Robarms M96 - Any New Thoughts?

[Joseph]

I'm still intrigued with this weapon, but Alex Robinson created such a stir here a few years ago, a lot of us got turned off.

Now that a little water has passed, and I'm looking for something a little different, any new info on Robinson Armaments and the M96?

[Teufelhund]

The M96 is a fine rifle. It is however way over priced IMHO. The fact that it takes AR mags is a huge plus but so does the AR-180 at a fraction of the cost of the M96. Both rifles M96 and AR-180 suffer from similar problems, the lack of after market parts and accessories. Mounting optics on either rifle will cost you a small fortune. Neither rifle is easy to convert to a "BAN FREE" configuration and no folding/collapsable stock is available yet for either rifle as far as I know. I really like both rifles, hell I own them but I can not in good concience recommend the M96 to anyone unless they just have to have one and cost is not a factor in their purchase making thought process. I would however endorse the AR-180 to anyone how wants to buy a good rifle at a decent price. It is accurate enough for what it is and it is very very reliable, so is the M96 by the way. I however will not give Alex Robinson another dollar. He has taken a beating in the past for many things. I personally could care less but I have dealt with his company a couple of times and came away with the feeling that they could care less about their customers. So I exercise my right of free speech and tell those who ask and I do not spend my money on their products. In fact I have sold my VEPR K and I am selling my M96 to my brother in law for more than I paid for it, he is a dick and I am glad to take his money. Just my two cents.

[FirstFreedom]

any new info [....] ?

Why, yes, there is:

http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/...d.php?t=152525

[Joseph]

he is a dick and I am glad to take his money

Very well put! I've had a couple of those myself!

[Joseph]

Thanks, First, caught it earlier, and which led me to this post on the M96. I gotta say the XCR looks really sweet. Too bad the company gets so many marks against it for bad customer service.

[FirstFreedom]

Oh, sorry, Joseph - I gathered from reading your post that you weren't aware of the XCR. OK. I never got the whole story, but I did get the jist of a bad vibe from Robarm towards their customers.

[Handy]

I like my rifle. For its construction and what I payed, a bargain.

I have never had a problem when I've called them.

[Jamie Young]

I'm still intrigued with this weapon, but Alex Robinson created such a stir here a few years ago, a lot of us got turned off.

I think about that everytime I hear about the M96.

[VaughnT]

Honestly, I would rather have a M96 Recon or the XCR than an AR15 variant. I'm not saying one is better than another, just that one has supersaturated the marketplace and the other is a rarity. Which is better is a question I cannot answer.

Tell me that VEPR isn't a cool looking rifle? Go ahead, try to say such a thing without smiling!

Unfortunately, RA needs to come down a good bit in their prices before I can consider them. For 1600 smackers, I could have a great AR and a few thousand rounds of ammo to learn it on.

[DPris]

Out of curiosity, what did Robinson do to piss people off?
Denis

[Jamie Young]

http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/...&highlight=M96


Read the whole thread.

George Hill got some false info (unknowingly) and Alex Robinson came in and went overboard.

He potrayed such a bad attitude in the 5 or 6 posts he had that it had to have prevented dozens of us from ever considering his firearms.

[DPris]

Interesting.
Thanks, Jamie.
Denis

[Handy]

I always thought everyone overreacted. Alex made two disagreeable posts, basically telling George to take a hike, which were at least somewhat warranted. The way everyone got so upset you'd think only royalty post on this board.

The product is not perfect, but it is nice. Robinson is not perfect, but they do okay with customer needs. This hurt feelings act is more childish than Robinson's reaction to slander.

[Correia]

I know, and am friends with, both George Hill and Alex Robinson. They are both proud guys. I think the whole thing is kind of stupid, and it strikes me as silly that it has become almost a point of internet legend that has been repeated for, what, three years now?

[Joseph]

I tell you, it would really be nice not to have a hex on what appear to be fine weapons. I can certainly live with personality disagreements, but disdain for the customer base is a killer for me. If that's not the case, which Handy and Correia both seem to stipulate, than...

I've got one (M96) and someday two (XCR) reliable and very attractive options going forward.

Roon

[VaughnT]

Correia, considering that you have a personal relationship with the makers, could you offer your opinions on their wares? Like I said, I'd be interested in their Carbine, but all I have to go on is this internet thing, and not many people seem to shoot RA stuff.

