure, soft lead bullets.

If your not having problems with accuracy, your barrel is fine.

surg_res · August 27, 2008, 09:38 AM

I would own a spare rifle (or at least a spare barrel) of any rifle that I casually put 3-5k rounds through. Now is the time to buy it--that is with political uncertainty.

Jim Watson · August 27, 2008, 09:42 AM

peetzakilla is right. Barrel life of a .22 lr is in on the close order of 50,000 rounds, and that for target rifles. You might wear out the action of a sporter like 10-22 before the barrel faded enough to tell.

Scorch · August 27, 2008, 12:26 PM

Two major factors in determining barrel life are powder burn temperature and the pressure the cartridge operates at. So in general, higher pressures mean shorter barrel life. People discussing barrel life often discuss powder charge, velocity, and pressure as equally hard on barrels. Since you burn more powder to get higher pressure to get higher velocity, there is some correlation between the three.

In a standard cartridge operating at 55,000-58,000 psi like the 308 Winchester, you can get up to 8,000-10,000 rounds through a barrel before the barrel is worn so much that accuracy detoriorates. In a varminting cartridge like the 220 Swift or a 22-250, barrel life can be as high as 5,000 rounds or as low as 1,000. A 223 will likley have a similar barrel life to a 308 or a 30-06 unless you shoot it until the barrel smokes. A 22LR can shoot hundreds of thousands of rounds before needing a new barrel due to low operating pressure, low velocity, and dead soft lead bullets.

Magnum Wheel Man · August 27, 2008, 01:21 PM

Quote:

Two major factors in determining barrel life are powder burn temperature and the pressure the cartridge operates at. So in general, higher pressures mean shorter barrel life. People discussing barrel life often discuss powder charge, velocity, and pressure as equally hard on barrels. Since you burn more powder to get higher pressure to get higher velocity, there is some correlation between the three.

add to that the twist rate, projectile weight, & barrel material & projectile hardness (s)... & to a lesser degree the type & depth of rifling...

the biggest factor for most cartridge / barrels is throat errosion, & Scorch's post hits that nail on the head... rifling can & does wear out... effected by velocity & twist rate, bullet hardness, & barrel material hardness, type & depth of rifling...

...to your 10-22... if your accuracy is going... I see a couple of likely culprits ( the bullets are softer, so it's unlikey its worn out ), but shooting unplated Remington Thunderbolts, I leaded up my barrel so badly in one afternoon, that you could not even see any rifling... also... it is said, that more 22 barrels are wrecked ever year by claening than by shooting... so if the crown got boogered up by your cleaning rod or brush end that could be the cause also...

dburkhead · August 27, 2008, 01:48 PM

It's not that the accuracy on my 10/22 is going particularly (my own skill--or lack thereof--is the long pole in that tent by a long shot). It's just that I'd seen that comment about AR barrels and recently added up the number of bricks of ammo I've shot since getting the rifle and saw that they were very much in the same ballpark. It got me to wondering

Wildebees · August 27, 2008, 04:54 PM

When I started target shooting on the Bisley circuit our Air Force local shooting club gave me a 7.62x51 target rifle built onto a Lee Enfiels action. I was told that the rifle's shooting log showed it had consumed just under 18 000 rounds of military ball. It shot me into the Air Force team at the National Bisley.

My 1974 Musgrave .308W has now done more than 12 000. This past weekend my son again got a 4-shot single ragged hole at 100m. His own Musgrave 30-06 gives moa, but not much better.

Darren007 · August 27, 2008, 05:43 PM

The only thing that you should be concerned about in regards to barrel life, is not how many rounds have been fired through the barrel, but rather when its performance is no longer satisfactory for you.

I know competition shooters who will rebarrel their rifle after only about 500 rnds. Is that barrel shot out??? Not by a long shot. But it is no longer capable of the pin point accuracy that type of shooter is going for. Give that barrel to a varmint shooter and it will perform just fine. Give it to a hunter and its the last barrel hell ever use or need.

On the flip side. Ask any die hard mil surp collector (like myself) and theyll tell you too. I've seen barrels that looked almost new, on rifles that were in excellent condition, shoot horrible groups no matter what ammo was used. And I've shot rifles that had barrels full of pitting that would shoot 2-3" groups at 100 yards with iron sights.

Bottom line IMHO.....The barrel is "shot out" not when an X number of rounds have been fired, but rather, when your expectations of what you want your barrel to do are no longer being met.

