Mine is bigger than YOURS!

Betty · November 24, 2002, 09:51 PM

I thought I'd just state that I've got the biggest caliber of all!

ID this spent cartridge! (I'm a wee bit over 5'3".)

Coronach · November 24, 2002, 10:03 PM

I'm gonna go with 127mm/54 (5" naval gun).

Yes? No? Bueller? Bueller?

Mike

Betty · November 24, 2002, 10:11 PM

5"? 5"?

Nope, it's a bit bigger than that!

Here's a little bit of info:

Muzzle Velocity: 2,800 ft/sec
Crew: 45 (turret)
Weight: 451 tons (turret)
Rate of fire: 10 rpgpm (rounds per gun per minute)
Projectiles: High Capacity (shore bombardment): 260 pounds, Armor Piercing: 335 pounds
Range: 30,100 yards (AP) at 41 degrees 31,350 yards (HC) at 45 degrees

Tamara · November 24, 2002, 10:13 PM

Looks like somewhere between 8" and 12". Which is odd; most guns of that size don't use fixed ammunition, but rather separate bagged powder charges.

C'mon, runt_, don't leave us hanging...

I'm gonna go with an 8" naval rifle, like what you'd find on a Salem-class heavy cruiser...

Betty · November 24, 2002, 10:19 PM

Hmmm.. methinks Tamara landed on the same website I did.

Yes, it's an 8". From the description:
"These guns were the first 8" guns to use cased (semi-fixed) ammunition instead of bag/shell loading. They were also the world's first automatic 8" gun. These guns could be loaded at any elevation from -5 to +41 degrees. They were dual purpose guns (AA and ASuW). The gun houses on all three turrets are quite spacious due to the fact that they were designed with room for the installation of optical rangefinders, which were omitted from final plans."

Dad likes to collect big brass, so he figured he'd scoop up the biggest chuck o' brass ever produced by the US military. Mom wants to use it as a vase for a very large flower arrangement.

Tamara · November 24, 2002, 10:22 PM

Quote:

Hmmm.. methinks Tamara landed on the same website I did.

No, some people have Real LivesTM and therefore go find this stuff on websites. Others, like me, are truly sad because they wander through life with factoids like this lodged in their heads...

Coronach · November 24, 2002, 10:25 PM

Well, thats gonna put it around 8"...but most US big guns use, as Tamara said, bagged powder. I know that there some US 5", 6" and 8" guns that used brass, but I've never seen pics of the spent casings.

US 8"?

Mike

Coronach · November 24, 2002, 10:26 PM

Damn. Simultype.

Mike

Coronach · November 24, 2002, 10:41 PM

Query: is the photo of CA 134 Des Moines, and if it is, is she still in the mobilization reserve?

Can you imagine...12 8" guns, autoloading, all laying down the smack for an amphib assault? Sure, its not quite 9 16", but it's still pretty good...

Mike

glockten · November 24, 2002, 11:11 PM

So, where does one buy a spent casing like that?

Sisco · November 24, 2002, 11:16 PM

I need five or six of 'em. I want to build a windchime.

sm · November 24, 2002, 11:20 PM

I have unruly neices and nephew's coming to visit. Since mom won't let me use her car and everbody else has a truck or SUV...
Well if you lock 'em in the trunk -can't hear 'em scream...those would work out in the garage

liketoshoot · November 24, 2002, 11:24 PM

That's a lot of brass in that one shell. I wonder how many little 9mm casings you could get out of that one...

I'm fairly new here, but um, let me pay you a compliment Runt_of_the_Litter - that is a nice picture of you.

bastiat · November 24, 2002, 11:34 PM

You're going to need to buy this stuff by the gallon...

Schuey2002 · November 24, 2002, 11:39 PM

Do you have to register that thing with the BATF?

Coronach · November 25, 2002, 12:42 AM

SK-

That would be the only windchime ever invented that sounds like a tuba.

Mike

twoblink · November 25, 2002, 02:16 AM

Runt,

I recall you saying something about Oleg trying to shoot some gophers at your parent's house...

