Hunting Bullet Showdown...

[gedenke]

While researching which hunting bullet I'm going to load this year, I came across this. Check it out guys and let me know your thoughts and opinions. I thought it was pretty cool. Oh, one thing...let's not make this into a bash-fest, keep it respectful fellas!

http://www.huntingmag.com/guns_loads...905/index.html

[MCKNBRD]

Interesting info and testing...but I'll stick with my Nosler Ballistic Tips in 150 or 165 grain out of my .308. Haven't had a deer that I hit go more than 20 yards...

'course...if I ever go out west or something, this kind of info will be dug up and researched RELIGIOUSLY!

Good link...thanks for the post!

Byrdman

[gedenke]

Too bad they couldn't show test results simulating a bone strike with those bullets. That may prove to be more revealing...

[SkySlash]

I took 3 deer this last season using Remington Core-Lokt .30/06 in a 180gr bullet.

The first one was a shot taken less than 20 feet from the deer, and he made it about 15 feet before he dropped. The other two were 2-300 yards out each, and both simply laid down upon being shot.

Heart/Lung shots on all 3.

-SS

[HOGGHEAD]

You did not specify your cartridge or what you will be hunting, so bullet selection is a bit difficult.

It has been my general experience with bullets that they are not scopes. You do not get what you pay for in other words.

IMO premium bullets have premium prices, but not premium performance. You need to keep in mind that writers and magazines stay in business because of new products, and premim bullets are a large part of their advertising.

I have seen a lot of shooters paying a bunch of money for expensive bullets that do not give any better performance than a plain old Sierra Game King, or a Remington CL bullet.

It amazes me when a hunter will go out and spend $30 or $40 for a box of bullets that will not kill a deer a bit better than any other bullet.

IMO the only use for premium bulets if for dangerous game. And there are only a hand full of dangerous game hunters out there. As a matter of fact there is not one thick skinned big game animal in our continent(I think).

I have never seen an elk walk away from a 30 caliber 200 grain Sierra Game King. I have never seen the expensive bullets outshoot this bullet. So I consider premium bullets a waste of money. Tom.

[taylorce1]

IMO the only use for premium bulets if for dangerous game. And there are only a hand full of dangerous game hunters out there. As a matter of fact there is not one thick skinned big game animal in our continent(I think).

This would be true if the current trend wasn't to push the lightest bullet at the highest velocity possible to hunt big game. As long as you keep impact velocities 2800 fps or lower most standard cup core bullets are all a hunter ever needs. But there are a lot of hunters out there using rifles that launch a bullet above 3100 fps and try to take a little old whitetail deer at 50 yards and wonder why their bullet doesn't hold together.

I use the Sierra GK and PH for 90% of my hunting, when I feel that I need a premium bullet I step up to the Nosler Partition. I tend to use the heaviest bullet possible that will shoot accurately out of my rifles when hunting big game. I know I'm not about to jump ship from what has been working for me just because of some article in a gun rag.

[gedenke]

Hogg, good point, sorry I didn't elaborate. I'm shooting a custom 6.5mm. I've been running 140gr Hornady Interlocks through it with decent results (about 1.6" groups @ 100yds). Not great, but the gun is old and could use a new barrel, so I find this "acceptable". Haven't hunted with it yet.

Anyway, this year's Blacktail hunt is a few months away, and I'm thinking of trying some different bullets to see what shoots well. In the coming weeks I'm probably going to try the Nosler Partition, and maybe Accubond or Hornady Interbond. I'm also interested in the Barnes Triple-Shock, but I've been told that old barrels get horrible copper fouling with solid bullets. Is there any truth to this or should I try them?

The reason I'm looking into a better bullet, is because last year I shot a 200lb buck with a 150gr Core-Lokt (the gun was a Savage 30/06, 20yds distance). While the kill was quick and sure, there was no exit wound and the bullet broke into two chunks after impacting a rib and the heart. So, while it worked, I'd like my bullets to hold together a little better.

I'll also be hunting elk, but, I have serious reservations about attempting to use my 6.5. I've heard that a .270 is as small as one should go for that size animal. (on a side note, I'm considering getting the new Marlin XL7 for that). Black Bear and Cougar are also on this year's schedule.

[Scorch]

Did you notice that they did not compare any of those to the Nosler Partition? I have hunted with Nosler Partitions ever since Nosler quit offering the Solid Base bullets and replaced them in the lineup with Ballistic Tips. So in the last 15 years I have harvested 9 animals with Nosler Partitions, weight retention and penetration were superb, and accuracy is as good as the rifle will deliver. All this for about 40 cents per bullet. Compare that with some of the premium bullets on the market, and it's downright cheap. Barnes TSX are over $1 ber bullet, MRX are almost $2 per. Nosler Accubonds are about the same cost as Partitions. Combined Technology bullets (Nosler + Winchester) are a bit more. Swift Sciroccos are over $1 per, and A-Frames are over $1 per. All of them perform admirably and as advertised. But, in reality, for average game animals at average velocities, WW PowerPoints, Rem CoreLokt, Sierra GameKings, Hornady Interlocks, Speer HotCor, Nosler Ballistic Tips all work well, at very reasonable costs per bullet. If you feel you need a premium bullet, buy some and use them, but there's no need to mortgage the home for a few rounds of ammo.

