Mini 14 not cycling

RobsImprza00 · March 7, 2009, 03:15 PM

I purchased this gun very recently, the only range available to me currently allows the use of their .223 Frangible ammo, because its an indoor range they limit the .223 rounds.

With this ammo i was unable to get 1 round to cycle in automatically, i had to cock each round just like a bolt action.

The range owner told me to find a spot to shoot some regular .223 ammo, well i havent had the time to yet but, my question is can the low grain or frangible ammo cause this?

I dont have access to an outdoor range until spring time, by then the gun will expire its 30 day warranty through the store for returns, and i dont want to have to wait 3 months for ruger to service the gun.

LateNightFlight · March 7, 2009, 04:16 PM

I'd contact Ruger and describe the problem to them. I've had similar problems with a new Mini, although in 6.8mm, and they sent me a new magazine.

The problem I was having is that as the bolt moved backwards and over the loaded magazine, the head end of the rounds (the back, primer end, whatever) were squatting in the magazine and not coming back up. The bolt wasn't able to pick them up as it moved forward. Try filling the magazine and push down on the back of the top cartridge and see if it returns to level when you release it. If not, that's the problem.

Ruger was good about sending a new mag without requiring me to return the original. I got it in about a week.

RobsImprza00 · March 7, 2009, 04:49 PM

My problem is that the hammer isnt going backwards by itself, i have to pyshically pull the bolt back, it will eject the round and reload the new round on its own when you let go.

I will give ruger a call or email and see if they can take a looksee

mcraig8377 · March 7, 2009, 05:12 PM

this is a growing problem recently in 5.56/223 magazines regaurdless of make. I AGREE TRY A DIFFERENT MAGAZINE.

pbrktrt · March 7, 2009, 05:43 PM

i can almost guarantee it's the ammo. normal rounds of almost any kind will cycle a mini to the point of almost being excessive. trust me, when weather permits & you shoot some real ammo you'll see your empties fly 40 ft.

TheManHimself · March 7, 2009, 06:55 PM

It's the ammo. The people who think it's the magazines clearly didn't read the OP. Bad magazines cause failure to feed issues, they don't prevent the action from cycling. The Mini design is so tremendously overgassed that flimsy metal mag lips aren't going to slow the bolt's reciprocation enough to stop it from even resetting the hammer.

Either the bolt assembly, op rod, or mainspring would have to be way out of spec (highly unlikely), or it's the underpowered ammo.

And given the aforementioned overgassed action of the Mini, that ammo is way under spec for .223 Remington ammo. Like .22 Hornet-level, if that. Even older batches of Wolf that only push a 55gr bullet to 2800FPS from a 20" barrel will cycle a factory Mini-14.

.308win · March 7, 2009, 07:06 PM

It isn't the magazine. What is the weight of the bullet? I have a Mini with a small diameter aftermarket gas bushing and it will not cycle when shooting 40gr bullets with a max powder charge - either the pressure cycle is wrong or not enough pressure or both. If the gun is used, check the gas bushing it may be a small aftermarket bushing (I think the standard is .06 but don't hold me to that; try it with a regular round and note how far does it ejects the spent round. If it doesn't eject it more than 4 or 5 feet someone has probably changed the bushing.

KMO · March 8, 2009, 10:04 AM

I'll bet your gas port bushing is either missing or clogged. You're going to have to pull the 4 Allen-head screws at the gas block. When you remove the block half that rests against the bottom of the barrel, look for a small bushing about the size of a common pencil eraser. If this bushing is missing or clogged, that rifle will not cycle, just like you described. If it is there, check to see if the orifice is clogged. Check the piston as well, and the port on the barrel, to make sure both have positive air flow. If you have no bushing, Midway sells them for about $1 each (buy a few at that price). When you go to reassemble the block, get a partner involved. You should be able to feel the bushing seat into place as you slide the bottom half-assembly along the barrel. Be sure the stock is removed when you do this. Once you feel it in its right position, have your partner position the upper block half and tighten up the screws in a rotating sequence. 10 to 1 this fixes your problem...

rugerfreak · March 8, 2009, 10:21 AM

Why not just drive out into the country and give it a "function check"?

Couple of shots into the ditch of a desolate road ought to do it.

