Home defense/teenager question

chris in va · January 26, 2008, 06:11 PM

My friend and her daughter live in my house with me. Sometimes we have to go somewhere and her daughter simply doesn't want to go, prefering to stay here.

I'm not too keen on that idea, but not much I can do about it. She's almost 16 and we've been to the range a few times so she's not scared or reckless with firearms.

What I've been doing is just leave my SP in one of my dresser drawers. However, that's downstairs and if anyone broke in the house (there's been several invasions the past year) she probably wouldn't hear it nor be able to get to the revolver in time.

Ideas? No flames please, it's a valid question.

Rangefinder · January 26, 2008, 06:34 PM

First thing that comes to mind is an alarm system. It wouldn't have to be anything hi-tech, just sensors on windows, etc. Anything that screeches will get her attention immediately, and likely scare off any would-be intruder expecting a quiet entry.

Gbro · January 26, 2008, 06:40 PM

If she isn't trained and has a mindset to use it, then it is better that she dosen't
have access to it.
On the flip side, a handgun safe or other locking devise may be in order.
We are responsible for what happens to our guns.

Creature · January 26, 2008, 06:54 PM

I agree. But what does your friend think about this?

Majic · January 26, 2008, 07:10 PM

Get a big dog.

Tanzer · January 26, 2008, 07:21 PM

Quote:

Get a big dog.

Get two, AND an alarm.

Quote:

We are responsible for what happens to our guns.

Can't argue with that. Teens can run hot & cold. I've raised three and have two at home. One minute they can be loving, the next moment little witches. One minute responsible, the next moment they are reckless. It's not worth the risk. Personally, I just bring the 14 year old along, bit*hing all the way. Doesn't always make me popular. We live either on board a boat (safe aboard) in summer, or in a nice neighborhood, but that's the BG's target sometimes. No way do I want a gun stolen.

homefires · January 26, 2008, 07:36 PM

I like the big dog that loves the family and has a thing about other people. Other then that I would move. If you can't leave your house without thinking of some crap happening, its time to move. When is the last time you looked up when a alarm went off? Around Here I look out the door any time my alarm goes off! Dogs his name!

hogdogs · January 26, 2008, 08:30 PM

I love the dog theory...
There are 3 ONLY 3 types of dogs...
1)Fear biter... useless as teats on a boarhog as they usually bite once or twice and are gonna run or get hit off...
2)Lovers... I mean love everyone, Heck one of these allowed me to be cleaned out once.
3)WORKING DOGS... Mine happen to be hog hunting dogs. I have slender baying type dogs and severe pig catching bull dogs (pit bull, american bulldog and crosses). My problem with these (they live on chains) for HD is it would be much easier to call back an airborne 20 gauge slug than some of my bull dogs... Once they set there mind to task I just raise my hands and wait for the critter to die... often it is eaten too... Legally thinking is it any different for a bloody mess to be "CUJO" inflicted or gunshot?
Brent

rampage841512 · January 26, 2008, 08:37 PM

If you and her mother think she is competent enough to handle the responsibility, make sure she knows where the gun is and will have relatively easy access to it when home alone.

A cheap alarm system would be a good idea as well. Or a dog. I trust electronic alarms more than dogs though.

Hawg · January 26, 2008, 09:26 PM

My daughter is 15, 16 next month. She has guns of her own and has since she was 12. I pity the fool that breaks in on her.

UniversalFrost · January 26, 2008, 10:43 PM

get one of thos small single pistol safes that you use a finger code . That way you can mount anywhere and not be worried about the teenager (or one of her friends messing with the gun).

A few years back I had a neighbor with a similiar aged daughter and her idiot boyfriend who had never been around guns in his life got hold of the neighbors bedside pistol and "borrowed" it and held up a gas station with it. The neighbor got in trouble for not securing his weapons and ended up doing some community service (500 hours). Of course his daughter got kicked out of the house and the boyfriend is still in prison from last I heard.

