PM45 Nightmare

45FanFL · April 6, 2009, 09:45 PM

<<<Please note that this thread is 5 years old. The OP has reopened it to post the solution. Please read the OP's recent post on page 3 before responding. Thanks, JohnKSa>>>

I really loved this little gun and had to have it.
I bought one Saturday at a gunshow.
Anxiously I jumped outa bed Sunday w/ wife in tow and we were off to the range to break this lil puppy in. (Of course I cleaned and oiled it the day I bought it).
Filled a mag (w/ range ammo MagTech 230gr FMJ) and released the slide and jam!
Dropped the mag and cleared the jam and popped in the mag back back in. Racked it bang bang bang bang...so far so good. Popped in the other full mag, dropped the slide stop and jammed again...same process...yadda yadda yadda.
Figured I'd try some real ammo Cor-Bon 185 gr +P Hollow points...dropped the slide stop and it crushed the first round so bad I couldn't get it out of the gun and had to get someone to help...
Figuring I needed to put some ammo through this so I struggled w/ stove pipe after stove pipe. I broke the gun down and oiled the hell out of it and things only got worse. Every round was stove piping.
I gave up after nearly 200 rnds.
I broke the gun down at lunch today and found the polymer part of the slide is getting eaten and where the slide stop pin inserts it's already showing wear.
I tried calling Kahr but only got voice mail no live person after holding for nearly 30 min on my on my lunch.
The gun shoots very accurate and no kick at all for a gun that size.
I hope Kahr calls me tomorrow as the gunshop I bought it from offered no help other than to call Kahr.
Thank God my Springfield XD works like a dream! Never a hiccup just too big to carry.
I hope I have the same luck that "Ben" had w/ kahr cuz so far this this is a very disapointing

golfnutrlv · April 6, 2009, 10:53 PM

You know, ive heard some stories about Kahr's like this. Can't really help you, but hopefully they can.

I've heard good stories too, so hopefully, its isolated and correctable.

hoytinak · April 7, 2009, 12:49 AM

Welcome to the wonderful work of Kahr ownership.

Once I cut my PM9 up and trashed it, I never looked back.

Playboypenguin · April 7, 2009, 12:58 AM

When you are getting that jam on the first round are you dropping the slide by hand or using the slide stop as the instruction manual instructs?

45FanFL · April 7, 2009, 02:38 AM

Playboypenguin...
Does not seem to make a difference.
More times than not... using the slide stop results in a failure to feed w/ either magazine.
I've had better luck dropping the slide by hand...
Honestly I really love the way the gun shoots and it's surprisingly accurate and the kick is nothing... even my wife can shoot it w/ no problem.
3 people at the range shot it and it stove piped on all of them.
No matter how much oil (next to dripping wet) it will not chamber a round and no way in hell would it chamber a hollow point.
Since I had no luck on the phone I submitted an RMA request online.
I really hope I can get it working. I really love this lil gun.
I was thinking of offering up another $300 bucks to get the custom carry package by C&S and just have Kahr give me a new gun. As I mentioned before where the action meets the frame (slide) the polymer on the RHS is getting all chewed up w/ less than 200 rounds through it. I'm pretty concerned with the gun coming apart!

Muddflap · April 7, 2009, 05:20 AM

Leave Kahr a voice message. I tried calling for several days, with no luck. Even sent e-mails and that didn't work. Called and left a message, and they called back that day.
Sorry to hear about your problems. Fortunately both Kahrs I have owned, have been good ones, but the were 9mm.

youngoilguy · April 7, 2009, 07:35 AM

my pm 40 was a piece of crap. got rid of it after khar "fixed it" twice. never would cycle ammo properly. i had the p40 (all steel) and it was reliable, but way too heavy.

chris in va · April 7, 2009, 09:34 AM

Seems like the small polymer 40 and 45 versions have more issues than the all steel ones. Kahr really needs to sit down and have a look at their larger caliber guns before they put these things on the market.

Just curious, can you post a pic of the slide abrasion?

Ben · April 7, 2009, 10:31 AM

45FanFL

I was getting the same feeding jams you are talking about with Hornady ammo. The cartridge isn't seating completely inside of the chamber. It caused the gun to do this and I had to use a screw driver to pry it back open.