Art Eatman · March 8, 2009, 11:38 AM

From reading Post #3, it appears that Post #8 addresses the likely problem.

Testing: Got a basement? Got a 5-gallon plastic bucket? Got sand? If yes, test.

But use both ear plugs AND hearguards.

.308win · March 8, 2009, 12:43 PM

If the bushing was missing, having enough gas pressure to cycle would definitely not be the result but it might not seal well enough hold the pressure to cycle. You would see the evidence of gas leakage; a clogged port could be the culprit.

RobsImprza00 · March 8, 2009, 02:14 PM

thanks for the input guys, im going to try what kmoffitt said about the gas bushing. If its not that, i might just go out into my backyard and give it a whirl with the real ammo.

RobsImprza00 · March 8, 2009, 02:46 PM

Now i must be crazy or something, but The parts that are shown in the manual do not exist.

Check out the pics i just attached. The Gas block doesnt have the little tube, the orfice or anything that should be there according to the manual.

Its a solid piece of metal...

.308win · March 8, 2009, 03:23 PM

The gas block will have four allen type cap bolts. The gas port, gas pipe, and bushing is in the bottom half of the gas block. There is a short tube (gas pipe) that extends from the bottom half of the gas block toward the action. The slide assembly engages the gas pipe; gas bled from the barrel pushes the slide asembly rearward; the larger the bushing the more gas is bled from the barrel. Here is the schematic for the Mini. If yours doesn't have the gas pipe it was either omitted during assembly or the bushing was omitted during assembly allowing the gas pipe to be lost or driven into the slide assembly (is it in the slide assembly). If it is new I would contact Ruger for a RA and return it for warranty service. There is an entire forum on Perfect Union that will tell you everthing you wanted to know about the Mini; one of the Mods is CajanGeo - if he can't help you no one can.

NickySantoro · March 8, 2009, 03:35 PM

Mini-14s are ultra reliable. Unless the rifle is seriously short of lubrication, and likely not even then, the problem is likely that ammo supplied is so lightly loaded for indoor use that it just won't cycle the action.
I've never used that type of ammo in my Mini but I have used some ammo that would not reliably cycle a couple of ARs. The Mini had no problems with it.
I'd bet the farm that ammo is the problem.

doorgunner · March 8, 2009, 03:53 PM

If your rifle doesn't have a gas piston, it's likely a stainless 196 series, with the ranch rifle receiver and GB barrel. This is a KMini-14GBBAO model, which was designed by Ruger to be a manually operated/bolt action, for importation to countries that prohibit semiauto ownership. Somebody is flooding the market with these things, as I've seen two for sale on the internet in the last 24 hrs.. One was for sale on gunbroker, and I had to email the seller and let him know that it WAS NOT a semiauto Mini-14. He contacted me back, and was highly upset with his distributor.

RobsImprza00 · March 8, 2009, 04:05 PM

That is exactly what it is, I was told when i bought it, it was the semiauto model. If this is the case, im going to return it. This is not what i paid for and am going to be really disappointed.

The serial number starts with 196... you are correct.

RobsImprza00 · March 8, 2009, 04:14 PM

I just contacted the store i purchased the rifle, and told me this should not be happening and the serial numbers beginning with 196 means they are an 08 model Mini 14 Semi auto. The gun is defective and or is missing the correct gas functioning parts.

Im going to bring the gun back and we are going to dig into this alittle more. I will let you know how this goes.

Thanks guys!

doorgunner · March 8, 2009, 04:25 PM

It"s obvious that, like most, your dealer doesn't have a clue. All 2008 and up domestic production models are 580 to 581 prefix guns. I don't know where he is getting his information, but he needs to find a reliable source, and more importantly, he needs to research his products before dumping them on the market.

pbrktrt · March 8, 2009, 04:47 PM

doorgunner, that indeed is interesting info. i never have heard of that model or seen it listed. i knew of the 222 models for export but nothing like a single shot. the more you think you know, the more you learn you don't. i'd still like to see pics of his rifle & gas block disassembled. i still suspect sub-standard range ammo but i hope we get to find out. thanks for the info.

doorgunner · March 8, 2009, 04:56 PM

No problem. They are rare, but they are starting to show up frequently. Just remember, 196 series GB models for domestic production had the standard receiver and rear sight, NOT the ranch rifle receiver. Here you go:

.308win · March 8, 2009, 05:04 PM

I didn't know there was such an animal but I haven't paid much attention to the Mini world since I bought my AR. I may have to get it out and shoot it some this spring.

