"Ghost Ring" sights on handguns?

Nightcrawler · June 12, 2002, 01:53 PM

Here's a thought. Many agree that apreture sights are better than standard leaf or notch sights on rifles. The larger the aperature, the faster the target acquistion (at the expense of accuracy).

Handgun sights are basically the same as AK-47 sights. Line up the front sight post in the rear sight notch and fire.

Would a large aperature ghost ring sight be a viable choice on a handgun? I think the aperature would have to be somewhat large, given the distance from the eye that handguns are typically held. But, if done properly, could this be a very viable sight choice on a combat handgun? If not, why not?

Zundfolge · June 12, 2002, 02:15 PM

A buddy of mine has a Tokarev with ghost ring sights on it.

I'm sure theres others.

harbinger · June 12, 2002, 03:12 PM

oneraggedhole.com

ronin308 · June 12, 2002, 03:17 PM

This has been done many times in the past. I believe a company called Aro-tek used to even make them for Glocks. The problem with this setup is one of focus. When shooting a ghost ring mounted on a rifle, the ring "disappears" as you naturally focus on the front sight and center it in the large aperture. The ring disappears because on a long gun the aperture is close to your eye. This advantage is negated on a handgun since the aperture is no longer close to your eye. So what you get is a sight that will be no faster or easier to use than a standard setup.

C.R.Sam · June 12, 2002, 03:53 PM

Works great.
Specially with old eyes.
Easy to make.

Sam

popbang · June 12, 2002, 04:56 PM

Aro-tek still makes ghost ring sights. For some people they are easier and quicker to acquire. Your eye will center the front sight in the hole just fine. I have apperature sights on my Glock 36 and my blackhawk I will not go back to standard sights. Try them sometime you might like them.

prisoner6 · June 12, 2002, 05:17 PM

I had ghost ring night sites on a Glock. Liked the sights, not so much the gun, so its gone. They worked fine for pickup, but definitely not for target work.

Kamicosmos · June 12, 2002, 06:00 PM

my friend has the aerteks on his Glock 24P.
He loves them, especially for gun games.
Takes me a few shots to get used to it...like them for bowling pin shoots....kinda "feels" (or should I say "Looks") like a dot sight...

I personally don't have any plans to get any...He had trouble with them snagging during draws at an informal IDPA match.

Bart Noir · June 12, 2002, 07:41 PM

Well, YMMV, but my vote goes against these ring sights, even though I haven't tried them on a pistol. But I did on an SKS carbine, which puts the rear sight at about the same distance from the eye as a pistol sight would. Boy was I disappointed! After many accurate rounds (the older I get, the better I was!) from rifles with "peep" sights, both target and battle versions, I found that the same sort of circle farther from the eye just didn't work. For me. I couldn't center the front sight in that circle, with any consistency. This was with a USMC approved cheek-weld, which you would have to really work at when using a pistol!

Bart Noir
"Let us consider that we are all partially insane. It will explain us to each other." - Mark Twain

pogo2 · June 12, 2002, 07:52 PM

I had Arotek ghost ring sights on my Glock 19 for awhile, with a green fiber optic front sight. I finally decided I didn't like them that well and replaced them with conventional 3-dot sights. At an indoor range there wasn't enough light to illuminate the green dot, so it just looked black, and it was hard to center it in the ghost ring. There also was a lot of border between the ring and the front sight, making it difficult to center. Finally, the ghost ring stuck up much further from the gun than conventional sights, which looked funny.

**JohnKSa** · June 12, 2002, 08:19 PM

I've tried a glock with ghost-ring sights.

I didn't hate it nearly as much as I thought I would. It was quite functional, but still wasn't "right" IMO.

I wouldn't feel handicapped with a gun so equipped, but wouldn't do it to any of mine.

CWL · June 12, 2002, 08:33 PM

Ol' timers seem to like ghost rings more, perhaps due to far-sightedness.

Whether they work or not, ghost rings get complaints because they can be fragile. I think Arotek are pretty solid, but the One Ragged Hole looks flimsy.

Probably good for IDPA/IPSC type usage, maybe not as good for real world.

