I just found the answer to .45 vs 9mm!

twoblink · December 20, 2002, 12:50 AM

<Flame suit on>
It's called a .40S&W!

Why the .45ACP is good:

~Big hole makes for deader bad guys.

Why the .45ACP sucks:

~Expensive
~Not a good package for CCW. Low-cap in a CCW package usually. This means your CCW and Main sidearm might be two different calibers. Very inefficient.

Why the 9mm is good:

~It's more prolific then Barny the purple dinosaur.
~NATO uses it
~Cheap to shoot
~High Velocity compared to .45ACP, speed kills
~Fits great in a ccw, a lot of rounds in a fairly compact size.

Why the 9mm is bad:

~Smaller hole
~Not enough energy

Alternative, .40S&W:

~ Almost the same size as a 9mm
~ use it for CCW or main sidearm round, same round double duty
~ More energy delivered then a 9mm
~ More velocity then a .45ACP
~ Almost as cheap to shoot as 9mm
~ More mass then the 9mm

It's the perfect solution to the .45 vs 9mm debate.

<Second Flame suit on!> Ready for the replies!

**Mike Irwin** · December 20, 2002, 12:54 AM

To quote from Blazing Saddles...

"We will now read from Matthew, Mark, Luke and DUCK!"

BOOM!

Kermit · December 20, 2002, 12:59 AM

Let's see, my USP 45 holds 10 rounds & my buddy's USP 40 holds 10 rounds...tie
Big hole translates to lots of soft tissue damage...bad guy loses

Don't really like shooting the 40 S&W...
REALLY like shooting the 45 acp & the 9mm
Reload the 45 acp = also cheap to shoot!
Perfect solution??? Don't think one exists

Blackhawk · December 20, 2002, 01:58 AM

You found the answer, but it doesn't fit the question.

BTW, what was the question...?

Modifiedbrowning · December 20, 2002, 02:34 AM

Deader?

twoblink · December 20, 2002, 02:34 AM

There is no spoon! Oh, ooops... Wrong answer..

I don't know what the question really is, as it's always a subjective question like which is BETTER the .45 or 9mm? Better is so vague..

bastiat · December 20, 2002, 02:37 AM

I thought it was rather simple. The answer is 10mm!

dsk · December 20, 2002, 02:43 AM

The .40 S&W. It's either:

1. The ideal compromise. Makes both the .45 ACP and the 9mm obsolete.

or:

2. A jack of all trades, master of none.

You decide. In the meantime I'll go clean one of my .45 ACP's again.

Redhook · December 20, 2002, 03:35 AM

When did the .45 become that much more expensive to shoot than the .40? At best $10 per case comparing the same brand and model of ball practice ammo?

Hum, maybe I'm crazy, but $0.01 per round isn't that much more "expensive" to me. I'd pay a heck of a lot more than that for the comfort level of knowing that I've got eight of my little friends in the mag.

But, that's just my opinion.

-Red-

9x19 · December 20, 2002, 04:16 AM

"I just found the answer..."

Bwahahahahahahahaha... cute tho'.

twoblink · December 20, 2002, 04:38 AM

I just asked my friend's dad this question, and he answerd "308Win... I'm sorry, what was the question again?"

AndABeer · December 20, 2002, 06:09 AM

My answer would be to carry one of each.

or what bastiat said.

denfoote · December 20, 2002, 06:33 AM

Answer!!
Do like I am gunna do and convert my Glock 29 to .40 S&W!!

Killit n Grillit · December 20, 2002, 08:39 AM

40 S&W's are for people who are ashamed to be seen carrying a 9mm,But don't have what it takes to carry a .45...Col.Jeff Cooper

New_comer · December 20, 2002, 09:54 AM

Hmmm...

Wrong answer!

Still, the 9mm rules!!!

For me at least...

Tamara · December 20, 2002, 09:59 AM

It amazes me seeing folks get this worked up over rounds that are about as different as, say, a Dodge Neon from a Chrysler Neon. "But, but, this one comes with gray velour trim on the seats!"