When my daughters are in that teenager phase of life I will make sure that they know safe gun handling and that most kids (boys especially) are plain idiots that know squat about guns and safe handling (because the usa has foregotten it's roots and is a suburb society with its heads up its rears). I will still keep the guns locked up with a few hidden around the house in small quick access safes, but the daughters will know where and how to access them, so if one goes missing I will know that the daughters were responsible and give the guilty daghter a boot out the door.

JOE

dmxx99 · January 26, 2008, 10:58 PM

Believe it or not
people under 18 have a right to self defense too especially when some dumb*ss breaks in the home when he knows someone is in it.So if she can handle a gun well let her have one for defense in the home when she is alone because good chance she will be a victim if a thug manages to get in the house and sees her unarmed.She is old enough to understand right from wrong and can learn the laws regarding self defense in the home.Dont ever leave a kid by himself or herself if you are worried someone will break in and make them a victim then you need to be there and make sure he or she is safe and wont be a victim or make them go with you.
A 20 gauge pump shotgun would be even better not only to the jury justification but for stopping power to the intruder aswell.

hoytinak · January 26, 2008, 11:03 PM

You said she's familar and not reckless with firearms. I'd disguss it with her mother and if she's ok with it keep one upstairs also, that way if someone was to break in she'd have easier access to it.

An alarm system or dog would be a good idea as well.

chris in va · January 27, 2008, 03:56 AM

To answer some questions...

Her mom agreed to letting the gun stay in her room. She's responsible and certainly knows the gun safety laws.

Don't want a dog, too high maintenance. We already have two cats, that's enough. I don't have a fenced yard, if you want to call it that.

Alarm system, can't afford it. I have a two level single family house, and another bill for something would break me.

Can't move, I have a mortgage and houses have been on the market here for over a year.

It's not a high crime area I live in directly, but several major things have happened nearby that really raise my hackles. Two bad home invasions, another guy that is entering through the back door while people are home and stealing things (still at large), a major cocaine drug bust, most of them illegal immigrants.

I've been labeled 'paranoid' several times. Getting pretty tired of it. Heck, I was over at a friend's apartment tonight, and at 12:30am someone knocks on the door. What does he freakin do? Open it. Total stranger, wrong apartment.

I had my hand on my P11 the whole time, in my jacket pocket.

"You're just paranoid dude." Maybe he's right.

hoytinak · January 27, 2008, 04:01 AM

I get told I'm "just paranoid" all the time. She's responsible, understands firearms and knows the laws...I'd let her keep one upstairs too.

chris in va · January 27, 2008, 04:06 AM

Good to know I'm not the only one.

I might look into getting a small safe for upstairs.

bushidomosquito · January 27, 2008, 04:09 AM

Does she have a drivers lisence? If she can handle a vehicle after the proper instruction, why not a gun. What would be a better scenerio for you, she gets rapped and or murdered or she shoots an intruder and you catch legal crap for allowing her to do so?

The Tourist · January 27, 2008, 04:28 AM

My Dad worked in the security industry for 42 years and always said the same thing. "Safety" depends on a layered plan.

Anything less means the predator is "inside" with you, and your percentage for injury goes up.

If your daughter likes and responsibly handles firearms, that element wouldn't hurt. I'd be more afraid of an amorous boyfriend sneaking in and finding a gun.

However, I'd invest in doors and windows, lights, locks and alarms. Make sure she has a cell phone with a good battery and emergency numbers on speed-dial.

allenomics · January 27, 2008, 11:09 AM

I'd lock the gun away so a minor could not possibly get it.

I would be responsible if the minor child got the gun and hurt herself or someone else.

A dog and a cell phone are reasonable options.

UniversalFrost · January 27, 2008, 01:46 PM

Here is an idea I totally foregot about.

Get one of the Kimber mace kits. I bought one for my wife while she is walking and doesn't want to carry a gun and we keep it in a dresser drawer in the bedroom (of course I have a beretta 92 with 2 15rd mags of 147gr hp's right next to it).

It is non lethal, but will take down a perp from up to 30 feet away. It has 2 shots but you can hit them with 1 shot and run or hit them with the second if they keep coming. It does have a warning for not to use indoors, but if a perp is breaking in I really wouldn't care where I am.