Wildebees · August 28, 2008, 04:31 AM

"The barrel is "shot out" not when an X number of rounds have been fired, but rather, when your expectations of what you want your barrel to do are no longer being met."

At least one does after 12 000 rounds what I want a new rifle to do!

more than 12 000. This past weekend my son again got a 4-shot single ragged hole at 100m.

King Ghidora · August 28, 2008, 02:23 PM

If a barrel is totally worn out you can see it. In fact you can often tell just how bad a barrel is just by looking at it. I've seen grooves worn completely down but that's usually on pistols. But a rifle can suffer the same fate. I just wanted to add this for those who might be looking at a used rifle or pistol. If you see a smooth surface with the bluing practically gone you can be sure it's a worn out barrel. You might also see lead built up in a barrle making it look like the grooves are gone. I'm not sure if a barrel like that can be cleaned of the lead or not but if I saw that in a used gun I was considering I would be on my way looking for another gun soon.

Then there's pitting of course. But that's generally a problem of bad cleaning habits. It could be too much cleaning but mostly it's too little so that rust does it's thing.

The true measure is in the shooting though. Most barrels aren't noticeably worn as bad as I have described but I have seen flea market type dealers who almost specialize in worn out guns. If you see prices that are too good to be true usually they are.

August 27, 2008, 09:29 AM	#1
dburkhead Senior Member Join Date: March 10, 2008 Posts: 116	Barrel Life, general How long do rifle barrels usually last? (I know, that's probably a "how long is a piece of string" or "how high is up" type question.) And how do you determine that a barrel is worn out? Someone in another forum somewhere (yeah, real good cite there )mentioned AR barrels lasting 3-5,000 rounds before needing to be replaced. Well, I've probably already run that much through my 10/22. So am I likely at or near "new barrel" territory? __________________ The award winning fantasy series "Heroes in Hell" returns this July with the new collection "Lawyers in Hell." http://heroesinhell.wordpress.com/ Including a new story by David L. Burkhead

August 27, 2008, 09:38 AM	#2
dipper Senior Member Join Date: April 6, 2008 Posts: 895	Depends on a number of things---caliber, cleaning procedures, powder choice are some. If you are talking about a rifle barrel in standard or stainless steel ( not chrome lined) a "very general" estimate would be between 1,200 rounds to 6,000 or so rounds again depending on above listed factors. People have burned up a barrel in as little as 800 or less rounds---I saw a 220 swift shot out in 2 varmit hunts with about 800 or so rounds down the tube. 22 rimfire barrels last "almost" forever. __________________ --------------------------------------------------------- "It is better to die on your feet than live on your knees" EMILIANO ZAPATA SALAZAR

August 27, 2008, 09:38 AM	#3
Brian Pfleuger Moderator Emeritus Join Date: June 25, 2008 Location: Austin, CO Posts: 19,578	Barrel life is strongly linked to the velocity of the round, a 10/22 barrel will last a mighty long time practically unlimited, especially if your not talking about competition type accuracy. Your shooting low speed, low pressure, soft lead bullets. If your not having problems with accuracy, your barrel is fine. __________________ Nobody plans to screw up their lives... ...they just don't plan not to. -Andy Stanley

August 27, 2008, 09:38 AM	#4
surg_res Senior Member Join Date: September 29, 2005 Location: Texas, 5th GEN! Posts: 621	I would own a spare rifle (or at least a spare barrel) of any rifle that I casually put 3-5k rounds through. Now is the time to buy it--that is with political uncertainty. __________________ ----

August 27, 2008, 12:26 PM	#6
Scorch Senior Member Join Date: February 13, 2006 Location: Washington state Posts: 15,248	Two major factors in determining barrel life are powder burn temperature and the pressure the cartridge operates at. So in general, higher pressures mean shorter barrel life. People discussing barrel life often discuss powder charge, velocity, and pressure as equally hard on barrels. Since you burn more powder to get higher pressure to get higher velocity, there is some correlation between the three. In a standard cartridge operating at 55,000-58,000 psi like the 308 Winchester, you can get up to 8,000-10,000 rounds through a barrel before the barrel is worn so much that accuracy detoriorates. In a varminting cartridge like the 220 Swift or a 22-250, barrel life can be as high as 5,000 rounds or as low as 1,000. A 223 will likley have a similar barrel life to a 308 or a 30-06 unless you shoot it until the barrel smokes. A 22LR can shoot hundreds of thousands of rounds before needing a new barrel due to low operating pressure, low velocity, and dead soft lead bullets. __________________ Never try to educate someone who resists knowledge at all costs. But what do I know? Summit Arms Services

August 27, 2008, 09:42 AM	#5
Jim Watson Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2001 Location: Alabama Posts: 18,581	peetzakilla is right. Barrel life of a .22 lr is in on the close order of 50,000 rounds, and that for target rifles. You might wear out the action of a sporter like 10-22 before the barrel faded enough to tell.