Onslaught · June 13, 2002, 01:41 PM

Ghost Ring tritium sites for several different pistols....

Entreprise Arms

I've considered putting one on my USP, but I think I like the Ashley Express standard dot better...

ronin308 · June 13, 2002, 07:21 PM

To further illustrate my point, try this simple exercise: Take your strong hand and make a ring with it and take your off hand and make a "front sight" with one of your fingers. First, take the "ghost ring" and put it close to your eye, similar to a rifle. And then take your "front sight" and put it further out, similar to a rifle. You'll notice that the "ghost ring" naturally disappears and you can see your finger clearly. Now do the same, only using the sight radius and eye relief that you would have on a pistol. You'll notice that the "ghost ring" no longer naturally disappears, one must make an effort to focus on the "front sight". This is why I believe ghost rings THEORETICALLY offer no advantage over regular sights. But if they work for you, more power to ya

rkc · June 13, 2002, 07:30 PM

If I am not mistaken Hansen and Awerbuck have Ghost Rings on thier Glocks-----

I have one ragged hole on my Ruger .22 auto. It is way cool and shoots very fast. One of my friends who cannot see well can use it very well.
worth looking into (!)

KP95DAO · June 13, 2002, 07:45 PM

CWL,

"Probably good for IDPA/IPSC type usage, maybe not as good for real world."

Ghost ring sights are not allowed in IDPA competition.

Jim March · June 13, 2002, 07:53 PM

Here's an interesting thought...

Take any of the typical "combat" ghost ring setups with a fairly large apeture, and make a small kydex clip-on cover for it drilled with a smaller apeture "peep sight" for those times when you need long-range accuracy. Most of the time, leave it off. If you need to take a 100yard shot

take out the smaller apeture, clip it on,

.

Should be easy enough to make - cut a bit of kydex 3/4" long and about 1/2" wide or whatever, it'll vary by the sight, heat the kydex, fold it over the sight and pinch it with gloves on. Then drill.

Hemicuda · June 14, 2002, 06:56 AM

I have the "one ragged hole" sight adapted to the adjustable sight on my Dan Wesson .357...

WHATTA sight it is... total sweetness...

so, YES, Nightcrawler, ghost-ring aperatures work on handguns!

WESHOOT2 · June 15, 2002, 06:15 AM

My 1911 (Caspian, of course) has a Caspian ghost-ring blade in a BoMar base, with a smaller-rod optic-fiber front.
This is my preferred carry gun, but also used for IPSC.

I found the front rod size affected accuracy more. The ghost ring is exactly that; it 'disappears'.

I think my ultimate sighting arraignment may be (not sure yet, go through more sights than holsters!) a Millett orange-ramp front blade with a big-notch MMC adjustable rear.

My jury is still out on night sights.

June 12, 2002, 01:53 PM	#1
Nightcrawler Senior Member Join Date: September 22, 2000 Location: Northern Michigan Posts: 2,945	"Ghost Ring" sights on handguns? Here's a thought. Many agree that apreture sights are better than standard leaf or notch sights on rifles. The larger the aperature, the faster the target acquistion (at the expense of accuracy). Handgun sights are basically the same as AK-47 sights. Line up the front sight post in the rear sight notch and fire. Would a large aperature ghost ring sight be a viable choice on a handgun? I think the aperature would have to be somewhat large, given the distance from the eye that handguns are typically held. But, if done properly, could this be a very viable sight choice on a combat handgun? If not, why not? __________________ Nightcrawler- TFL Alumnus

June 12, 2002, 02:15 PM	#2
Zundfolge Senior Member Join Date: July 28, 2001 Location: Colorado Springs Posts: 1,749	A buddy of mine has a Tokarev with ghost ring sights on it. I'm sure theres others. __________________ "There's no way to rule innocent men. The only power any government has is the power to crack down on criminals. Well, when there aren't enough criminals one makes them. One declares so many things to be a crime that it becomes impossible for men to live without breaking laws...you create a nation of law-breakers â€“ and then you cash in on guilt." Ayn Rand