I got mine for I think 35 on sale at the local outdoors store here and I think cabelas carries them for similiar pricing. Or just get a can of the bear mace. That would work wonders on a perp. If it works on grizzlies, it should work on a bad guy coming through the window, plus they leave a dye on the guy so the cops know who got sprayed when they are patroling afterwards.

Joe

Mainah · January 27, 2008, 06:09 PM

A dog is a big commitment, and it won't solve your problem. Are you absolutely sure that she's alone when you leave her alone? I'm not making judgements, but I spent many hours hiding in bushes until I saw parents pull out of a driveway- and I was not a teenager who could of been trusted with a loaded revolver.

rem870hunter · January 27, 2008, 06:26 PM

back in the 1980's my father was in the army national guard. he would be away a few weekends a month and 2 weeks a year. so it was up to me and my sister to fend off any intruders. we knew where 2 firearms were in the bedroom and slept in that room. a colt 1911 .45 acp and a single shot 12 ga. we were in the same bed as mom with the bedroom door locked. our state of mind was if someone broke in one of us called the police and the other covered the bedroom door. if it got busted opened we were told to fire. we knew where to aim and how to hold it properly. and to be careful if there was a chance their was more than one person. no one other than my mom and dad had a key to the house. and if it were dad coming home unexpected. which was highly unlikely. he would'nt have to break in to the house. and certainly wouldn't have to break open the bedroom door, so nonetheless. if someone did come in when we were there sleeping or not. they were gonna be carried out in a bag. and still to this day even though he is over 60 and retired. there still is 2 guns in that room. just different ones now.

Gbro · January 27, 2008, 06:43 PM

For what it is worth,
As she is your SO's daughter, Have the mother own the firearm. What are you to do if they up and leave with your gun?? CYA

Shadi Khalil · January 27, 2008, 10:39 PM

It has 2 shots but you can hit them with 1 shot and run or hit them with the second if they keep coming. It does have a warning for not to use indoors, but if a perp is breaking in I really wouldn't care where I am.

the probelm with mace is, the first shot is it, the secons shot does nothing. Also, if you dont get awat fast enough and the guy touches you, your now maced.

I dont know this girl but i do remember creeping over to allot of 16 year old girls houses when I was sixteen and the parents were away

You dont want her bring some dumb boy over while you all are gone and he steals the gun, does something stupid, you get in trouble. Like i said, i dont know the girl, she's probably an angel. I had a similar dilima recently, it all comes down to how much you trust the person.

chris in va · January 28, 2008, 02:18 AM

Good point about the 'sneaking' thing. No evidence of boys on the prowl so far, but I'll keep that in mind.

Also good idea about transfering ownership to my friend. She can't buy one of her own due to financial reasons (nor would she want to) but maybe there's some sort of paper that can be drawn up, etc.

January 26, 2008, 06:11 PM	#1
chris in va Senior Member Join Date: December 26, 2004 Location: Louisville KY Posts: 13,806	Home defense/teenager question My friend and her daughter live in my house with me. Sometimes we have to go somewhere and her daughter simply doesn't want to go, prefering to stay here. I'm not too keen on that idea, but not much I can do about it. She's almost 16 and we've been to the range a few times so she's not scared or reckless with firearms. What I've been doing is just leave my SP in one of my dresser drawers. However, that's downstairs and if anyone broke in the house (there's been several invasions the past year) she probably wouldn't hear it nor be able to get to the revolver in time. Ideas? No flames please, it's a valid question.

January 26, 2008, 06:34 PM	#2
Rangefinder Senior Member Join Date: August 4, 2005 Posts: 2,017	First thing that comes to mind is an alarm system. It wouldn't have to be anything hi-tech, just sensors on windows, etc. Anything that screeches will get her attention immediately, and likely scare off any would-be intruder expecting a quiet entry. __________________ "Why is is called Common Sense when it seems so few actually possess it?" Guns only have two enemies: Rust and Politicians.