Is the gopher problem really THAT BAD that you'd need to shoot them with one of those?

Tell Jeff White, who thinks he always wins the ammo size pissing contest...

K80Geoff · November 25, 2002, 08:30 AM

US Navy 8" RF55 MK16.

From the www.warships1.com website:

These were the first USN 8" (20.3 cm) weapons to use separate instead of bag ammunition._ With automatic shell handling and loading, a fire rate three times greater than that of previous US 8" (20.3 cm) guns coupled together with the use of "super-heavy" APC projectiles, these weapons made the Des Moines class the most powerful heavy cruisers ever built._ One of the few large-caliber automatic gun designs that proved reliable in actual service use, these weapons were still giving good performance during the Vietnam War some twenty-five years after they were first built._ Unfortunately, all this performance came at a steep price in weight, with the turrets mountings for these guns weighing 50% more than those in the previous Baltimore class.

USS Newport News (CA-148) suffered a premature projectile explosion in the center gun of Turret II during a fire mission off Vietnam._ This explosion caused extensive damage to this mounting and split the forward slide structure._ Up until six months prior to the explosion there had been a complete spare gun assembly in the supply system, but it had then been scraped because the Navy felt that it cost too much to let it sit in a warehouse._ It was proposed to replace the damaged mounting with one taken from her decommissioned sisters, but this was rejected as too expensive._ As a result, the damage was not repaired and the turret was simply closed off.

These weapons were apparently the first loose-liner guns in service in the USN._ Constructed of a monobloc autofretted barrel with a chrome-plated loose-liner held by a liner-locking ring._ The barrel screwed into the housing which contained the breech block._ Used a wedge-type vertical sliding breech block in place of the conventional interrupted screw._ Unlike previous US 8" (20.3 cm) guns, these guns could load at any angle._ An air bottle supplied pneumatic power to open and close the sliding breech block system used in these ships.

Wowie!! An auto loading 8" gun!!!

foghornl · November 25, 2002, 08:37 AM

Oh, Nubbins....How come "Runt" always gets the cool toys ? ? ? ?

Anyway, I wanna see the video of that gun being shoulder-fired...............

And, can you reload THAT on your "Lee Loader" ? ? ? ?

K80Geoff · November 25, 2002, 08:39 AM

If you click on the above website, then click on" Weapons of the World", then click on "United States" under naval guns, then click on 8"/RF55 MK2 under Cruiser Guns, there are pictures of the ships including one of the "Salem" showing how the brass cases were ejected from under the gun barrels

Wonder what it was like having those shell casings rolling around the deck!!!

Tamara · November 25, 2002, 08:49 AM

I think that's the Salem (CA-139).

braindead0 · November 25, 2002, 08:50 AM

Hmm, wonder what kinda fun could be had if you necked that down to say... .50 and build a vehicle mounted wildcat gun around it... ;-).

Tamara · November 25, 2002, 08:55 AM

All that would come out the barrel would be... wait a minute... ooh! You'd have a plasma gun! Well, a "lead & copper vapor" gun, at least.

braindead0 · November 25, 2002, 08:56 AM

Ya know, if the bullet was solid copper.. a stream of liquid copper moving at those velocities.. probably wouldn't have a good effective range, but I suspect the close range penetration would be awesome!

Perhaps if the end of the muzzle had a diffuser of some sort, it could be used for anti personel..

cslinger · November 25, 2002, 09:06 AM

Reloaders on the site right now totally rethinking their Dillion Presses and other gear.

Geez they would have to use snow shovels to measure the powder.

Very cool. Actually it probably would make a great vase and I bet most people wouldn't even know it was anything firearm related.

Tamara,
If there ever is a history of war and weapons Jeopardy you really need to sign up. I thought I had a lot of useless information packed away but you are one smart lady.

Geez, wouldn't ya hate to get a brass hickey from that bad boy.