I'll only carry guns chambered in .25, .32, .32 Mag, .38 Spl, 9mm, .357 Mag, .40, 10mm, .41 Mag, .44 Spl, .44 Mag, or .45 ACP... unless I buy a carry gun in a different caliber, in which case I'd carry it, too.

Watch-Six · December 20, 2002, 10:23 AM

The answer is have both 9mm and 45. Ten 45s and one 9mm (that never leaves the safe.) Watch-Six
A post script:
My conscience forces me to admit: I don't own ten 1911s (yet), and I am carrying a Kahr PM9 at this minute.

seeker_two · December 20, 2002, 10:30 AM

Quote:

I'll only carry guns chambered in .25, .32, .32 Mag, .38 Spl, 9mm, .357 Mag, .40, 10mm, .41 Mag, .44 Spl, .44 Mag, or .45 ACP... unless I buy a carry gun in a different caliber, in which case I'd carry it, too.

Hope you have sturdy belt & suspenders to carry all those guns...

Tamara · December 20, 2002, 10:44 AM

Quote:

Answer!!
Do like I am gunna do and convert my Glock 29 to .40 S&W!!

What are you gonna do for an encore? Take the turbocharger off your car? Take the top five gears off your bicycle?

LMaz · December 20, 2002, 10:45 AM

Comparing .45 and 9mm is comparing apples and oranges.

If you can't hit what you are aiming at with 6-7 rounds, in an extremely tense and difficult situation, is scattering more bullets than this the answer?

Where are all the bullets going that aren't hitting your bad guy? How many others are dead or wounded because 10 rounds were fired and one was a kill shot.

"High Velocity compared to .45ACP, speed kills"
Speed kills only when driving recklessly.

The real answer is how do you get out of ANY situation without any shots fired? OR, how do you make all the shots you take good ones, to stop the threat?

I'll try to find you the site that has an article about the BEST gun and the BEST load for that all important kill shot. I believe the author's answer was that there isn't just ONE.

Blackhawk · December 20, 2002, 11:25 AM

Quote:

If you can't hit what you are aiming at with 6-7 rounds, in an extremely tense and difficult situation

My problem is getting the muzzle on target from concealment "fast enough" to start with launching bullet #1.

My CCW "mindset" is that I'll be covered by the BG's gun while he's warily and anxioiusly trying to keep the whole scene, me included, in view. I've got to smoothly, stealthily, and unobtrusively get my gun out and on him in an opportune split second that he's not thinking about me.

I just can't do that with any .45 I've tried out or have. I can do it under some dress conditions with a small 9mm, and under all dress conditions with a .32 mouser. Maybe when the Rohrbaugh 9R gets into my hand, it'll end up in my pocket as a 9mm mouser, but there doesn't seem to be a .45 candidate that fits my SD mindset.

All that said, what good is a RPG-7 or .45 to me that I can't get on target in a reasonable time to beat the BG's reactions to my St. Vitus dance drawing my weapon? So, my answer is the fastest launcher to get a bullet on target, and it's not a .45.

As for pleasure or unpressured shooting, the .45 and 9mm are twins, but since it's possible that a 9mm mouser would fit MY bill, 9mm has the edge.

Master Blaster · December 20, 2002, 11:36 AM

.45 ACP is great, 9 mm is also great

I like both thanks, I use the .45 as my primary full size .45 1911. and I will use my G-26 9mm as back up.

Or the .45 in my right hand and the 9mm in my left.

45Rookie · December 20, 2002, 01:29 PM

Killit n Grillit

Quote:

40 S&W's are for people who are ashamed to be seen carrying a 9mm,But don't have what it takes to carry a .45...Col.Jeff Cooper

Nice answer.

I like it

9mm vs .40 vs. 45ACP
Two Blink

Quote:

Why the 9mm is bad:
~Smaller hole
~Not enough energy

Ever heard of 9MM +P+ in 147 grain. Shot placement is what counts.

Quote:

Why the .45ACP sucks:
~Expensive
~Not a good package for CCW. Low-cap in a CCW package usually. This means your CCW and Main sidearm might be two different calibers. Very inefficient.