RobsImprza00 · March 8, 2009, 06:12 PM

well after talking to the salesman, they are going to fire it with regular ammo tomorrow at the range to make sure its not the ammo, He has never heard of RUger making a type of single shot rifle, and i will be hearing from him. Hopefully with news of a replacement gun.

doorgunner · March 8, 2009, 06:23 PM

If your Mini looks like the above, then he is just wasting his ammo. Semiauto Mini-14's must have a gas piston. If not, then it isn't going to cycle. It's like expecting a car without an engine to start up. Your dealer should have been a lot more up on his game. Any pre 580 series Ranch Rifle, with a government barrel should raise a red flag with anybody with any experience in retailing firearms.

blume357 · March 8, 2009, 08:12 PM

one way or another. I say let them fire a few rounds and figure it out... hopefully it is that crappy ammo at the range... but who knows.

March 7, 2009, 03:15 PM	#1
RobsImprza00 Member Join Date: March 9, 2008 Posts: 46	Mini 14 not cycling I purchased this gun very recently, the only range available to me currently allows the use of their .223 Frangible ammo, because its an indoor range they limit the .223 rounds. With this ammo i was unable to get 1 round to cycle in automatically, i had to cock each round just like a bolt action. The range owner told me to find a spot to shoot some regular .223 ammo, well i havent had the time to yet but, my question is can the low grain or frangible ammo cause this? I dont have access to an outdoor range until spring time, by then the gun will expire its 30 day warranty through the store for returns, and i dont want to have to wait 3 months for ruger to service the gun.

March 8, 2009, 12:43 PM	#11
.308win Member Join Date: May 18, 2004 Location: Ohio Posts: 35	If the bushing was missing, having enough gas pressure to cycle would definitely not be the result but it might not seal well enough hold the pressure to cycle. You would see the evidence of gas leakage; a clogged port could be the culprit. Last edited by .308win; March 8, 2009 at 12:55 PM.

March 8, 2009, 02:46 PM	#13
RobsImprza00 Member Join Date: March 9, 2008 Posts: 46	Now i must be crazy or something, but The parts that are shown in the manual do not exist. Check out the pics i just attached. The Gas block doesnt have the little tube, the orfice or anything that should be there according to the manual. Its a solid piece of metal... Last edited by RobsImprza00; March 8, 2009 at 02:54 PM.

March 8, 2009, 03:23 PM	#14
.308win Member Join Date: May 18, 2004 Location: Ohio Posts: 35	The gas block will have four allen type cap bolts. The gas port, gas pipe, and bushing is in the bottom half of the gas block. There is a short tube (gas pipe) that extends from the bottom half of the gas block toward the action. The slide assembly engages the gas pipe; gas bled from the barrel pushes the slide asembly rearward; the larger the bushing the more gas is bled from the barrel. Here is the schematic for the Mini. If yours doesn't have the gas pipe it was either omitted during assembly or the bushing was omitted during assembly allowing the gas pipe to be lost or driven into the slide assembly (is it in the slide assembly). If it is new I would contact Ruger for a RA and return it for warranty service. There is an entire forum on Perfect Union that will tell you everthing you wanted to know about the Mini; one of the Mods is CajanGeo - if he can't help you no one can. Last edited by .308win; March 8, 2009 at 03:29 PM.

March 8, 2009, 08:12 PM	#25
blume357 Senior Member Join Date: August 2, 2005 Location: Greenville, SC Posts: 3,943	the good news is it sounds like the store is going to make it right one way or another. I say let them fire a few rounds and figure it out... hopefully it is that crappy ammo at the range... but who knows.

March 7, 2009, 04:16 PM	#2
LateNightFlight Senior Member Join Date: November 22, 2007 Location: Central Missouri Posts: 552	I'd contact Ruger and describe the problem to them. I've had similar problems with a new Mini, although in 6.8mm, and they sent me a new magazine. The problem I was having is that as the bolt moved backwards and over the loaded magazine, the head end of the rounds (the back, primer end, whatever) were squatting in the magazine and not coming back up. The bolt wasn't able to pick them up as it moved forward. Try filling the magazine and push down on the back of the top cartridge and see if it returns to level when you release it. If not, that's the problem. Ruger was good about sending a new mag without requiring me to return the original. I got it in about a week.