It's caused by Kahr's shallow throat. The round worked in every other 45 I tried. Sounds like YOURS might be even shallower since it's not even feeding ball ammo.

See how the round isn't flush with the rear of the chamber? It sticks out.

I didn't want them to fix my throat because it probably entailed replacing the barrel, so I asked them to leave it alone and work on the other problems. I just use different ammo now.

I have some good connections over at Kahr now if you want some help. Let me know. They did a great job fixing me up. 300 rounds and not a single problem since getting it back.

Ben

Ben · April 7, 2009, 10:46 AM

Check your PM's.

Ben

45FanFL · April 7, 2009, 01:34 PM

Man what a great forum!
On hold now....left message yesterday still no call back!
Arrrrrrrrgh!

45FanFL · April 7, 2009, 01:35 PM

How do I post a pic of the abrasion?

45FanFL · April 7, 2009, 02:30 PM

Just got off the phone w/ Kahr....I'm sending it back on their dime!
Very nice people there.
Abrasion is nothing to be alarmed about I'm told...caused from reassembly...very sharp metal on RHS of action...if not careful when assembling...even if you are...it scratches the plastic.
I'll keep y'all posted.
Thanks to all those that have helped me so far!!!!!!!

45FanFL · April 8, 2009, 05:13 PM

Shipped gun today.

denfoote · April 9, 2009, 01:19 AM

This is another reason why I have not bought a plastic Kahr!!

I've said, for years, that Kahr needed to hire an engineer or two away from Glock or Springfield!!

I'll keep my stainless Kahr thank you very much!!

45FanFL · April 9, 2009, 05:10 PM

I received a call from Kahr today and the gun is being shipped back to me tomorrow.
Amazing service!!!
They said there was a problem with the receiver I believe. (I'll give better details as to what was repaired when I get the gun back. I received the call while I was at work and I was pretty busy when I got the call.) They also replaced the recoil spring. They also polished the feed ramp and a few other miscellaneous items. They said it was working like a champ!
I can't wait to go to the range!
It was a joy to shoot when it worked! No kick to mention and very accurate! The dbl-action trigger was very easy to get use to and was a smooth pull from start to finish.

Ben · April 9, 2009, 05:31 PM

Just think, your gun should be back in your hands by Saturday and it should be working better than new. I know mine sure did. I bet it'll be pretty dirty though. Glad Bob could help you. Bring 100+ rounds with you to the range and just run through them. Toss as many down range as you can.

Most importantly, enjoy.
Ben

chris in va · April 9, 2009, 05:47 PM

It's good to see a thread with a problem, diagnostic and fix. I wonder if Kahr will extend the chamber a bit due to the issue.

MikeGoob · April 9, 2009, 07:13 PM

are there aftermarket barrels for the Kahr 45s?

jon_in_wv · April 9, 2009, 07:19 PM

From what I've gathered in my surfing is that Kahr has done itself no justice with its polymer line of autos. They should have stuck with steel and maybe alloys for the frame. I've heard enough horror stories about the PM line to steer me clear of them completely.

murphjup · April 9, 2009, 07:23 PM

Have you ever just tried loading the first round alone with no others in the magazine? Then Load either a full magazine or a none full one...

I know from my Seecamps, that smaller pistols can have a problem stripping the first round from a full magazine...

YMMV... Just a thought...

RsqVet · April 9, 2009, 07:36 PM

Sounds like the issues I had with a MK 9, hopefully the factory fixed yours. Mine I was not so lucky but I moved on.

Have to lower with the slide stop? Give me a break this is counter to 60-80% of defensive instruction I have seen or recived... if you can't sling shot the slide what is wrong with the gun and it's design?

hdawson228 · April 9, 2009, 07:46 PM

I have had absolutely ZERO problems with my Kahr CW9. Polymer.

orionengnr · April 9, 2009, 07:53 PM

Quote:

From what I've gathered in my surfing is that Kahr has done itself no justice with its polymer line of autos. They should have stuck with steel and maybe alloys for the frame.