Talk to Tacoma PD and LAPD SWAT who carry 1911 sidearms. Though they are not CCW. It makes for an effective package even with a "low cap".

Need Higer capacity .45ACP try Glock or Kimber. They make some of the smallest 45's around with higher capacity.

The preicdent for your arguements are written poorly IMHO, I have read more objective reasoning, but I do understand what it is that your coming across. I respect your belief system as I have shot and am profiecient in various calibers.

Do they make peer reviewed research for ballistics? hehehe Even so people would still have a perference for a particular round.

For the record I would be happy with any of the three calibers if I needed a side arm. Individuals have to be good and comfortable with the round they decide to carry.

With an attorney attached to every bullet that leaves the gun, god forbid 1 leaving the gun hitting the target is better then 15 misses.

RESPECTFULLY,

45R

Handy · December 20, 2002, 01:44 PM

Oh, I had thought the answer was going to be a .58 caliber pistol with a 3 shot mag.

You know, bigger is better and capacity meaningless.

Onslaught · December 20, 2002, 02:09 PM

I kinda got the impression this was a humorous thread... some of you folks APPEAR to be taking this waaay to seriously.

I'm quite amused sometimes by the level of sheer hatred some of you guys have for the .40...

On a slightly serious note... Regardless of the overall small size and carry-ability, I just don't have a warm fuzzy feeling about a 230gr. bullet that normally has an 850fps velocity from a 5" barrel spitting itself out of a 3" barrel. I do love the .45, but I'll keep it in my full sized USP thanks. When talking shorty-short barrels, I'm much happier with a 155gr. bullet with an 1100fps velocity from a 4" barrel ejecting itself from a platform only 1" shorter. (just my

But my favorite part about the 9mm vs. .40 vs. .45 is... we have the RIGHT to own, carry, shoot, and argue about any of these calibers! as I love to point out... Everybody's got a right to an opinion, and freedom of choice and all that, so if you choose to protect yourself by carrying a .45 stubby, GOD [color=sky blue]BLESS[/color] AMERICA!

Merry Christmas TFL!

December 20, 2002, 12:54 AM	#2
Mike Irwin Staff Join Date: April 13, 2000 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 41,390	To quote from Blazing Saddles... "We will now read from Matthew, Mark, Luke and DUCK!" BOOM! __________________ "The gift which I am sending you is called a dog, and is in fact the most precious and valuable possession of mankind" -Theodorus Gaza Baby Jesus cries when the fat redneck doesn't have military-grade firepower.

December 20, 2002, 02:34 AM	#5
Modifiedbrowning Senior Member Join Date: January 14, 2002 Location: Montana Posts: 613	Deader? __________________ "Remember, no matter where you go, there you are" Buckaroo Banzai

December 20, 2002, 02:34 AM	#6
twoblink Senior Member Join Date: December 22, 1999 Location: Taipei, Taiwan Posts: 2,025	There is no spoon! Oh, ooops... Wrong answer.. I don't know what the question really is, as it's always a subjective question like which is *BETTER* the .45 or 9mm? Better is so vague.. __________________ "An unarmed society is one that's ripe for tyranny and oppression."

December 20, 2002, 02:37 AM	#7
bastiat Senior Member Join Date: February 14, 2001 Posts: 1,771	I thought it was rather simple. The answer is 10mm! __________________ Flashbunny.org - Pro-Freedom Propaganda Politically Incorrect & Pro-Gun Stuff To Buy

December 20, 2002, 04:16 AM	#10
9x19 Senior Member Join Date: October 15, 1998 Location: Sherman, TX USA Posts: 3,750	"I just found the answer..." Bwahahahahahahahaha... cute tho'. __________________ Make mine lean, mean, and 9x19!