January 26, 2008, 06:40 PM	#3
Gbro Senior Member Join Date: February 20, 2005 Location: Minnesota Posts: 2,084	If she isn't trained and has a mindset to use it, then it is better that she dosen't have access to it. On the flip side, a handgun safe or other locking devise may be in order. We are responsible for what happens to our guns. __________________ Gbro CGVS For the message of the Cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, But to us who are being saved, It Is The Power Of God. 1Corinthians 1-18

January 26, 2008, 08:37 PM	#9
rampage841512 Senior Member Join Date: July 16, 2007 Location: Gardendale, Alabama Posts: 665	If you and her mother think she is competent enough to handle the responsibility, make sure she knows where the gun is and will have relatively easy access to it when home alone. A cheap alarm system would be a good idea as well. Or a dog. I trust electronic alarms more than dogs though. __________________ "What is play to the fool and the idiot is deadly serious to the man with the gun." Walt Rauch,Combat Handguns, May '08

January 26, 2008, 10:43 PM	#11
UniversalFrost Senior Member Join Date: February 20, 2006 Location: Ohio Posts: 2,300	get one of thos small single pistol safes that you use a finger code . That way you can mount anywhere and not be worried about the teenager (or one of her friends messing with the gun). A few years back I had a neighbor with a similiar aged daughter and her idiot boyfriend who had never been around guns in his life got hold of the neighbors bedside pistol and "borrowed" it and held up a gas station with it. The neighbor got in trouble for not securing his weapons and ended up doing some community service (500 hours). Of course his daughter got kicked out of the house and the boyfriend is still in prison from last I heard. When my daughters are in that teenager phase of life I will make sure that they know safe gun handling and that most kids (boys especially) are plain idiots that know squat about guns and safe handling (because the usa has foregotten it's roots and is a suburb society with its heads up its rears). I will still keep the guns locked up with a few hidden around the house in small quick access safes, but the daughters will know where and how to access them, so if one goes missing I will know that the daughters were responsible and give the guilty daghter a boot out the door. JOE __________________ Lifetime member VFW and NRA "Quando Omni Flunkus Moritati" (when all else fails play dead) -Red Green

January 26, 2008, 06:54 PM	#4
Creature Junior member Join Date: April 8, 2007 Location: Virginia Posts: 3,769	I agree. But what does your friend think about this?

January 26, 2008, 07:10 PM	#5
Majic Senior Member Join Date: May 24, 2004 Posts: 3,888	Get a big dog.

January 26, 2008, 07:36 PM	#7
homefires Senior Member Join Date: July 8, 2007 Location: Deming New Mexico Posts: 1,495	I like the big dog that loves the family and has a thing about other people. Other then that I would move. If you can't leave your house without thinking of some crap happening, its time to move. When is the last time you looked up when a alarm went off? Around Here I look out the door any time my alarm goes off! Dogs his name!

January 26, 2008, 08:30 PM	#8
hogdogs Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 31, 2007 Location: Western Florida panhandle Posts: 11,069	I love the dog theory... There are 3 ONLY 3 types of dogs... 1)Fear biter... useless as teats on a boarhog as they usually bite once or twice and are gonna run or get hit off... 2)Lovers... I mean love everyone, Heck one of these allowed me to be cleaned out once. 3)WORKING DOGS... Mine happen to be hog hunting dogs. I have slender baying type dogs and severe pig catching bull dogs (pit bull, american bulldog and crosses). My problem with these (they live on chains) for HD is it would be much easier to call back an airborne 20 gauge slug than some of my bull dogs... Once they set there mind to task I just raise my hands and wait for the critter to die... often it is eaten too... Legally thinking is it any different for a bloody mess to be "CUJO" inflicted or gunshot? Brent

January 26, 2008, 09:26 PM	#10
Hawg Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2007 Location: Mississippi Posts: 16,188	My daughter is 15, 16 next month. She has guns of her own and has since she was 12. I pity the fool that breaks in on her.

