Beretta vs. Sig vs. HK for Law Enforcement

[dgrayson]

I need to purchase my own firearm for a police job I am going to be starting soon. It has to be a 9mm, but no Glock I believe. I have narrowed it down to Beretta, Sig, or Heckler-Koch USP. I am looking for full size 9mm like Beretta 92, Sig 226, etc. I would like to have no manual safety lever if possible. So what would you choose? Thanks for the help.

[Amish]

If you get a Beretta 92 get the "G" configuration found on the Elite 2 and Vertec. They have only decockers and no manual safety. Regular Beretta have manual safeties which isn't a bad thing. I would choose a Beretta first and then a SIG 226. Both are great guns. I personally don't care for HK.

[croyance]

I think that they are all worthy choises.

The safety on a HK can be had in many configurations. It is always frame mounted. The most common variation has the safety work in the same direction as a 1911. It can be put on safe with the hammer up or down. Full up is on safe, down is fire, and all the way down is decock with a spring, putting it back on fire.

I personally am more used to a Beretta, and would use that. The FS model may not be a bad one, depending on the amount of practice you put in. It is a slide mounted safety. Full up is fire, and down is safety/decock. The G model has down as decock, with a spring mount to put it back on fire. Massab Ayoob like the FS since many criminals are not familiar with firearms. If the gun is grabbed by a BG they may have a long hesitiation while they figure out how get it to fire.

[IamNOTaNUT]

The Sig P226 is a great gun. So is the beretta 92FS. The H&K does not fit my hand, and the mag drop is way to far forward, requireing you to change your grip to reach it, or hit it with the weak hand thumb.

P226 is a DA/SA with a decocker, no safety. 92FS is a DA/SA with a safety/decocker. If you leave the safety OFF it works like the Sig, i.e. pull trigger go bang, decock and holster.

The Sig trigger is better. The Beretta trigger, while pleasantly smooth is LOOOOOOOOOONG.

[Shootin' Shane]

I really like HK's, but for your specifications (9mm, full size with no safety), I would have to say the Sig P226 with high caps would be your best bet.

[Ala Dan]

but I would prefer the Sig P226, as it's an
outstanding firearm in use by several
military's and law enforcement agency's
world wide. An excellent firearm that would
make a new owner very proud of his and/or
her choice; as reliability is not an issue.
In 9m/m, the P226 deliver's superb accuracy.

In a recent postal pistol match, I out shot
our local PD rangemaster who was shooting
a pre-sellout Smith & Wesson 586 with a 6"
tube. My gun was a two-tone Sig-Sauer P226
with factory SigLite night sight's that was
manufactured in Germany. So, my
suggestion is to go get the Sig.

Best Wishes,
Ala Dan, N.R.A. Life Member

[chaim]

If the only options were those three guns and I was making the decision I would pick the CZ 75 BD Police (9mm, decocker only, high-cap service pistol) . Actually, out of those you mention I'd go with the SIG.

Why the SIG? HKs simply never "did it" for me (no offense to any HK lovers). Out of the Beretta and SIG I simply like the SIG a lot better.

You have narrowed it down to three very good guns (probably great guns). Whichever gun out of those that you choose will not be a bad choice. At this point I think you can safely rely on which feels better to you, looks better to you, or just on some undefined level you just like better.

You can feel free to call me a smart * for the CZ comment- well not really since we aren't allowed personal attacks and that would close the tread so I'll call myself one for you .

[355sigfan]

All are fine guns but I would pick one not on the list GLock. I have found it to be the best. But in a choice between the ones you mention it would be a hard choice between a HK USP in 45 auto and a Sig 226 in 357 sig. The Beretta is a good choice in 9mm as well. I believe I would chose the sig over the HK. I have owned all the brands mentioned and I like the accuracy and trigger actions on sigs more than HK's.
PAT

[notbubba]

#1 choice is SIG

Beretta or HK #2

All three are dang good guns.