Keep reading. Kahr is treating the OP well, as they did Ben before him, and as they did me. My PM9 had to go back but was fixed quickly, correctly and shipping was on their dime both ways. I've been carrying it daily and shootling it monthly for three years plus. Liked it well enough that I bought a P45, which has been trouble-free from the first round and has remained so for three years. Saw a guy with a PM45 at the range last month. He put at least 100 rounds through it without any difficulty. I know another local who has been carrying and shooting his PM9 for two years plus. And another acquaintance carries his regularly. These are people I actually know and have seen, not unsubstantiated internet tales.

As for me, I have no desire for a steel or alloy-framed Kahr, and you'd be hard pressed getting either of mine away from me.

DAVE RICHHARDS · April 9, 2009, 07:59 PM

Was at the range today and had to help an older gentleman. After firing 15 rounds his whole extractor unit flew out of the gun (new CW9). A friend and I were ale to find the pieces and put them back in. It seemed good to go after that. Couldn't find out what caused it to break free to begin with. Been seeing alot of problems at the range with polymer Kahrs.

April 6, 2009, 09:45 PM	#1
45FanFL Member Join Date: April 6, 2009 Location: Florida Posts: 23	PM45 Nightmare <<<Please note that this thread is 5 years old. The OP has reopened it to post the solution. Please read the OP's recent post on page 3 before responding. Thanks, JohnKSa>>> I really loved this little gun and had to have it. I bought one Saturday at a gunshow. Anxiously I jumped outa bed Sunday w/ wife in tow and we were off to the range to break this lil puppy in. (Of course I cleaned and oiled it the day I bought it). Filled a mag (w/ range ammo MagTech 230gr FMJ) and released the slide and jam! Dropped the mag and cleared the jam and popped in the mag back back in. Racked it bang bang bang bang...so far so good. Popped in the other full mag, dropped the slide stop and jammed again...same process...yadda yadda yadda. Figured I'd try some real ammo Cor-Bon 185 gr +P Hollow points...dropped the slide stop and it crushed the first round so bad I couldn't get it out of the gun and had to get someone to help... Figuring I needed to put some ammo through this so I struggled w/ stove pipe after stove pipe. I broke the gun down and oiled the hell out of it and things only got worse. Every round was stove piping. I gave up after nearly 200 rnds. I broke the gun down at lunch today and found the polymer part of the slide is getting eaten and where the slide stop pin inserts it's already showing wear. I tried calling Kahr but only got voice mail no live person after holding for nearly 30 min on my on my lunch. The gun shoots very accurate and no kick at all for a gun that size. I hope Kahr calls me tomorrow as the gunshop I bought it from offered no help other than to call Kahr. Thank God my Springfield XD works like a dream! Never a hiccup just too big to carry. I hope I have the same luck that "Ben" had w/ kahr cuz so far this this is a very disapointing Last edited by JohnKSa; January 2, 2015 at 10:19 PM.

April 6, 2009, 10:53 PM	#2
golfnutrlv Senior Member Join Date: November 5, 2008 Location: Spokane, WA Posts: 1,347	You know, ive heard some stories about Kahr's like this. Can't really help you, but hopefully they can. I've heard good stories too, so hopefully, its isolated and correctable. __________________ ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ VIGILIA PRETIUM LIBERTATIS "The price of liberty is vigilance" America is at an awkward stage. It's too late to work within the system, but too early to shoot the bastards.

April 7, 2009, 02:38 AM	#5
45FanFL Member Join Date: April 6, 2009 Location: Florida Posts: 23	PM45 Disaster Playboypenguin... Does not seem to make a difference. More times than not... using the slide stop results in a failure to feed w/ either magazine. I've had better luck dropping the slide by hand... Honestly I really love the way the gun shoots and it's surprisingly accurate and the kick is nothing... even my wife can shoot it w/ no problem. 3 people at the range shot it and it stove piped on all of them. No matter how much oil (next to dripping wet) it will not chamber a round and no way in hell would it chamber a hollow point. Since I had no luck on the phone I submitted an RMA request online. I really hope I can get it working. I really love this lil gun. I was thinking of offering up another $300 bucks to get the custom carry package by C&S and just have Kahr give me a new gun. As I mentioned before where the action meets the frame (slide) the polymer on the RHS is getting all chewed up w/ less than 200 rounds through it. I'm pretty concerned with the gun coming apart!