A 6.5mm bullet will kill elk just as dead as a 270 bullet (.264" vs .277" bullet diameter). Elk are not bullet-proof. Just shoot them where it counts. The fact that your 30-06 bullet killed your deer and did not exit just shows that the deer was still dead. Don't lose any sleep over it. If you are worried about the 6.5mm (IIRC yours is a 6.5-257 Roberts), just use the 30-06 again.

[davlandrum]

I shoot 150 gr accu-bonds now (reload). I did shoot 165 gr Nosler Ballistic Tips. Both kill things pretty darn dead (mule deer)

In the grand scheme of things, it might be a waste of money compared to other options, but

1) they shoot great in my rifle
and
2) I have a lot of confidence in them

Honestly, I don't shoot enough 30-06 hunting ammo in the course of a year to make a lot of difference in money spent.

Trying to get the hang of my .460 SW, on the other hand, is keeping me broke....

[ZeroJunk]

I hunt with Nosler Partitions and they have worked well for me. But, I'm not sure that the shots would have had a different result with any of the bullets tested.

If these guys can convince hunters to pay $2 a bullet, more power to them.

[elkman06]

While the Nosler Partitions are a premium bullet, I don't think that twice the price for my hunting bullets is justified
. The Hornaday BTSPs' I shoot kill them just as dead and I don't worry about the price of rounds at the range as I would w/ Noslers.
elkman06

[Sportdog]

It was a good read and seeing as I recently purchased a 300 WinMag it really caught my attention. I'm far from a bullet expert but I have used several handload bullets with the following results. #1 Hornady 100gr Spire Point, 243Win....dead deer. #2 Speer 105gr Hot Cor, 243Win....dead deer. #3 Speer 165gr Hot Cor, 30-06....dead deer. #4 Sierra 180gr Pro Hunter RN, 30-06....dead deer. #5 Nosler 150gr (if I remember correctly) Ballistic Tip, 30-06....dead deer. In factory ammo I've used 30-06 Remington CoreLokt's 150gr, 30-06....dead deer. Moral of the story. Deer hunting is not an area that I would spend the extra cash when the conventional bullets do such a good job. On the other hand if I ever make that trip to Alaska to hunt you can bet that I'll be spending the big greenbacks for those premium bullets if for no other reason than the preparation for a hunt like that is half the fun!

[HOGGHEAD]

I put thousands of bullets down range every year, so for me cost is a factor. If a person only puts 5 or 10 bullets down range, then I can understand putting more money in a bullet, but if a person puts 10 bullets down range a year, then bullet selection would not be their main problem.

Some one said something about needing premium bullets for high velocity cartridges?? I can not see a problem with a 165 grain Sierra bullet on a deer at twenty yards at 3100fps. I am pretty sure the deer would be dispatched quickly?? Regardless of how wel the bullet holds together??

I may be wrong about this, But personally I believe there are lots of things you could buy with the money wasted(IMO) on premium bullets. But if you have the money to spend then go ahead. Tom.

[taylorce1]

Some one said something about needing premium bullets for high velocity cartridges?? I can not see a problem with a 165 grain Sierra bullet on a deer at twenty yards at 3100fps. I am pretty sure the deer would be dispatched quickly?? Regardless of how wel the bullet holds together??

That was me, but I said that because I'm not just a deer hunter. Sure I hunt deer, and I don't use a premium bullet very often on them, but I love to chase elk, pronghorn, and the occasional bear as well. I want a bullet that penetrates and heard of any problems with the 180 grain Sierra out of any .30-06 on game elk sized, but 180 would be the minimum I'd use on an elk in a Sierra.

I started using Nosler Partitions when I started hunting elk with the .270. Just for because of the smaller diameter and lighter weight of hunting bullets I was using. Deer and pronghorn are easy to kill, elk are a bit tougher, and I don't want to track a wounded bear. So for the latter two animals I prefer the premium bullet just for the added insurance of penetration.

Elk rarely present a broadside shot and unless you get lucky are generally on the move during rifle season, so less than ideal angles come up as the only shots you might have. Bear hunting I try for a shoulder shot, take out one or both of the front shoulders and usually that bear isn't going anywhere, so I want a bullet that holds together through the heavy shoulder bones. If I was just basing my experience off of deer then yes the standard Speer, Hornady, Sierra, Winchester, and Remington bullets would be great.

[davlandrum]

Just to clarify my earlier post, I said I don't put enough 30-06 HUNTING ammo down range to make a big difference.

If I am just spending range time, I go cheap. Final prep for hunting and hunting, I go expensive...

[HOGGHEAD]

Taylor I agree with you on the heavier elk bullet. I actually prefer the Siera 200 grain Game King bullet in my 300 RUM. We have shot this bullet in 4 different 300 RUM's that we have shot elk with. We have not had any problems at all with this 200 grain bullet.