It's just that one is more "good".

[defox]

The Beretta has beaten the Sig in every major military test and outperforms it in the field. For LEO it is especially good has its safety can save you in a gun snatch, you can load a bullet directly into the chamber in case of magazine failure etc. etc.

The Heckler and Koch is also a thoroughly tested and proven pistol that is just as rugged as the Beretta, but the Beretta represents better value-for-money.

For me, if LEO

1. Beretta
2. HK
3. Sig

[harrydog]

That's the first time I've ever heard a Beretta referredto as rugged!!
My choices would be:
P226 or USP9 - it's a toss-up, just depends on which feels best to you. I like them both.

[Kermit]

Go out and rent & actually shoot the 3 prospects and purchase the one that fits and performs best for you!

[Shake]

H&K USP is the way to go. . .



Shake

[GSB]

The H&K does not fit my hand, and the mag drop is way to far forward, requireing you to change your grip to reach it, or hit it with the weak hand thumb.

You're not trying to trip the mag release with your thumb, are you? That's a common error among shooters used to "normal" mag releases. The mag is released by tripping the right side release button with the forefinger of your right hand (if you are right handed). It should require no substantial grip change to do it. It is the fastest mag release system I've yet found on a stock handgun. I can see where those with short fingers would have trouble with the full size USPs though.

[355sigfan]

The Beretta has beaten the Sig in every major military test and outperforms it in the field. For LEO it is especially good has its safety can save you in a gun snatch, you can load a bullet directly into the chamber in case of magazine failure etc. etc.

END

Actually the Beretta and Sig tied in the military pistol trials. The Beretta got the contract because of costs. The sig 228 beat the Beretta for the M11 contract. I don’t like safeties on my guns, as it’s more to do to get the gun into action. A good security holster is enough for me. Also in an emergency you can chamber load any semi auto pistol. It takes a lot of rounds to damage an extractor and its not likely to happen in a short-term emergency. Berettas are fine guns but not without problems. They break small parts like locking blocks and springs which’s puts them out of action. So a dedicated maintenance schedule is a must. The Seals refused to use them and preferred Sig 226’s. The Beretta (92) is great as a 9mm but when you up it to 40 cal, problems get worse and accuracy seems to degrade. Also lets not forget the whole problems with Beretta's slide breaking in half when it was new and injuring shooters.
PAT

[9mmepiphany]

i've carried both the sig and the beretta as duty guns. i've even carried a hk, but...it was the p7

you should see if you can try both and go with whichever feels best in you hands. many feel that the beretta's grip is too large while others feel the sig bore line is too high.

the beretta gives you the choice of an external safety (FS) or a decocker only (G available to LEO). if you have your guns tuned, the beretta tunes up "better" than the sig. i also like the mechanical feeding (non-dropping barrel and straight feed mag) of the beretta better.

i fine both guns comparably accurate but have had better reliability with my beretta

[New_comer]

This should have been a poll to select amongst the models you were considering, and then some others, too.

I would like to have no manual safety lever if possible. So what would you choose? Thanks for the help.

The HK USP is available with no manual safety, or a decock only if that's what you prefer. There's also the LEM config you'd definitely have to check out, plus the P7 (if money's no object). The latest HK, P2000, is coming out soon, you'd have to check those out, too.

Hope this helps.

[PATH]

I have shot all three choices. I would choose the Sig. What a sweet trigger and the pistol is spot on. H&K would be my second choice. Beretta would be third. While they are all good that is my opinion.
I would, if you have the oppurtunity, shoot all three. Why? You have to be comfortable with what you are carrying. Nothing beats holding a pistol and firing it in order to determine what you like best!