December 20, 2002, 12:50 AM	#1
twoblink Senior Member Join Date: December 22, 1999 Location: Taipei, Taiwan Posts: 2,025	I just found the answer to .45 vs 9mm! <Flame suit on> It's called a .40S&W! Why the .45ACP is good: ~Big hole makes for deader bad guys. Why the .45ACP sucks: ~Expensive ~Not a good package for CCW. Low-cap in a CCW package usually. This means your CCW and Main sidearm might be two different calibers. Very inefficient. Why the 9mm is good: ~It's more prolific then Barny the purple dinosaur. ~NATO uses it ~Cheap to shoot ~High Velocity compared to .45ACP, speed kills ~Fits great in a ccw, a lot of rounds in a fairly compact size. Why the 9mm is bad: ~Smaller hole ~Not enough energy Alternative, .40S&W: ~ Almost the same size as a 9mm ~ use it for CCW or main sidearm round, same round double duty ~ More energy delivered then a 9mm ~ More velocity then a .45ACP ~ Almost as cheap to shoot as 9mm ~ More mass then the 9mm It's the perfect solution to the .45 vs 9mm debate. <Second Flame suit on!> Ready for the replies! __________________ "An unarmed society is one that's ripe for tyranny and oppression."

December 20, 2002, 12:59 AM	#3
Kermit Senior Member Join Date: February 6, 2001 Location: California Posts: 3,020	Let's see, my USP 45 holds 10 rounds & my buddy's USP 40 holds 10 rounds...tie Big hole translates to lots of soft tissue damage...bad guy loses Don't really like shooting the 40 S&W... REALLY like shooting the 45 acp & the 9mm Reload the 45 acp = also cheap to shoot! Perfect solution??? Don't think one exists

December 20, 2002, 01:58 AM	#4
Blackhawk Senior Member Join Date: November 4, 2001 Posts: 5,040	You found the answer, but it doesn't fit the question. BTW, what was the question...?

December 20, 2002, 02:43 AM	#8
dsk Senior Member Join Date: June 19, 2001 Posts: 1,603	The .40 S&W. It's either: 1. The ideal compromise. Makes both the .45 ACP and the 9mm obsolete. or: 2. A jack of all trades, master of none. You decide. In the meantime I'll go clean one of my .45 ACP's again.

December 20, 2002, 03:35 AM	#9
Redhook Senior Member Join Date: January 25, 2001 Posts: 254	When did the .45 become that much more expensive to shoot than the .40? At best $10 per case comparing the same brand and model of ball practice ammo? Hum, maybe I'm crazy, but $0.01 per round isn't that much more "expensive" to me. I'd pay a heck of a lot more than that for the comfort level of knowing that I've got eight of my little friends in the mag. But, that's just my opinion. -Red-

December 20, 2002, 04:38 AM	#11
twoblink Senior Member Join Date: December 22, 1999 Location: Taipei, Taiwan Posts: 2,025	I just asked my friend's dad this question, and he answerd "308Win... I'm sorry, what was the question again?" __________________ "An unarmed society is one that's ripe for tyranny and oppression."

December 20, 2002, 06:09 AM	#12
AndABeer Senior Member Join Date: April 9, 2000 Location: Lakeland, TN Posts: 1,622	.45 vs 9mm My answer would be to carry one of each. or what bastiat said. __________________ "The key is to not pull the trigger but to squeeze it." Evil Emporer Zurg "You are entitled to your own opinion, but you are not entitled to your own facts." Unknown

December 20, 2002, 06:33 AM	#13
denfoote Senior Member Join Date: November 12, 1999 Location: Buckeye Arizona Posts: 5,526	Answer!! Do like I am gunna do and convert my Glock 29 to .40 S&W!! __________________ Ich bin kein Nationalsozialist!!!!!! Ich bin Republikaner!!!!!!!! Neca eos omnes. Deus suos agnoset. Arizona: Flush the Johns!!!

December 20, 2002, 08:39 AM	#14
Killit n Grillit Member Join Date: February 25, 2001 Location: Columbus,Ga. Posts: 75	40 S&W's are for people who are ashamed to be seen carrying a 9mm,But don't have what it takes to carry a .45...Col.Jeff Cooper

December 20, 2002, 09:54 AM	#15
New_comer Senior Member Join Date: July 30, 2001 Location: Manila, Phil. Posts: 1,004	Hmmm... Wrong answer! Still, the 9mm rules!!! For me at least... __________________ Regards, New_comer USP9F, Remington 870 "It not in the size of the thing, it's how you use it..."

