DONT LIKE SIG

[RON 1]

AM I THE ONLY ONE THAT DOES NOT LIKE SIG...I have a 220.amd cannot not hit well with it .also the blueing is leaveing faster that I would like and even have a couple of places where it is trying to rust..dont want to start a debate here but am I the only one that thinks they are over priced and just not that great a value....

[STEVE M]

Ron, the finish problem has been talked about before and seems to be an on again off again problem with their quality control. As far as being able to hit with it, you have to remember that the grip angle of Sig pistols is different than most others. For some it fits their hand great, and for others, well, it takes more work or a different gun. I don't think they are over priced. They are very reliable, simple to field strip/clean/mantain. But on the other hand every gun manufacture has built lemons. Just my 2cents.

[Blue Duck357]

Sigs are high priced due to both the fact that they are well made, but also due too the exchange rate, and a million socialist programs that companies based in Europe have too pay taxes for (whether thier guns are made here or not), so no your not just paying for quality.

I like your point about not being able to hit with it. I shoot Sig's fine, but a Berreta model 92 or the Taurus clone just seems to want to point 4 feet low when I hold one. I can fight it and stay on target, but it takes some effort which hurts accuracy. People have all kinds of shapped hands and subtle differnces in grip which is why they make all kinds of guns. Yet you've still got the give me Sig/Glock/45 or death folks who think thier gun is the end all of handgun development just because it works for them. If I happned to shoot a Sig better than anything else I would not consider it overpriced and rated, but I don't so I do (for me that is).

Just my thoughts, Blue Duck

[AndABeer]

For the most part I don't care for them but have three in my collection, 225, 220, 226. My fave of the three is the 225 which is an unbelievably accurate pistol in my hands when fired single action. The 220 is OK. I bought the 226 after all the raves I read or heard about but I cannot hit with it. I prefer pistols with a single trigger pull, 1911, Glocks, HP. I had to repair the 220 recently and was impressed with the simplicity it detail stripped, with proper instruction. The finish does suck however.

[dairycreek]

I have two SIG and both of them are P220's. One is blued and the other has the stainless steel slide. I've never had any problem with them - literally never. As far as accuracy is concerned both do quite well when I do my job. Expensive? I think that they are more expensive than Glocks but I think they are pretty close in price to a number of good 1911's. My assessment is that they are very good pistols.

[RON 1]

I think the fellow that said they are not for everyone hit the nail on the head , there is no doubt they are exe for some people but I just cant shoot it as well as my glock..I shoot low and cannot really compensate for it. Guess that is why there is so many variations os semi autos out thare.

[mussi]

OTOH, once, this happened, you have a very precise handgun. My
military-issue SIG P220 in 9mm is almost as precise as the 210-6 my
dad has - my 226 and 228 don't hold up with that.

[Quantum Singularity]

I think the fellow that said they are not for everyone hit the nail on the head , there is no doubt they are exe for some people but I just cant shoot it as well as my glock..I shoot low and cannot really compensate for it. Guess that is why there is so many variations os semi autos out thare.

Your not the only one who shoots low with Sigs. I get great groups, but my Sigs have always given my fits (shooting low). My Glocks shoot to the point of aim. I can't explain why this happens. I do love my Sigs, but I don't like the fact that they all shoot low for me......

[JJCII]

My biggest complaint about the Sig P220 has nothing to do with accuracy, durability has been more an issue. The P220 I owned shed its finish quickly, I could live with that. The roll pin that held the breechface kept backing out and though the pistol was extremly accurate, I sold it. I hear the roll pin issue has been adressed, which may make it possible for me to purchase again. Saw one today at the gun show for $559, which was not much more than the Glock 21 sitting next to it.

I don't hate Sig's, but in some regards they may be overhyped.

JJCII

[magnum_force]

Has sig come out with a better finish for their classic line? Or does the finish just come off of the older models? Is the finish on the 2001 models better than the older ones?