[duckdawg]

Beretta slides don't break in half. Berettas in .40 cal do NOT suffer accuracy problems. Berettas have had a very, very loooong history of being "rugged". The SEALs do not refuse to use them, they mostly like .45s. The locking blocks do not break and actually, the Beretta is one of a handful of pistols made today which do NOT require continual maintenance. There are soooo many myths and such little time to debunk them. Go to the Tactical Forum and check the search function for what the SEALs really think about the M9 (92FS).

The Beretta 92FS does have one very significant problem, however. It was chosen as a replacement for the Most Holy And Sacred 1911 and, as such, has been maligned from day one.

My recommendation is to shoot the Beretta and the Sig and decide which one you shoot slightly better than the other and get that one. That slight ergonomic edge might save your life.

If your choice was for a .45 I *might* say get the HK USP.

[355sigfan]

Beretta slides don't break in half. Berettas in .40 cal do NOT suffer accuracy problems. Berettas have had a very, very loooong history of being "rugged". The SEALs do not refuse to use them, they mostly like .45s. The locking blocks do not break and actually
END

Your post is in contrary to reality. I respect Beretta pistols but ignoring their flaws does not make them go away.

I have an article written on the subject but was not able to find it in time for this post. It documents Beretta’s breaking small parts at high rate. Locking blocks seem to go about 2000. Beretta did redesign them to fix this problem. The boarder patrol specified a different trigger return spring due to problems in the original design. The slide incident did happen and its also well documented.

PAT

[therookie]

I've shot all three and here's my verdict...

HK USP, while a great gun, is HUGE! I can't get my finger around the trigger unless the gun's cocked in single action. My hands aren't tiny either... so if you have large hands, it may be good...

Beretta 92F - Feels great in my hand. Shoots well, everything is where you want it.

Sig 226 - Feels great. However, the decocker is located in front of the slide release. Don't know how many times I've hit the wrong lever... But IMHO it shoots a bit better than the Beretta

No clue about durability... my friends would shoot me if I held the guns under salt water to see if they'd still go bang....

Anyway, if it's me joining the force, I'd go with the Sig.... Accuracy is the most important....

but you should try shooting all 3... they're all good...

[croyance]

The Beretta's issued to the military in the 80's did suffer problems with cracked slides. As far as I can tell, these problems do not exist in those Beretta's made for commercial sales. The slide issue seems to have been resolved over a decade ago.
I thought the cracked slide problem was traced to cartridges that were loaded beyond proof level. Has anybody tried to see how long a SIG or Glock would survive that?

As for replacing the locking block every 2000 rounds, that seems excessive. I have over 5000 rounds through mine, and every inspection shows little, if any, wear.

As the gun chosen to replace the beloved 1911, the Beretta seems to suffer from "Debra Norville Syndrome". Any gun chosed to replace the 1911 was going to be reviled.

[RON in PA]

All 3 are excellent pistols, pick the one that feels the best to you when you handle and shoot them(assuming that you have that opportunity).

Me, I would choose a Glock 17. And the Ruger P95 is well worth consideration, a gun that doesn't get the respect that it deserves.

Also note that the German army chose the Hk USP and not the Sig as its new service pistol.

The fact is that there are many excellent 9mm service pistols out there to choose from.

[rysai]

just my $.02

i'm not an LEO but i would imagine carrying a full-sized usp (even a 9mm) along w/ all your other equipment for a day could get rather tiresome...i love the usp but not enough to have it as a full time carry...and having it weigh down your right side as you chase down BG's and climb chain link fences can be tiring =)...

i do like the beretta 92 very much, but in my humble opinion, sig is the way to go if you don't want a safety...i'm not a fan of its double action pull, but the accuracy and reliability of the 226 is just so good...

as the rookie said, if you're familiar with the sig's controls (decocker in front of the slide catch, opposite of the usp and 92) it's tough to beat...

[355sigfan]

i'm not an LEO but i would imagine carrying a full-sized usp (even a 9mm) along w/ all your other equipment for a day could get rather tiresome|
END

The USP is polymer and it’s lighter than the Sig and Beretta.
PAT