December 20, 2002, 09:59 AM	#16
Tamara Moderator Emeritus Join Date: March 11, 2000 Location: Indianapolis, IN Posts: 16,002	It amazes me seeing folks get this worked up over rounds that are about as different as, say, a Dodge Neon from a Chrysler Neon. "But, but, this one comes with gray velour trim on the seats!" I'll only carry guns chambered in .25, .32, .32 Mag, .38 Spl, 9mm, .357 Mag, .40, 10mm, .41 Mag, .44 Spl, .44 Mag, or .45 ACP... unless I buy a carry gun in a different caliber, in which case I'd carry it, too. __________________ MOLON LABE! 2% Unobtainium, 98% Hypetanium. The Arms Room: An Online Museum.

December 20, 2002, 10:23 AM	#17
Watch-Six Senior Member Join Date: April 19, 2000 Location: Utah Posts: 654	The answer is have both 9mm and 45. Ten 45s and one 9mm (that never leaves the safe.) Watch-Six A post script: My conscience forces me to admit: I don't own ten 1911s (yet), and I am carrying a Kahr PM9 at this minute.

December 20, 2002, 10:45 AM	#20
LMaz Junior Member Join Date: November 8, 2002 Location: Chicago north-west suburbs Posts: 6	I just found the answer.... Comparing .45 and 9mm is comparing apples and oranges. If you can't hit what you are aiming at with 6-7 rounds, in an extremely tense and difficult situation, is scattering more bullets than this the answer? Where are all the bullets going that aren't hitting your bad guy? How many others are dead or wounded because 10 rounds were fired and one was a kill shot. "High Velocity compared to .45ACP, speed kills" Speed kills only when driving recklessly. The real answer is how do you get out of ANY situation without any shots fired? OR, how do you make all the shots you take good ones, to stop the threat? I'll try to find you the site that has an article about the BEST gun and the BEST load for that all important kill shot. I believe the author's answer was that there isn't just ONE.

December 20, 2002, 11:36 AM	#22
Master Blaster Senior Member Join Date: October 11, 1999 Location: One of the original 13 Colonies Posts: 2,281	.45 ACP is great, 9 mm is also great I like both thanks, I use the .45 as my primary full size .45 1911. and I will use my G-26 9mm as back up. Or the .45 in my right hand and the 9mm in my left.

December 20, 2002, 01:44 PM	#24
Handy Junior member Join Date: August 31, 2001 Posts: 8,785	Oh, I had thought the answer was going to be a .58 caliber pistol with a 3 shot mag. You know, bigger is better and capacity meaningless.

December 20, 2002, 02:09 PM	#25
Onslaught Senior Member Join Date: November 11, 1999 Location: GA Posts: 1,749	I kinda got the impression this was a humorous thread... some of you folks APPEAR to be taking this waaay to seriously. I'm quite amused sometimes by the level of sheer hatred some of you guys have for the .40... On a slightly serious note... Regardless of the overall small size and carry-ability, I just don't have a warm fuzzy feeling about a 230gr. bullet that normally has an 850fps velocity from a 5" barrel spitting itself out of a 3" barrel. I do love the .45, but I'll keep it in my full sized USP thanks. When talking shorty-short barrels, I'm much happier with a 155gr. bullet with an 1100fps velocity from a 4" barrel ejecting itself from a platform only 1" shorter. (just my But my favorite part about the 9mm vs. .40 vs. .45 is... we have the RIGHT to own, carry, shoot, and argue about any of these calibers! as I love to point out... Everybody's got a right to an opinion, and freedom of choice and all that, so if you choose to protect yourself by carrying a .45 stubby, GOD [color=sky blue]BLESS[/color] AMERICA! Merry Christmas TFL! __________________ Yes Rico... KaBOOM!