[jason79]

I have a SIG P239 in 357SIG. Its house proofed a 2000 model by the AA stamped on it. The finish is called Nitron. Its a baked on finish added to the stainless steel slide. Its very durable! Mine is showing no real holster wear yet. We cant carry in Wisconsin so my finish may last longer than some. The frame is aluminum alloy with an anodized finsh. IMHO SIG is one of the industry leaders when it comes to anodizing alloys. A comparative finish is the Bruniton on Berettas. Its a type of anodizing. The finish off my Berettas wore through much faster. Not that their bad weapons, Ive owned several. The last few years has seen several improvments is SIGs finishs. K-Kote was terrible. The new Ifalon shows promise for the 220/245. Nitron works very well. As does the nickel plating, though pricey from SIG. Thanks,

jason

[Watchman]

For you guys that dont like to shoot low ...try a different bullet weight.

My Sig220 was not impressive with 230 grain bullets. I switched to 185 grain Silvertips and the gun is dead on the money.

It may be that the front sight height was regulated for the 185 'ers.

Getting your gun to shoot to the point of aim with fixed sights is usaully just a matter of expierimentation with different kinds of ammo, different manufactures and different bullet weights.

Dont give up too easily. I once bought an expensive gun cheap because the owner couldnt hit with it. It was shooting a foot high at 25 yards. I went to a differnt bullet weight and it was dead on.

Bad for him...good for me.

[Blue Duck357]

I think most of us are talking about our hands not really fitting the grip angle well causing the "natural" point to be so low that switching loads would not really help.

For example when I quickly grab my Taurus 92 the muzzel just dives, sure I can raise it back up to target but it just points low, a glock or 45 auto comes right to the target for me naturally which makes it easier to shoot accuratly faster.

Good point about the loads and fixed sights though.

Thanks, Blue Duck

[Quantum Singularity]

For example when I quickly grab my Taurus 92 the muzzel just dives, sure I can raise it back up to target but it just points low, a glock or 45 auto comes right to the target for me naturally which makes it easier to shoot accuratly faster.

I agree that it is a grip angle thing. I've used all bullet weights in my 9mm Sigs and it still shoots low (some loads/bullet weights more low than others). My Glocks tend to shoot to the point of aim.

[mikey357]

Gee, I THOUGHT it was bescause I am kind of a CONSERVATIVE person, gunwise, but...I don't like the SIG autoloaders, either!!! Feel kinda "blocky", long trigger-reach in DA mode, and MY pet peeve-NO MANUAL SAFETY!!! Which is also why I do not like Glocks, either...that, and they feel like a two-by-four with a thyroid problem!!! If its got to be an auto, give me a CZ75, BHP or a Smith third gen'....FWIW....mikey357

i have had good luck with the 228 and 229.
I had a 220 that just would not do hollow points.

[Tamara]

Lordy, do I ever miss my P-228.

I will however, have to agree that older ones (pre-stainless and no K-kote) deserved the old joke:

"What does SIG stand for?"
"Store In Grease"

From my time working at a gun store, I remember that no modern gun by a major manufacturer (with the possible exception of the P7's) needed to be checked and oiled while sitting in the showcases to prevent orange fingerprints as much as older P-series SIGs.

[Jager1]

I own two P226's and can't shoot the P220's worth a darn either. Shot them enough to know that I am probably better of with my 1911's. The P220's would complement my P226's well, if I could get the P220's to pattern worthwhile. All of you P220 shooters that are good with them, I envy you.

[jimmy]

Personally I find Glocks and 1911s easier to shoot. But I do like SIGs. Their problems are few and their quality control is, at least in my experience, excellent. Are they worth the money? That depends. When I'm buying a SIG, I wince at the price tag. But after it's paid for, I'm happy--especially if it's a P228.

[BigMike]

To me, SIG's just don't have a natural balance in my hand, especially the P220. The P228 is better though...

Mike

[CD1]

I have a P220 in .45 and I love it. It feels like a natural extension of my hand. Seems almost like a German engineer snuck into my house one night and measured my hand. Feeds hollow points with no probs. Shoots as accurately as I can with 230 grain or 185 grains. I love the thing. Finish is a little weak. No rust, but the blueing has worn off where the holster rubs it.

