Why I SHOULD have carried a gun - Page 4

pax · December 3, 2002, 09:48 PM

Wow again, Elizabeth. Kudos to your agency for coming to their senses so quickly -- and to you for getting them to do so!

I'm starting the Elizabeth Peterson fan club. Anyone else want to join?

pax

Elizabeth Petersen · December 3, 2002, 10:05 PM

Pax, you know what the hardest part of all this was? How to tell my husband, who is serving overseas right now. He's due home this Thursday, and I was having a hard time deciding if I should tell him when he called me last night, or if I should wait until he was home.

I had decided to wait, but unfortunately, my plan was completely blown out of the water by a (well intentioned) friend who emailed him with the details before I could tell him.

Needless to say, it was a rather emotional phonecall.

Monkeyleg · December 3, 2002, 10:44 PM

Elizabeth, good going all around!

BTW, does the newly-established position for your employer regarding CCW have anything to do with the fact that you're in UT? I mean, I can't imagine that happening here in WI (even if we did have legal carry).

Have you ever thought of finding less "involving" work?

Brian Williams · December 3, 2002, 10:50 PM

I am impressed. Kudos for Big ones and a level head. Also kudos to your partner for following your protocol and getting the Kids out.

Powderman · December 3, 2002, 10:57 PM

OUTSTANDING!!!!

This sounds like both agencies involved have their heads together!!

May I suggest some good training concerning defensive tactics in close quarters? You do have SOME options, and they can be rather effective.

No, it is NOT the best way to handle things. But, there are methods to employ and use, once learned, that at least will give you a fighting chance at survival.

If I might suggest, contact the folks here:

www.calibrepress.com

to be pointed in the right direction.

Good luck, and God Bless.

PS: Don't be alarmed that your husband is upset. It is normal to be mildly perturbed when the person you care about the most in the world is threatened. (tongue planted FIRMLY in cheek)

Chugach · December 3, 2002, 10:58 PM

I'll join many others here and commend you for your intelligence, engagement and calm in the face of death. You stayed in the game long enough and cool-headed enough to keep yourselves and others safe. My very best regards and respect to you for exceptionally fine work! Kudos to your partner as well! I only hope I'll do as well if ever faced with a similar situation.

Elizabeth Petersen · December 3, 2002, 11:03 PM

Monkeyleg, I thought I HAD gotten into less dangerous work when I retired from EMS.

I do think, however, that the pro-2ndA attitude here in Utah made my agency's decision to let me carry an easy one.

However, I have also decided to exercise my legal right (as per Utah law) to open carry, and have the local PD's blessing. And as for my bosses at Crisis Services, well...they're just gonna have to deal with it, or find someone else. PERIOD. Sometimes, the best defense is a (visual) offense.

Either way, I hope the sight of a Colt 1991A1 strapped to my hip will dissuade any future shenanigans. (I'll still keep the compact .40 in the conceal holster, though.)

Nothing like a little life or death experience to reinforce the necessity...No the ABSOLUTE IMPORTANCE...of fighting for our Second Amendment rights.

Johnny Guest · December 4, 2002, 12:21 PM

- - -having such an enlightened attitude.

A couple of aspects to consider, re open carry - - -
Might this be considered by some as confrontational, rather than a deterrant? There ARE those who might "shut down" in spite of your best intentions to help their situation, if they perceive that you are all set to solve the matter by gunfire.

Also, a potential bad guy might just decide to sneak up and launch an unannounced attack.

Another aspect is that the news media will be certain to publicize "Pistol Packin' Crisis Intervention Worker - - -Ready to solve problems one way or the other!!!"

I would very much hate to learn that public pressure from the blissninnys caused your agency to retract their very rational ruling regarding concealed carry. Please don't think I'm other than supportive about your going armed. It's just that, Sneaky is a GOOD Thing.

On the other matter - - -Notification of loved ones concerning an already-resolved life threatening situation is always problematical. I trust your spouse will understand your perspective, and that this is/was about YOU and no one else, until somewhat later on . . . .