March 7, 2009, 04:49 PM	#3
RobsImprza00 Member Join Date: March 9, 2008 Posts: 46	My problem is that the hammer isnt going backwards by itself, i have to pyshically pull the bolt back, it will eject the round and reload the new round on its own when you let go. I will give ruger a call or email and see if they can take a looksee

March 7, 2009, 05:12 PM	#4
mcraig8377 Junior member Join Date: January 27, 2009 Posts: 254	this is a growing problem recently in 5.56/223 magazines regaurdless of make. I AGREE TRY A DIFFERENT MAGAZINE.

March 7, 2009, 05:43 PM	#5
pbrktrt Senior Member Join Date: January 9, 2008 Posts: 313	i can almost guarantee it's the ammo. normal rounds of almost any kind will cycle a mini to the point of almost being excessive. trust me, when weather permits & you shoot some real ammo you'll see your empties fly 40 ft.

March 7, 2009, 06:55 PM	#6
TheManHimself Senior Member Join Date: March 25, 2008 Posts: 730	It's the ammo. The people who think it's the magazines clearly didn't read the OP. Bad magazines cause failure to feed issues, they don't prevent the action from cycling. The Mini design is so tremendously overgassed that flimsy metal mag lips aren't going to slow the bolt's reciprocation enough to stop it from even resetting the hammer. Either the bolt assembly, op rod, or mainspring would have to be way out of spec (highly unlikely), or it's the underpowered ammo. And given the aforementioned overgassed action of the Mini, that ammo is way under spec for .223 Remington ammo. Like .22 Hornet-level, if that. Even older batches of Wolf that only push a 55gr bullet to 2800FPS from a 20" barrel will cycle a factory Mini-14.

March 7, 2009, 07:06 PM	#7
.308win Member Join Date: May 18, 2004 Location: Ohio Posts: 35	It isn't the magazine. What is the weight of the bullet? I have a Mini with a small diameter aftermarket gas bushing and it will not cycle when shooting 40gr bullets with a max powder charge - either the pressure cycle is wrong or not enough pressure or both. If the gun is used, check the gas bushing it may be a small aftermarket bushing (I think the standard is .06 but don't hold me to that; try it with a regular round and note how far does it ejects the spent round. If it doesn't eject it more than 4 or 5 feet someone has probably changed the bushing.

March 8, 2009, 10:04 AM	#8
KMO Senior Member Join Date: January 13, 2008 Location: Northern Arizona Posts: 949	Gas Port Bushing I'll bet your gas port bushing is either missing or clogged. You're going to have to pull the 4 Allen-head screws at the gas block. When you remove the block half that rests against the bottom of the barrel, look for a small bushing about the size of a common pencil eraser. If this bushing is missing or clogged, that rifle will not cycle, just like you described. If it is there, check to see if the orifice is clogged. Check the piston as well, and the port on the barrel, to make sure both have positive air flow. If you have no bushing, Midway sells them for about $1 each (buy a few at that price). When you go to reassemble the block, get a partner involved. You should be able to feel the bushing seat into place as you slide the bottom half-assembly along the barrel. Be sure the stock is removed when you do this. Once you feel it in its right position, have your partner position the upper block half and tighten up the screws in a rotating sequence. 10 to 1 this fixes your problem...

March 8, 2009, 10:21 AM	#9
rugerfreak Senior Member Join Date: March 26, 2001 Posts: 819	Why not just drive out into the country and give it a "function check"? Couple of shots into the ditch of a desolate road ought to do it.

March 8, 2009, 11:38 AM	#10
Art Eatman Staff in Memoriam Join Date: November 13, 1998 Location: Terlingua, TX; Thomasville, GA Posts: 24,798	From reading Post #3, it appears that Post #8 addresses the likely problem. Testing: Got a basement? Got a 5-gallon plastic bucket? Got sand? If yes, test. But use both ear plugs AND hearguards.

March 8, 2009, 02:14 PM	#12
RobsImprza00 Member Join Date: March 9, 2008 Posts: 46	thanks for the input guys, im going to try what kmoffitt said about the gas bushing. If its not that, i might just go out into my backyard and give it a whirl with the real ammo.