[Ala Dan]

Ron 1; Sorry for your past bad experience's with Sig-Sauer
firearms. As everyone here at TFL know's, they are my personal favorite. And as far as the P220 .45ACP goes,
mine in remarkable!!! It's the standard, blue finished
P220 with regular Sig site's (no night site's). My groups
hit POA with outstanding result's. I use a variety of ammo; some factory ball and hollow-point's, some commerically cast LSWC's, etc. Never, ever experienced a
problem with this gun; or ANY other Sig for that matter.
Everyone speaks of the poor finish. Well, it's definitely
not a tennifer process; but with a small amount of TLC,
the Sig finish will hold up pretty well. I've carried this particular gun since 1988, in a lot of different ways: duty
rig, IWB "Mexican style", pistol rug, etc. and my firearm
does not have any marks or rust spot's on it. I also use
"Break Free CLP" for lubrication purposes.

I shot this firearm last Saturday, in the presence of TFL member's Capbuster and Amelia; so they can attest to this
gun's accuracy and reliability. So in closing, I find the
irrational rap against Sig, to be on an individual basis.
Of course, those that favor 1911's, Glock's, H&K's, and
Beretta's will find all kind's of problems with the Sig's;
but it's strictly their opinion and right. As I stated on a
previous post, I would compare my P220 with a Rolls-Royce.

Best Wishes,
Ala Dan, N.R.A. Life Member

[M1911]

I have a Sig 239 in .40. I have to admit that I don't use it that much. It feels top-heavy in my hands, and the bore axis is rather high. Also, it is a significantly larger gun than my Kahr K40, so the K40 gets the nod over the 239 for concealed carry. I'm also not a fan of DA/SA -- I prefer a gun with a consistent trigger pull (e.g., SA, DAO, or striker-fired). The 239 is accurate, reliable, and the SA trigger is pretty good. Just not my cup of tea.

Jared
PS. No, it's not for sale. Selling guns is against my religion.

[SigmundSauer]

I have owned five SIG's.

Bought a P-226 when I was 17. Great. I couldn't shoot it very well --- until I learned to shoot. A tack driver. So good that I purchased a second P-226. Just as good but I sold it to buy a P-239 in 9mm. One of the best deals I've ever made. Then I bought a P-2340 (sigpro) in .357 SIG and then bought a .40 Cal. barrel for it. Most recently I purchased and P-210 in 9mm. All of my SIG's have been totally up to the SIG legend. That's why I continue buying them. I have handled many other SIG's as well the only bad one was a P-220 that was damaged by a gunsmith during an armorer's level take down when he didn't even know how to take apart a SIG - go figure?

All of my SIGs are capable of well less than 2" groups at 25 meters with good ammo. I've shot 1" groups with most of them. All are supremely reliable.

Admittedly, the earlier sheet steel formed slides do have the tendency to rust when not cared for. The parkerizing is no different than the finish on your milspec firearms. If you are worried about your finish wearing off then don't use your gun. However, any reasonable maintenance of your SIG will totally prevent rust as I've never had a problem. Remember the P-226 with the sheet steel slide was the weapon of choice for the Navy SEALS. They also regard maintenance as critical. More recent SIG's have stainless slides impregnated with Nitron --- can't be beat for corrosion resistance or finish durability. The non-nitron finished SS slides would wear quickly but the finish was only cosmetic and didn't bond well with the SS.

For those of you that complain about the firing characteristics of your SIG's -- well, it's either that the ergonomics of the pistol just don't fit you well or you're not well-trained on the SIG.

For those of you who criticize the price, accuracy, durability, reliability, and quality control of SIG. I'm truly sorry. SIG is highly regarded in the industry as having among the best-engineered and best-quality pistols to be had. Certainly, if their quality control is less than perfect it still as good or better than the best of them. Every German-made SIG I've owned is shipped with a test fired target that will attest to the accuracy of the pistol. Most SIG's will do better than their test target with quality ammo. All of the SIG's test-fired in the Exeter, NH plant are test fired as well (the target is just not shipped).

I'm not a blind SIG owner. I'm a loyal SIG owner because of my personal experience, coupled with the opinions of experts, and I have yet to find a better bargain at the gun store for the quality of the product.

Feel free to e-mail me, should you want to talk SIG, or just flame me.

SS

[J. Parker]

Okay, how's this for a flame...WELCOME my friend to TFL! Best Regards, J. Parker