April 7, 2009, 05:20 AM	#6
Muddflap Senior Member Join Date: March 14, 2007 Location: NE Kansas Posts: 150	Leave Kahr a voice message. I tried calling for several days, with no luck. Even sent e-mails and that didn't work. Called and left a message, and they called back that day. Sorry to hear about your problems. Fortunately both Kahrs I have owned, have been good ones, but the were 9mm. __________________ Yo Macklin, great party, but no whiskey. We go home now.

April 7, 2009, 07:35 AM	#7
youngoilguy Member Join Date: April 1, 2009 Location: n.e. ohio Posts: 36	my pm 40 was a piece of crap. got rid of it after khar "fixed it" twice. never would cycle ammo properly. i had the p40 (all steel) and it was reliable, but way too heavy. __________________ supporter in ccw laws

April 7, 2009, 12:49 AM	#3
hoytinak Senior Member Join Date: July 5, 2006 Location: Texas Posts: 5,721	Welcome to the wonderful work of Kahr ownership. Once I cut my PM9 up and trashed it, I never looked back.

April 7, 2009, 12:58 AM	#4
Playboypenguin Junior member Join Date: February 27, 2006 Location: Great Pacific Northwest Posts: 11,515	When you are getting that jam on the first round are you dropping the slide by hand or using the slide stop as the instruction manual instructs?

April 7, 2009, 09:34 AM	#8
chris in va Senior Member Join Date: December 26, 2004 Location: Louisville KY Posts: 13,806	Seems like the small polymer 40 and 45 versions have more issues than the all steel ones. Kahr really needs to sit down and have a look at their larger caliber guns before they put these things on the market. Just curious, can you post a pic of the slide abrasion?

April 7, 2009, 10:31 AM	#9
Ben Senior Member Join Date: June 20, 1999 Location: Georgia Posts: 1,633	45FanFL I was getting the same feeding jams you are talking about with Hornady ammo. The cartridge isn't seating completely inside of the chamber. It caused the gun to do this and I had to use a screw driver to pry it back open. It's caused by Kahr's shallow throat. The round worked in every other 45 I tried. Sounds like YOURS might be even shallower since it's not even feeding ball ammo. See how the round isn't flush with the rear of the chamber? It sticks out. I didn't want them to fix my throat because it probably entailed replacing the barrel, so I asked them to leave it alone and work on the other problems. I just use different ammo now. I have some good connections over at Kahr now if you want some help. Let me know. They did a great job fixing me up. 300 rounds and not a single problem since getting it back. Ben

April 7, 2009, 10:46 AM	#10
Ben Senior Member Join Date: June 20, 1999 Location: Georgia Posts: 1,633	You have mail. Check your PM's. Ben

April 7, 2009, 01:34 PM	#11
45FanFL Member Join Date: April 6, 2009 Location: Florida Posts: 23	Man what a great forum! On hold now....left message yesterday still no call back! Arrrrrrrrgh! __________________ "Chicks dig me because I rarely wear underwear... and when I do it's usually something unusual" - Bill Murray - Stripes

April 7, 2009, 01:35 PM	#12
45FanFL Member Join Date: April 6, 2009 Location: Florida Posts: 23	How do I post a pic of the abrasion? __________________ "Chicks dig me because I rarely wear underwear... and when I do it's usually something unusual" - Bill Murray - Stripes

April 7, 2009, 02:30 PM	#13
45FanFL Member Join Date: April 6, 2009 Location: Florida Posts: 23	Things are looking up! Just got off the phone w/ Kahr....I'm sending it back on their dime! Very nice people there. Abrasion is nothing to be alarmed about I'm told...caused from reassembly...very sharp metal on RHS of action...if not careful when assembling...even if you are...it scratches the plastic. I'll keep y'all posted. Thanks to all those that have helped me so far!!!!!!! __________________ "Chicks dig me because I rarely wear underwear... and when I do it's usually something unusual" - Bill Murray - Stripes