Best wishes always,
Johnny

Hemicuda · December 4, 2002, 12:31 PM

Wow... Lizardbreath... (sorry, bad joke from the comic "For better or worse"...)

scary...

glad you are still with us here in the world of the living!

and, I agree... negotiate with someone who has a gun pointed at you???

sure, RIGHT... 2 things!- make ABSOLUTELY SURE that you are armed, and then drop a couplr "center of mass"...

like I said, SCARY!

Futo Inu · December 4, 2002, 01:50 PM

Glad you made it out alive! Whew.

Ben Swenson · December 4, 2002, 03:50 PM

Quote:

"Pistol Packin' Crisis Intervention Worker - - -Ready to solve problems one way or the other!!!"

Hmmm ... does this qualify Liz'beth as a "Tactical Crisis Intervention Worker"?

Good choice of gun, by the by.

Spectre · December 4, 2002, 04:09 PM

Glad, REAL glad you're still with us. Also glad your agency has a bit of sense, and can learn.

Elizabeth Petersen · December 4, 2002, 09:58 PM

Quote:

Wow... Lizardbreath... (sorry, bad joke from the comic "For better or worse"...)

No apologies necessary. My "brother from another mother" has long called me that.

Johnny, I thought long and hard about the possible "side effects" of my decision to open carry, but honestly, here in Utah, it just ain't that big o' deal. Honestly, the victims of domestic violence have already had extensive contact with PD, so the sight of crisis worker openly carrying probably won't cause them to bat an eye. And, perhaps, it just might make some [color=#FF0000]█[/color][color=#FF0000]█[/color][color=#FF0000]█[/color][color=#FF0000]█[/color][color=#FF0000]█[/color]bird who thinks with his fists first to reconsider any dumbarse acts of violent retribution against Yours Truly and the victims I have taken into safe keeping.

Besides, as far as I am concerned, the "scare the BG into second thoughts" benefit by far outweighs any care I have for whom it might offend. (Translation: the bliss ninnies can kiss my freckled Irish butt.)

My agency checked with their legal staff about us crisis workers packing, and so far, no problems there.

All in all, if anyone decides to pitch a whiny fit over my decision to open carry...well, they are more than welcome to do what I do sans protection. More power to 'em.

Elizabeth Petersen · December 4, 2002, 10:17 PM

Spectre...

WOW. Never thought I'd say something worth of a person's tagline. I'm truly honored.

Thank you, sir.

Johnny Guest · December 8, 2002, 02:15 PM

Liz, my remarks were just for general consideration. Your situation, your job--You know the ground and I don't, et cetera.

I wish things were as enlightened around here. My beloved former wife (--No joke; still good friends. Very classy gal, she - -) is a counselor and caseworker for State Child Protective Services. Seems it's worth her job if found going armed. The crisis is SUPPOSED to be past when she's in counseling mode, but there have been some threats and so forth. She has her own revolver and one of mine, and I've offered free CHL training and license fee, but she won't accept (yet.) She occasionally carries in her car but won't take a gun into office or a private home . . . .

I keep teling her it would be easier to find her another position than to replace the girls' gran - - - Oh, well, I guess OC spray is better than nothin' - - -

All best,
Johnny

PS--Is your Old Man home yet? Has he wrapped his mind around this thing pretty well?
Best to him, too . . .

mister rogers · December 9, 2002, 02:03 AM

Elizabeth,

I'm confused by your decision to open carry, as given the incident you described, it sounds like concealed carry would have been preferable, as the BG suprised you and if you had been carrying openly he would have known you were armed and disarmed you before letting his guard down. It also doesn't sound like open carry would have deterred him as he wouldn't have known you were carrying before he entered.

Spectre · December 9, 2002, 02:34 AM

Elizabeth,

I'm going to take my final Criminal Justice 101 exam in about 5 minutes. For the first time in my life, I feel fairly sympathetic towards many being punished in the system. I'm even toying with the idea of becoming a prosecutor, judge, or even probation officer, with the goal of making positive change in some of these folks' lives, giving mercy or leniency where appropriate.

None of which changes my belief that, facing a criminal with a deadly weapon, one should shoot first and question/deliberate/handwring later.