[Blitz]

I have an M96 Expeditionary and I love it. The only problem is... I need to sell it and my Glock 21 due to finances. I could probably part with the M96 for $1100-$1200. I have only put maybe 400 rounds through it. The Glock has Trijicon nite sites. I suppose I would like to get $500 for it. If you are interested, e-mail me. I will probably put them up for sale on auctionarms.com in a week or two. I need to get pics of them.

[FirstFreedom]

I know, and am friends with, both George Hill and Alex Robinson. They are both proud guys. I think the whole thing is kind of stupid, and it strikes me as silly that it has become almost a point of internet legend that has been repeated for, what, three years now?

Good point. BUT. A seller needs to learn the rule that "the customer is always right" - and Alex is the seller; George isn't (wasn't). I know, I sell a service in my business, and the customer must always be "right", even though they're wrong about 2/3rds of the time.

What's your state of residence, Blitz?

[Correia]

Vaughn, I have a ton of experience with the Vepr. I love them.

I only have a little bit of experience with an M96. (about 500 rounds). I was given a loaner to try out, and unfortunatly the bolt on that gun had a bad heat treat. It broke at the cam slot hole. Since it was not my gun I just took it back to them. Apparently they got a few bad bolts on that batch, but to my understanding it was fixed. Before that it shot great though. I actually really liked it.

Personal opinion? I like the XCR. The M96 was nice, but between the two I prefer the XCR. Easier to strip/maintain. Simpler design. Simpler bolt. I'm going to get myself an XCR.

[tire iron]

I have some trigger time behind an M96 - and here are my impressions.

It is not a mature weapons system yet, although it does have promise. But there are some annoying little 'glitches' that I am not entirely comfortable with. Such as:

1. I have seen the mag release button fly off (it is held on via a small roll pin, which can and will walk off) - it should have been designed exactly like the AR unit - a 'screw on' type arrangement. It also lacks the 'fence' protector that the AR has.

2. The 'M1913 Picatinny rail' on top has the mounting screws in such a way that it interferes with mounting optics! One must have one's EOTech 'modified' (via a mill or even a demel tool) in order to mount it on the 'rail'. This is unacceptable.

3. The mag well of the sheet steel lower is not flared enough to give as fast of mag change as an AR.

4. The selector is in a spot that is 'not right'. They placed it more like the selectors on HK's rifles (which are NOT known for their 'ergonomics') instead of where the AR selector is placed. Why? I don't know. The AR reigns supreme in the area of ergonomics - so it makes no sense to me why they didn't copy that from the AR.

5. The pins that hold the rear reciever on (ala HK) can walk out also, and once out can be lost. They should be 'captive' like the AR reciever pins.

6. One example I shot would keep 5 shots in a 6" circle at 100 yards. I have had AK's shoot better than that. Another example I shot kept 5 rounds in a 1.5" group. So - who knows what the M96 you get will shoot like.

On the plus side - in "theory" it has the potential to be more 'reliable' than the AR series, as it uses a modified AK/FN gas operating system. So cleaning the upper reciever is not as much 'work' as cleaning an AR. (With regards to reliability, my M4gery goes through at LEAST 1,000 of Wolf ammo between cleanings - so any 'theoretical' advantage the M96 has with regards to reliability is lost in the cold light of day.)

For right handed operators, the 'charging handle/actuator' is very well placed, similar to the excellent FN FAL. One can keep the rifle in one's shoulder whilst manipulating the charging handle. (Note that the charging handle is non-reciprocating and lacks any 'forward assist' capability.)

No rifle in existance is 'perfect' - but I had hoped that the M96 would have started out 'closer' than it actually has. It has a way to go to even be on 'par' with the M4, let alone surpass it.

As always, YMMV.

cheers

tire iron

[racine]

I am one of the few M96 owners who had to deal with Alex. I did have problems with the rifle but like the M16/AR15, I gave it a chance. RA did not have the govt. or massive pockets of Colt to refine this platform thus they were limited to few beta testers returning feedback during a rough time for new rifle designs(Slick Willie and the Ban Jive). I think it was a bold move he made with a nice shooting modular style of rifle plagued by a few design flaws he eventually fixed. As a customer Alex went to great lengths to see us owners attended too. He came through with parts, support and advice. He was no Eugene Stoner but he tried his best. I still shoot mine in 3 gun or other NRA rifle events and have learned it. It still shoots well and was a heck of a lot more reliable than a couple of small brand ARs I have shot, owned then sold. I don't know Alex personally but he pursues the American dream like many others fighting ' David's' fight against the many Goliaths.
Racine