June 12, 2002, 03:17 PM	#4
ronin308 Senior Member Join Date: April 9, 2001 Posts: 1,977	This has been done many times in the past. I believe a company called Aro-tek used to even make them for Glocks. The problem with this setup is one of focus. When shooting a ghost ring mounted on a rifle, the ring "disappears" as you naturally focus on the front sight and center it in the large aperture. The ring disappears because on a long gun the aperture is close to your eye. This advantage is negated on a handgun since the aperture is no longer close to your eye. So what you get is a sight that will be no faster or easier to use than a standard setup. __________________ If you put the federal government in charge of the Sahara desert in five years there’d be a shortage of sand. -Milton Friedman

June 12, 2002, 06:00 PM	#8
Kamicosmos Senior Member Join Date: January 31, 2002 Location: Kansas City, Missouri Posts: 193	my friend has the aerteks on his Glock 24P. He loves them, especially for gun games. Takes me a few shots to get used to it...like them for bowling pin shoots....kinda "feels" (or should I say "Looks") like a dot sight... I personally don't have any plans to get any...He had trouble with them snagging during draws at an informal IDPA match. __________________ "Dreams only have meaning because we struggle in the waking world." -- Major Motoko Kusanagi GitS:SAC Member of NRA and Western Missouri Shooters Alliance

June 13, 2002, 01:41 PM	#13
Onslaught Senior Member Join Date: November 11, 1999 Location: GA Posts: 1,749	Ghost Ring tritium sites for several different pistols.... Entreprise Arms I've considered putting one on my USP, but I think I like the Ashley Express standard dot better... __________________ Yes Rico... KaBOOM!

June 12, 2002, 03:12 PM	#3
harbinger Senior Member Join Date: October 7, 2001 Location: Lewiston, ME Posts: 185	oneraggedhole.com

June 12, 2002, 03:53 PM	#5
C.R.Sam Senior Member Join Date: October 29, 1999 Location: Dewey, AZ Posts: 12,858	Works great. Specially with old eyes. Easy to make. Sam

June 12, 2002, 04:56 PM	#6
popbang Senior Member Join Date: August 9, 2001 Location: out yonder Posts: 148	Aro-tek still makes ghost ring sights. For some people they are easier and quicker to acquire. Your eye will center the front sight in the hole just fine. I have apperature sights on my Glock 36 and my blackhawk I will not go back to standard sights. Try them sometime you might like them.

June 12, 2002, 05:17 PM	#7
prisoner6 Member Join Date: July 6, 2001 Location: North Carolina Posts: 56	I had ghost ring night sites on a Glock. Liked the sights, not so much the gun, so its gone. They worked fine for pickup, but definitely not for target work.

June 12, 2002, 07:41 PM	#9
Bart Noir Senior Member Join Date: August 5, 2000 Location: Puget Sound, USA Posts: 2,215	Well, YMMV, but my vote goes against these ring sights, even though I haven't tried them on a pistol. But I did on an SKS carbine, which puts the rear sight at about the same distance from the eye as a pistol sight would. Boy was I disappointed! After many accurate rounds (the older I get, the better I was!) from rifles with "peep" sights, both target and battle versions, I found that the same sort of circle farther from the eye just didn't work. For me. I couldn't center the front sight in that circle, with any consistency. This was with a USMC approved cheek-weld, which you would have to really work at when using a pistol! Bart Noir "Let us consider that we are all partially insane. It will explain us to each other." - Mark Twain

June 12, 2002, 07:52 PM	#10
pogo2 Senior Member Join Date: June 5, 2002 Location: Southwest Posts: 879	I had Arotek ghost ring sights on my Glock 19 for awhile, with a green fiber optic front sight. I finally decided I didn't like them that well and replaced them with conventional 3-dot sights. At an indoor range there wasn't enough light to illuminate the green dot, so it just looked black, and it was hard to center it in the ghost ring. There also was a lot of border between the ring and the front sight, making it difficult to center. Finally, the ghost ring stuck up much further from the gun than conventional sights, which looked funny.