December 3, 2002, 09:48 PM	#76
pax Senior Member Join Date: May 16, 2000 Location: In a state of flux Posts: 7,520	Wow again, Elizabeth. Kudos to your agency for coming to their senses so quickly -- and to you for getting them to do so! I'm starting the Elizabeth Peterson fan club. Anyone else want to join? pax __________________ Kathy Jackson My personal website: Cornered Cat

December 3, 2002, 10:50 PM	#79
Brian Williams Senior Member Join Date: September 4, 2001 Location: Lancaster, PA Posts: 1,289	I am impressed. Kudos for Big ones and a level head. Also kudos to your partner for following your protocol and getting the Kids out. __________________ Brian <><

December 3, 2002, 10:57 PM	#80
Powderman Senior Member Join Date: September 7, 2001 Location: Washington State Posts: 2,166	OUTSTANDING!!!! This sounds like both agencies involved have their heads together!! May I suggest some good training concerning defensive tactics in close quarters? You do have SOME options, and they can be rather effective. No, it is NOT the best way to handle things. But, there are methods to employ and use, once learned, that at least will give you a fighting chance at survival. If I might suggest, contact the folks here: www.calibrepress.com to be pointed in the right direction. Good luck, and God Bless. PS: Don't be alarmed that your husband is upset. It is normal to be mildly perturbed when the person you care about the most in the world is threatened. (tongue planted FIRMLY in cheek) __________________ Hiding in plain sight...

December 4, 2002, 12:21 PM	#83
Johnny Guest Moderator in Memoriam Join Date: August 28, 1999 Location: North Texas Posts: 4,123	Hurrah for your agency - - - - - -having such an enlightened attitude. A couple of aspects to consider, re open carry - - - Might this be considered by some as confrontational, rather than a deterrant? There ARE those who might "shut down" in spite of your best intentions to help their situation, if they perceive that you are all set to solve the matter by gunfire. Also, a potential bad guy might just decide to sneak up and launch an unannounced attack. Another aspect is that the news media will be certain to publicize "Pistol Packin' Crisis Intervention Worker - - -Ready to solve problems one way or the other!!!" I would very much hate to learn that public pressure from the blissninnys caused your agency to retract their very rational ruling regarding concealed carry. Please don't think I'm other than supportive about your going armed. It's just that, Sneaky is a GOOD Thing. On the other matter - - -Notification of loved ones concerning an already-resolved life threatening situation is always problematical. I trust your spouse will understand your perspective, and that this is/was about YOU and no one else, until somewhat later on . . . . Best wishes always, Johnny

December 4, 2002, 01:50 PM	#85
Futo Inu Senior Member Join Date: February 12, 1999 Location: Oklahoma City, OK, USA Posts: 3,624	Wowsa Glad you made it out alive! Whew.

December 3, 2002, 10:05 PM	#77
Elizabeth Petersen Senior Member Join Date: March 6, 2001 Location: Utah Posts: 571	Pax, you know what the hardest part of all this was? How to tell my husband, who is serving overseas right now. He's due home this Thursday, and I was having a hard time deciding if I should tell him when he called me last night, or if I should wait until he was home. I had decided to wait, but unfortunately, my plan was completely blown out of the water by a (well intentioned) friend who emailed him with the details before I could tell him. Needless to say, it was a rather emotional phonecall.

December 3, 2002, 10:44 PM	#78
Monkeyleg Senior Member Join Date: January 25, 2000 Posts: 4,625	Elizabeth, good going all around! BTW, does the newly-established position for your employer regarding CCW have anything to do with the fact that you're in UT? I mean, I can't imagine that happening here in WI (even if we did have legal carry). Have you ever thought of finding less "involving" work?

December 3, 2002, 10:58 PM	#81
Chugach Senior Member Join Date: July 24, 2002 Location: Alaska Posts: 172	I'll join many others here and commend you for your intelligence, engagement and calm in the face of death. You stayed in the game long enough and cool-headed enough to keep yourselves and others safe. My very best regards and respect to you for exceptionally fine work! Kudos to your partner as well! I only hope I'll do as well if ever faced with a similar situation.