March 8, 2009, 03:35 PM	#15
NickySantoro Junior member Join Date: July 14, 2008 Posts: 217	Mini-14s are ultra reliable. Unless the rifle is seriously short of lubrication, and likely not even then, the problem is likely that ammo supplied is so lightly loaded for indoor use that it just won't cycle the action. I've never used that type of ammo in my Mini but I have used some ammo that would not reliably cycle a couple of ARs. The Mini had no problems with it. I'd bet the farm that ammo is the problem.

March 8, 2009, 03:53 PM	#16
doorgunner Member Join Date: August 21, 2004 Location: San Antonio, Texas Posts: 19	If your rifle doesn't have a gas piston, it's likely a stainless 196 series, with the ranch rifle receiver and GB barrel. This is a KMini-14GBBAO model, which was designed by Ruger to be a manually operated/bolt action, for importation to countries that prohibit semiauto ownership. Somebody is flooding the market with these things, as I've seen two for sale on the internet in the last 24 hrs.. One was for sale on gunbroker, and I had to email the seller and let him know that it WAS NOT a semiauto Mini-14. He contacted me back, and was highly upset with his distributor.

March 8, 2009, 04:05 PM	#17
RobsImprza00 Member Join Date: March 9, 2008 Posts: 46	That is exactly what it is, I was told when i bought it, it was the semiauto model. If this is the case, im going to return it. This is not what i paid for and am going to be really disappointed. The serial number starts with 196... you are correct.

March 8, 2009, 04:14 PM	#18
RobsImprza00 Member Join Date: March 9, 2008 Posts: 46	I just contacted the store i purchased the rifle, and told me this should not be happening and the serial numbers beginning with 196 means they are an 08 model Mini 14 Semi auto. The gun is defective and or is missing the correct gas functioning parts. Im going to bring the gun back and we are going to dig into this alittle more. I will let you know how this goes. Thanks guys!

March 8, 2009, 04:25 PM	#19
doorgunner Member Join Date: August 21, 2004 Location: San Antonio, Texas Posts: 19	It"s obvious that, like most, your dealer doesn't have a clue. All 2008 and up domestic production models are 580 to 581 prefix guns. I don't know where he is getting his information, but he needs to find a reliable source, and more importantly, he needs to research his products before dumping them on the market.

March 8, 2009, 04:47 PM	#20
pbrktrt Senior Member Join Date: January 9, 2008 Posts: 313	doorgunner, that indeed is interesting info. i never have heard of that model or seen it listed. i knew of the 222 models for export but nothing like a single shot. the more you think you know, the more you learn you don't. i'd still like to see pics of his rifle & gas block disassembled. i still suspect sub-standard range ammo but i hope we get to find out. thanks for the info.

March 8, 2009, 04:56 PM	#21
doorgunner Member Join Date: August 21, 2004 Location: San Antonio, Texas Posts: 19	No problem. They are rare, but they are starting to show up frequently. Just remember, 196 series GB models for domestic production had the standard receiver and rear sight, NOT the ranch rifle receiver. Here you go:

March 8, 2009, 05:04 PM	#22
.308win Member Join Date: May 18, 2004 Location: Ohio Posts: 35	I didn't know there was such an animal but I haven't paid much attention to the Mini world since I bought my AR. I may have to get it out and shoot it some this spring.

March 8, 2009, 06:12 PM	#23
RobsImprza00 Member Join Date: March 9, 2008 Posts: 46	well after talking to the salesman, they are going to fire it with regular ammo tomorrow at the range to make sure its not the ammo, He has never heard of RUger making a type of single shot rifle, and i will be hearing from him. Hopefully with news of a replacement gun.

March 8, 2009, 06:23 PM	#24
doorgunner Member Join Date: August 21, 2004 Location: San Antonio, Texas Posts: 19	If your Mini looks like the above, then he is just wasting his ammo. Semiauto Mini-14's must have a gas piston. If not, then it isn't going to cycle. It's like expecting a car without an engine to start up. Your dealer should have been a lot more up on his game. Any pre 580 series Ranch Rifle, with a government barrel should raise a red flag with anybody with any experience in retailing firearms.