January 26, 2008, 10:58 PM	#12
dmxx99 Junior member Join Date: July 22, 2007 Location: Somewhere in FL Posts: 169	Believe it or not people under 18 have a right to self defense too especially when some dumb*ss breaks in the home when he knows someone is in it.So if she can handle a gun well let her have one for defense in the home when she is alone because good chance she will be a victim if a thug manages to get in the house and sees her unarmed.She is old enough to understand right from wrong and can learn the laws regarding self defense in the home.Dont ever leave a kid by himself or herself if you are worried someone will break in and make them a victim then you need to be there and make sure he or she is safe and wont be a victim or make them go with you. A 20 gauge pump shotgun would be even better not only to the jury justification but for stopping power to the intruder aswell.

January 26, 2008, 11:03 PM	#13
hoytinak Senior Member Join Date: July 5, 2006 Location: Texas Posts: 5,721	You said she's familar and not reckless with firearms. I'd disguss it with her mother and if she's ok with it keep one upstairs also, that way if someone was to break in she'd have easier access to it. An alarm system or dog would be a good idea as well.

January 27, 2008, 03:56 AM	#14
chris in va Senior Member Join Date: December 26, 2004 Location: Louisville KY Posts: 13,806	To answer some questions... Her mom agreed to letting the gun stay in her room. She's responsible and certainly knows the gun safety laws. Don't want a dog, too high maintenance. We already have two cats, that's enough. I don't have a fenced yard, if you want to call it that. Alarm system, can't afford it. I have a two level single family house, and another bill for something would break me. Can't move, I have a mortgage and houses have been on the market here for over a year. It's not a high crime area I live in directly, but several major things have happened nearby that really raise my hackles. Two bad home invasions, another guy that is entering through the back door while people are home and stealing things (still at large), a major cocaine drug bust, most of them illegal immigrants. I've been labeled 'paranoid' several times. Getting pretty tired of it. Heck, I was over at a friend's apartment tonight, and at 12:30am someone knocks on the door. What does he freakin do? Open it. Total stranger, wrong apartment. I had my hand on my P11 the whole time, in my jacket pocket. "You're just paranoid dude." Maybe he's right.

January 27, 2008, 04:01 AM	#15
hoytinak Senior Member Join Date: July 5, 2006 Location: Texas Posts: 5,721	I get told I'm "just paranoid" all the time. She's responsible, understands firearms and knows the laws...I'd let her keep one upstairs too.

January 27, 2008, 04:06 AM	#16
chris in va Senior Member Join Date: December 26, 2004 Location: Louisville KY Posts: 13,806	Good to know I'm not the only one. I might look into getting a small safe for upstairs.

January 27, 2008, 04:09 AM	#17
bushidomosquito Senior Member Join Date: November 14, 2007 Location: Kansas City Posts: 434	Does she have a drivers lisence? If she can handle a vehicle after the proper instruction, why not a gun. What would be a better scenerio for you, she gets rapped and or murdered or she shoots an intruder and you catch legal crap for allowing her to do so? __________________ "Jack Bauer sleeps with a pillow under his gun." "Bush is listening, use big words."

January 27, 2008, 04:28 AM	#18
The Tourist Junior member Join Date: June 20, 2005 Posts: 2,348	My Dad worked in the security industry for 42 years and always said the same thing. "Safety" depends on a layered plan. Anything less means the predator is "inside" with you, and your percentage for injury goes up. If your daughter likes and responsibly handles firearms, that element wouldn't hurt. I'd be more afraid of an amorous boyfriend sneaking in and finding a gun. However, I'd invest in doors and windows, lights, locks and alarms. Make sure she has a cell phone with a good battery and emergency numbers on speed-dial.

January 27, 2008, 11:09 AM	#19
allenomics Senior Member Join Date: January 20, 2007 Posts: 1,536	I'd lock the gun away so a minor could not possibly get it. I would be responsible if the minor child got the gun and hurt herself or someone else. A dog and a cell phone are reasonable options. __________________ NRA Benefactor Life Member Knowledge is not power. Applied knowledge is power!