December 3, 2002, 11:03 PM	#82
Elizabeth Petersen Senior Member Join Date: March 6, 2001 Location: Utah Posts: 571	Monkeyleg, I thought I HAD gotten into less dangerous work when I retired from EMS. I do think, however, that the pro-2ndA attitude here in Utah made my agency's decision to let me carry an easy one. However, I have also decided to exercise my legal right (as per Utah law) to open carry, and have the local PD's blessing. And as for my bosses at Crisis Services, well...they're just gonna have to deal with it, or find someone else. PERIOD. Sometimes, the best defense is a (visual) offense. Either way, I hope the sight of a Colt 1991A1 strapped to my hip will dissuade any future shenanigans. (I'll still keep the compact .40 in the conceal holster, though.) Nothing like a little life or death experience to reinforce the necessity...No the ABSOLUTE IMPORTANCE...of fighting for our Second Amendment rights.

December 4, 2002, 12:31 PM	#84
Hemicuda Senior Member Join Date: September 13, 2001 Location: Michigan Posts: 1,757	Wow... Lizardbreath... (sorry, bad joke from the comic "For better or worse"...) scary... glad you are still with us here in the world of the living! and, I agree... negotiate with someone who has a gun pointed at you??? sure, RIGHT... 2 things!- make ABSOLUTELY SURE that you are armed, and then drop a couplr "center of mass"... like I said, SCARY!

December 4, 2002, 04:09 PM	#87
Spectre Staff Alumnus Join Date: October 23, 1998 Location: ATL Posts: 3,277	Glad, REAL glad you're still with us. Also glad your agency has a bit of sense, and can learn. __________________ John Wandering Thoughts

December 4, 2002, 10:17 PM	#89
Elizabeth Petersen Senior Member Join Date: March 6, 2001 Location: Utah Posts: 571	Spectre... WOW. Never thought I'd say something worth of a person's tagline. I'm truly honored. Thank you, sir.

December 8, 2002, 02:15 PM	#90
Johnny Guest Moderator in Memoriam Join Date: August 28, 1999 Location: North Texas Posts: 4,123	You go, Sis - - - Liz, my remarks were just for general consideration. Your situation, your job--You know the ground and I don't, et cetera. I wish things were as enlightened around here. My beloved former wife (--No joke; still good friends. Very classy gal, she - -) is a counselor and caseworker for State Child Protective Services. Seems it's worth her job if found going armed. The crisis is SUPPOSED to be past when she's in counseling mode, but there have been some threats and so forth. She has her own revolver and one of mine, and I've offered free CHL training and license fee, but she won't accept (yet.) She occasionally carries in her car but won't take a gun into office or a private home . . . . I keep teling her it would be easier to find her another position than to replace the girls' gran - - - Oh, well, I guess OC spray is better than nothin' - - - All best, Johnny PS--Is your Old Man home yet? Has he wrapped his mind around this thing pretty well? Best to him, too . . .

December 9, 2002, 02:03 AM	#91
mister rogers Senior Member Join Date: August 16, 2002 Posts: 100	Elizabeth, I'm confused by your decision to open carry, as given the incident you described, it sounds like concealed carry would have been preferable, as the BG suprised you and if you had been carrying openly he would have known you were armed and disarmed you before letting his guard down. It also doesn't sound like open carry would have deterred him as he wouldn't have known you were carrying before he entered.

December 9, 2002, 02:34 AM	#92
Spectre Staff Alumnus Join Date: October 23, 1998 Location: ATL Posts: 3,277	Elizabeth, I'm going to take my final Criminal Justice 101 exam in about 5 minutes. For the first time in my life, I feel fairly sympathetic towards many being punished in the system. I'm even toying with the idea of becoming a prosecutor, judge, or even probation officer, with the goal of making positive change in some of these folks' lives, giving mercy or leniency where appropriate. None of which changes my belief that, facing a criminal with a deadly weapon, one should shoot first and question/deliberate/handwring later. __________________ John Wandering Thoughts