June 12, 2002, 08:19 PM	#11
JohnKSa Staff Join Date: February 12, 2001 Location: DFW Area Posts: 25,002	I've tried a glock with ghost-ring sights. I didn't hate it nearly as much as I thought I would. It was quite functional, but still wasn't "right" IMO. I wouldn't feel handicapped with a gun so equipped, but wouldn't do it to any of mine.

June 12, 2002, 08:33 PM	#12
CWL Senior Member Join Date: May 23, 2001 Location: Bay Area, CA Posts: 1,576	Ol' timers seem to like ghost rings more, perhaps due to far-sightedness. Whether they work or not, ghost rings get complaints because they can be fragile. I think Arotek are pretty solid, but the One Ragged Hole looks flimsy. Probably good for IDPA/IPSC type usage, maybe not as good for real world.

June 13, 2002, 07:21 PM	#14
ronin308 Senior Member Join Date: April 9, 2001 Posts: 1,977	To further illustrate my point, try this simple exercise: Take your strong hand and make a ring with it and take your off hand and make a "front sight" with one of your fingers. First, take the "ghost ring" and put it close to your eye, similar to a rifle. And then take your "front sight" and put it further out, similar to a rifle. You'll notice that the "ghost ring" naturally disappears and you can see your finger clearly. Now do the same, only using the sight radius and eye relief that you would have on a pistol. You'll notice that the "ghost ring" no longer naturally disappears, one must make an effort to focus on the "front sight". This is why I believe ghost rings THEORETICALLY offer no advantage over regular sights. But if they work for you, more power to ya __________________ If you put the federal government in charge of the Sahara desert in five years there’d be a shortage of sand. -Milton Friedman

June 13, 2002, 07:30 PM	#15
rkc Senior Member Join Date: October 16, 2001 Location: South Posts: 295	If I am not mistaken Hansen and Awerbuck have Ghost Rings on thier Glocks----- I have one ragged hole on my Ruger .22 auto. It is way cool and shoots very fast. One of my friends who cannot see well can use it very well. worth looking into (!) __________________ rkc

June 13, 2002, 07:45 PM	#16
KP95DAO Senior Member Join Date: December 30, 2000 Posts: 699	CWL, "Probably good for IDPA/IPSC type usage, maybe not as good for real world." Ghost ring sights are not allowed in IDPA competition.

June 13, 2002, 07:53 PM	#17
Jim March Senior Member Join Date: February 14, 1999 Location: Pittsburg, CA, USA Posts: 7,417	Here's an interesting thought... Take any of the typical "combat" ghost ring setups with a fairly large apeture, and make a small kydex clip-on cover for it drilled with a smaller apeture "peep sight" for those times when you need long-range accuracy. Most of the time, leave it off. If you need to take a 100yard shot take out the smaller apeture, clip it on, . Should be easy enough to make - cut a bit of kydex 3/4" long and about 1/2" wide or whatever, it'll vary by the sight, heat the kydex, fold it over the sight and pinch it with gloves on. Then drill. __________________ Jim March

June 14, 2002, 06:56 AM	#18
Hemicuda Senior Member Join Date: September 13, 2001 Location: Michigan Posts: 1,757	I have the "one ragged hole" sight adapted to the adjustable sight on my Dan Wesson .357... WHATTA sight it is... total sweetness... so, YES, Nightcrawler, ghost-ring aperatures work on handguns! __________________ Hemi. gun and car collector. Rare cars, and rarer guns.

June 15, 2002, 06:15 AM	#19
WESHOOT2 Senior Member Join Date: February 20, 1999 Location: home on the range; Vermont (Caspian country) Posts: 14,324	OLD (but nearsighted) My 1911 (Caspian, of course) has a Caspian ghost-ring blade in a BoMar base, with a smaller-rod optic-fiber front. This is my preferred carry gun, but also used for IPSC. I found the front rod size affected accuracy more. The ghost ring is exactly that; it 'disappears'. I think my ultimate sighting arraignment may be (not sure yet, go through more sights than holsters!) a Millett orange-ramp front blade with a big-notch MMC adjustable rear. My jury is still out on night sights. __________________ . "all my ammo is mostly retired factory ammo"