January 27, 2008, 01:46 PM	#20
UniversalFrost Senior Member Join Date: February 20, 2006 Location: Ohio Posts: 2,300	Here is an idea I totally foregot about. Get one of the Kimber mace kits. I bought one for my wife while she is walking and doesn't want to carry a gun and we keep it in a dresser drawer in the bedroom (of course I have a beretta 92 with 2 15rd mags of 147gr hp's right next to it). It is non lethal, but will take down a perp from up to 30 feet away. It has 2 shots but you can hit them with 1 shot and run or hit them with the second if they keep coming. It does have a warning for not to use indoors, but if a perp is breaking in I really wouldn't care where I am. I got mine for I think 35 on sale at the local outdoors store here and I think cabelas carries them for similiar pricing. Or just get a can of the bear mace. That would work wonders on a perp. If it works on grizzlies, it should work on a bad guy coming through the window, plus they leave a dye on the guy so the cops know who got sprayed when they are patroling afterwards. Joe __________________ Lifetime member VFW and NRA "Quando Omni Flunkus Moritati" (when all else fails play dead) -Red Green

January 27, 2008, 06:09 PM	#21
Mainah Senior Member Join Date: July 9, 2007 Posts: 1,119	A dog is a big commitment, and it won't solve your problem. Are you absolutely sure that she's alone when you leave her alone? I'm not making judgements, but I spent many hours hiding in bushes until I saw parents pull out of a driveway- and I was not a teenager who could of been trusted with a loaded revolver.

January 27, 2008, 06:26 PM	#22
rem870hunter Senior Member Join Date: October 12, 2007 Location: N.J. and trying to decide what state to move to. Posts: 973	back in the 1980's my father was in the army national guard. he would be away a few weekends a month and 2 weeks a year. so it was up to me and my sister to fend off any intruders. we knew where 2 firearms were in the bedroom and slept in that room. a colt 1911 .45 acp and a single shot 12 ga. we were in the same bed as mom with the bedroom door locked. our state of mind was if someone broke in one of us called the police and the other covered the bedroom door. if it got busted opened we were told to fire. we knew where to aim and how to hold it properly. and to be careful if there was a chance their was more than one person. no one other than my mom and dad had a key to the house. and if it were dad coming home unexpected. which was highly unlikely. he would'nt have to break in to the house. and certainly wouldn't have to break open the bedroom door, so nonetheless. if someone did come in when we were there sleeping or not. they were gonna be carried out in a bag. and still to this day even though he is over 60 and retired. there still is 2 guns in that room. just different ones now.

January 27, 2008, 06:43 PM	#23
Gbro Senior Member Join Date: February 20, 2005 Location: Minnesota Posts: 2,084	For what it is worth, As she is your SO's daughter, Have the mother own the firearm. What are you to do if they up and leave with your gun?? CYA __________________ Gbro CGVS For the message of the Cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, But to us who are being saved, It Is The Power Of God. 1Corinthians 1-18

January 27, 2008, 10:39 PM	#24
Shadi Khalil Senior Member Join Date: September 23, 2006 Location: Alexandria, VA Posts: 5,210	It has 2 shots but you can hit them with 1 shot and run or hit them with the second if they keep coming. It does have a warning for not to use indoors, but if a perp is breaking in I really wouldn't care where I am. the probelm with mace is, the first shot is it, the secons shot does nothing. Also, if you dont get awat fast enough and the guy touches you, your now maced. I dont know this girl but i do remember creeping over to allot of 16 year old girls houses when I was sixteen and the parents were away You dont want her bring some dumb boy over while you all are gone and he steals the gun, does something stupid, you get in trouble. Like i said, i dont know the girl, she's probably an angel. I had a similar dilima recently, it all comes down to how much you trust the person.

January 28, 2008, 02:18 AM	#25
chris in va Senior Member Join Date: December 26, 2004 Location: Louisville KY Posts: 13,806	Good point about the 'sneaking' thing. No evidence of boys on the prowl so far, but I'll keep that in mind. Also good idea about transfering ownership to my friend. She can't buy one of her own due to financial reasons (nor would she want to) but maybe there's some sort of paper that can be drawn up, etc.