August 27, 2008, 01:48 PM	#8
dburkhead Senior Member Join Date: March 10, 2008 Posts: 116	It's not that the accuracy on my 10/22 is going particularly (my own skill--or lack thereof--is the long pole in that tent by a long shot). It's just that I'd seen that comment about AR barrels and recently added up the number of bricks of ammo I've shot since getting the rifle and saw that they were very much in the same ballpark. It got me to wondering __________________ The award winning fantasy series "Heroes in Hell" returns this July with the new collection "Lawyers in Hell." http://heroesinhell.wordpress.com/ Including a new story by David L. Burkhead

August 27, 2008, 04:54 PM	#9
Wildebees Member Join Date: August 9, 2008 Location: Pretoria, South Africa Posts: 89	Old steel and olden ways, maybe... When I started target shooting on the Bisley circuit our Air Force local shooting club gave me a 7.62x51 target rifle built onto a Lee Enfiels action. I was told that the rifle's shooting log showed it had consumed just under 18 000 rounds of military ball. It shot me into the Air Force team at the National Bisley. My 1974 Musgrave .308W has now done more than 12 000. This past weekend my son again got a 4-shot single ragged hole at 100m. His own Musgrave 30-06 gives moa, but not much better. __________________ "Do you not know that all human ills and mean-spiritedness and cowardice arise not from death but from fear of death? Against this therefor fortify yourself....then you shall find that by this alone are men made free."

August 27, 2008, 05:43 PM	#10
Darren007 Senior Member Join Date: November 18, 2007 Location: Colorado Posts: 1,053	The only thing that you should be concerned about in regards to barrel life, is not how many rounds have been fired through the barrel, but rather when its performance is no longer satisfactory for you. I know competition shooters who will rebarrel their rifle after only about 500 rnds. Is that barrel shot out??? Not by a long shot. But it is no longer capable of the pin point accuracy that type of shooter is going for. Give that barrel to a varmint shooter and it will perform just fine. Give it to a hunter and its the last barrel hell ever use or need. On the flip side. Ask any die hard mil surp collector (like myself) and theyll tell you too. I've seen barrels that looked almost new, on rifles that were in excellent condition, shoot horrible groups no matter what ammo was used. And I've shot rifles that had barrels full of pitting that would shoot 2-3" groups at 100 yards with iron sights. Bottom line IMHO.....The barrel is "shot out" not when an X number of rounds have been fired, but rather, when your expectations of what you want your barrel to do are no longer being met.

August 28, 2008, 04:31 AM	#11
Wildebees Member Join Date: August 9, 2008 Location: Pretoria, South Africa Posts: 89	*"The barrel is "shot out" not when an X number of rounds have been fired, but rather, when your expectations of what you want your barrel to do are no longer being met."* At least one does after 12 000 rounds what I want a new rifle to do! *more than 12 000. This past weekend my son again got a 4-shot single ragged hole at 100m.* __________________ "Do you not know that all human ills and mean-spiritedness and cowardice arise not from death but from fear of death? Against this therefor fortify yourself....then you shall find that by this alone are men made free."

August 28, 2008, 02:23 PM	#12
King Ghidora Junior member Join Date: April 7, 2008 Location: SE Ohio Posts: 584	If a barrel is totally worn out you can see it. In fact you can often tell just how bad a barrel is just by looking at it. I've seen grooves worn completely down but that's usually on pistols. But a rifle can suffer the same fate. I just wanted to add this for those who might be looking at a used rifle or pistol. If you see a smooth surface with the bluing practically gone you can be sure it's a worn out barrel. You might also see lead built up in a barrle making it look like the grooves are gone. I'm not sure if a barrel like that can be cleaned of the lead or not but if I saw that in a used gun I was considering I would be on my way looking for another gun soon. Then there's pitting of course. But that's generally a problem of bad cleaning habits. It could be too much cleaning but mostly it's too little so that rust does it's thing. The true measure is in the shooting though. Most barrels aren't noticeably worn as bad as I have described but I have seen flea market type dealers who almost specialize in worn out guns. If you see prices that are too good to be true usually they are.