April 8, 2009, 05:13 PM	#14
45FanFL Member Join Date: April 6, 2009 Location: Florida Posts: 23	Shipped gun today. __________________ "Chicks dig me because I rarely wear underwear... and when I do it's usually something unusual" - Bill Murray - Stripes

April 9, 2009, 01:19 AM	#15
denfoote Senior Member Join Date: November 12, 1999 Location: Buckeye Arizona Posts: 5,526	This is another reason why I have not bought a plastic Kahr!! I've said, for years, that Kahr needed to hire an engineer or two away from Glock or Springfield!! I'll keep my stainless Kahr thank you very much!! __________________ Ich bin kein Nationalsozialist!!!!!! Ich bin Republikaner!!!!!!!! Neca eos omnes. Deus suos agnoset. Arizona: Flush the Johns!!!

April 9, 2009, 05:10 PM	#16
45FanFL Member Join Date: April 6, 2009 Location: Florida Posts: 23	I received a call from Kahr today and the gun is being shipped back to me tomorrow. Amazing service!!! They said there was a problem with the receiver I believe. (I'll give better details as to what was repaired when I get the gun back. I received the call while I was at work and I was pretty busy when I got the call.) They also replaced the recoil spring. They also polished the feed ramp and a few other miscellaneous items. They said it was working like a champ! I can't wait to go to the range! It was a joy to shoot when it worked! No kick to mention and very accurate! The dbl-action trigger was very easy to get use to and was a smooth pull from start to finish. __________________ "Chicks dig me because I rarely wear underwear... and when I do it's usually something unusual" - Bill Murray - Stripes

April 9, 2009, 05:31 PM	#17
Ben Senior Member Join Date: June 20, 1999 Location: Georgia Posts: 1,633	Just think, your gun should be back in your hands by Saturday and it should be working better than new. I know mine sure did. I bet it'll be pretty dirty though. Glad Bob could help you. Bring 100+ rounds with you to the range and just run through them. Toss as many down range as you can. Most importantly, enjoy. Ben

April 9, 2009, 05:47 PM	#18
chris in va Senior Member Join Date: December 26, 2004 Location: Louisville KY Posts: 13,806	It's good to see a thread with a problem, diagnostic and fix. I wonder if Kahr will extend the chamber a bit due to the issue.

April 9, 2009, 07:13 PM	#19
MikeGoob Senior Member Join Date: January 31, 2006 Posts: 876	are there aftermarket barrels for the Kahr 45s?

April 9, 2009, 07:19 PM	#20
jon_in_wv Senior Member Join Date: August 22, 2004 Posts: 670	From what I've gathered in my surfing is that Kahr has done itself no justice with its polymer line of autos. They should have stuck with steel and maybe alloys for the frame. I've heard enough horror stories about the PM line to steer me clear of them completely.

April 9, 2009, 07:23 PM	#21
murphjup Senior Member Join Date: November 18, 2006 Location: Jupiter, Florida Posts: 460	Have you ever just tried loading the first round alone with no others in the magazine? Then Load either a full magazine or a none full one... I know from my Seecamps, that smaller pistols can have a problem stripping the first round from a full magazine... YMMV... Just a thought...

April 9, 2009, 07:36 PM	#22
RsqVet Senior Member Join Date: February 20, 2005 Posts: 2,474	Sounds like the issues I had with a MK 9, hopefully the factory fixed yours. Mine I was not so lucky but I moved on. Have to lower with the slide stop? Give me a break this is counter to 60-80% of defensive instruction I have seen or recived... if you can't sling shot the slide what is wrong with the gun and it's design?

April 9, 2009, 07:46 PM	#23
hdawson228 Senior Member Join Date: July 31, 2006 Posts: 1,301	I have had absolutely ZERO problems with my Kahr CW9. Polymer.

April 9, 2009, 07:59 PM	#25
DAVE RICHHARDS Member Join Date: March 3, 2008 Posts: 93	Was at the range today and had to help an older gentleman. After firing 15 rounds his whole extractor unit flew out of the gun (new CW9). A friend and I were ale to find the pieces and put them back in. It seemed good to go after that. Couldn't find out what caused it to break free to begin with. Been seeing alot of problems at the range with polymer Kahrs.