So I guess we agree more here than disagree. But I truly have a hard time believing the 300RUM can push the 200 grain Sierra so fast that it just explodes?? This is just my opinion, but as I said the Sierra 200 grain pill has worked great for us.

I do realize the Nosler Partition is a great bullet. And I guess it could be considered a happy medium for the price. However we have not been happy with the Partition over the years(been reloading since 1975). I do not feel the need for heavy penetration, even for elk. Heck they are also thin skinned. I do realize they can be tough to put down. But I try to make up for that with weight of bullet. We shoot 300's and 338's. With either a 200 grain bullet, or a 250 grain pill. Also as far as the partition is concerned, I have never been able to get one to shoot as well as the Sierra 200 grain bullet. For some reason that Sierra bullet in a 30 caliber shoots great(for me). Tom.

[gedenke]

Scorch, the -06 would be the obvious choice for the elk hunt, but that gun doesn't belong to me. As of now, my only rifles are my 6.5 and a 10/22 plinker. (this poor white boy is on a limited budget! ).

Some very good points are coming up in here, and that's exactly what I'd hoped for. I can agree with Taylor that deer, being one of the softer of the N.American "big game", and that your average everyday hunting bullet will do. But the elk and bear definately require a better quality, bettter performing (not to mention more exspensive, unfortunately) bullet.

[taylorce1]

Some very good points are coming up in here, and that's exactly what I'd hoped for. I can agree with Taylor that deer, being one of the softer of the N.American "big game", and that your average everyday hunting bullet will do. But the elk and bear definately require a better quality, bettter performing (not to mention more exspensive, unfortunately) bullet.

If you want to take the bite out of premium bullets you need to hand load. I can reload 100 rounds usually for less than 40 rounds of premium stuff. Sure it isn't as cheap as reloading the standard stuff but with 100 rounds you should be able to find your load, and have some left over to hunt and re-confirm zero for a couple of years. You don't have to send a lot of rounds down range with hunting rifles every year, that is what they make .22 rimfire and centerfire rifles for.

[Sidetracked]

Any other day, I might throw some sand in Nosler's eyes for my suffering... but today I feel generous. I'll let them slide, and chalk it up to 5 rifles not liking the partition.


I buy Remington Cor-Lokts buy the boatload. I'll probably continue to use them until 1. I don't exist; 2. Remington doesn't exist; 3. India invades and conquers. They have performed well for me, and the price cannot be beat.

On the rare occassion I feel the need for a higher quality bullet, I go to Barnes (had some trouble with X bullets, though) or Swift.

I have had very good experiences with Winchester Fail Safes, but you won't see me paying for the ammo myself.:barf:

[Kreyzhorse]

I buy Remington Cor-Lokts buy the boatload. I'll probably continue to use them until 1. I don't exist; 2. Remington doesn't exist; 3. India invades and conquers. They have performed well for me, and the price cannot be beat.

I'm with you, I think Core-Lokts are outstanding rounds and had great success with them. I will admit I have mostly stopping using them in favor or Winchester Ballastic Tips only due to the fact that the Core-Lokts are dirty to shoot.

On a western hunting trip, my partner and I both fired the same amount of shots, him using Winchester, me using Core-Lokts. After seeing how easy his gun was cleaned and how long it took me to clean mine, I mostly stopped using Core-Lokts after that but continue to use them for my Ruger 45/70 Gov't.

[Art Eatman]

Back in the early days of TFL we had a similar discussion, although it focussed more on 30-caliber and a good bit on Sierra bullets. I emailed the Sierra folks, and one of their guys got in on the discussion.

I'd had a 150-grain SPBT blow up in a mule deer's neck. 30-yard shot. No exit. Sure, dead deer, but I was surprised by the blowup.

The gist of it was that the BT is of lighter construction that the flat-base, in that weight. The BT doesn't do well at impact speeds above 2,700 or 2,800. Otherwise, fine and dandy. Well, okay; most prior kills were down at that speed. (26" barrel; book-max loads, mostly beyond 100 yards for me.)

I've mentioned before the superior performance of 180-grain SPBT Sierras, as to cratering on steel compared to not much mark. I'd assume that 200s would be similar. More heavily built than the 150s, by that "adequate smidgen".

I guess the point to all this is that consideration must be given to the package. "Package" includes muzzle velocity and distance to the critter as well as bullet construction and shape. Some very good bullets can give poor results if forced outside their design parameters.

[chow chow]

As long the game is down and dead, theres meat to bring home. I guess we are bombarded by advertisement in magazines and internet about how good premium bullets are . These of course are written by gun writers paid for by these companies. They have been successful at conditioning us all of going for more expensive ammo while the plain jane ones are as good.

But hey, I have to get some WInchester Super X at local Walmart.

[HOGGHEAD]

Art what you say makes perfectly good sense. But as you said the deer probably died in its tracks. And as you know the bullet sheds a lot of velocity so when the bullet is 100 yards or so down range the bullet would be back in its so called "expanding velocity" range.

I just get a kick about all the hunters who recommend 243's and 25-06's as an elk rifle, but when you discuss a 200 grain Sierra hunting bullet instead of a $1-$2 bullet hunters will say it will not hold up for elk. Tom.