November 24, 2002, 09:51 PM	#1
Betty Senior Member Join Date: March 22, 2000 Location: southern U.S. Posts: 1,807	Mine is bigger than YOURS! I thought I'd just state that I've got the biggest caliber of all! ID this spent cartridge! (I'm a wee bit over 5'3".)

November 24, 2002, 10:03 PM	#2
Coronach Senior Member Join Date: March 25, 1999 Posts: 3,147	I'm gonna go with 127mm/54 (5" naval gun). Yes? No? Bueller? Bueller? Mike __________________ The axe bites into the door, ripping a hole in one panel. The maniac puts his face into the hole, cackling gleefully, "Here's Johnny...erk." "And here's Smith and Wesson," murmurs Coronach, Mozambiquing six rounds of .357 into the critter at a range of three feet. -Lawdog "True pacifism is the finest form of manliness. But if a man comes up to you and cuts your hand off, you don't just offer him the other one. Not if you want to go on playing the piano, you don't." -Sam Peckinpah "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects." -Robert Heinlein

November 24, 2002, 10:13 PM	#4
Tamara Moderator Emeritus Join Date: March 11, 2000 Location: Indianapolis, IN Posts: 16,002	Looks like somewhere between 8" and 12". Which is odd; most guns of that size don't use fixed ammunition, but rather separate bagged powder charges. C'mon, runt_, don't leave us hanging... I'm gonna go with an 8" naval rifle, like what you'd find on a Salem-class heavy cruiser... __________________ MOLON LABE! 2% Unobtainium, 98% Hypetanium. The Arms Room: An Online Museum.

November 24, 2002, 10:25 PM	#7
Coronach Senior Member Join Date: March 25, 1999 Posts: 3,147	Well, thats gonna put it around 8"...but most US big guns use, as Tamara said, bagged powder. I know that there some US 5", 6" and 8" guns that used brass, but I've never seen pics of the spent casings. US 8"? Mike __________________ The axe bites into the door, ripping a hole in one panel. The maniac puts his face into the hole, cackling gleefully, "Here's Johnny...erk." "And here's Smith and Wesson," murmurs Coronach, Mozambiquing six rounds of .357 into the critter at a range of three feet. -Lawdog "True pacifism is the finest form of manliness. But if a man comes up to you and cuts your hand off, you don't just offer him the other one. Not if you want to go on playing the piano, you don't." -Sam Peckinpah "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects." -Robert Heinlein

November 24, 2002, 10:26 PM	#8
Coronach Senior Member Join Date: March 25, 1999 Posts: 3,147	Damn. Simultype. Mike __________________ The axe bites into the door, ripping a hole in one panel. The maniac puts his face into the hole, cackling gleefully, "Here's Johnny...erk." "And here's Smith and Wesson," murmurs Coronach, Mozambiquing six rounds of .357 into the critter at a range of three feet. -Lawdog "True pacifism is the finest form of manliness. But if a man comes up to you and cuts your hand off, you don't just offer him the other one. Not if you want to go on playing the piano, you don't." -Sam Peckinpah "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects." -Robert Heinlein

November 24, 2002, 10:11 PM	#3
Betty Senior Member Join Date: March 22, 2000 Location: southern U.S. Posts: 1,807	5"? 5"? Nope, it's a bit bigger than that! Here's a little bit of info: Muzzle Velocity: 2,800 ft/sec Crew: 45 (turret) Weight: 451 tons (turret) Rate of fire: 10 rpgpm (rounds per gun per minute) Projectiles: High Capacity (shore bombardment): 260 pounds, Armor Piercing: 335 pounds Range: 30,100 yards (AP) at 41 degrees 31,350 yards (HC) at 45 degrees

November 24, 2002, 10:19 PM	#5
Betty Senior Member Join Date: March 22, 2000 Location: southern U.S. Posts: 1,807	Hmmm.. methinks Tamara landed on the same website I did. Yes, it's an 8". From the description: "These guns were the first 8" guns to use cased (semi-fixed) ammunition instead of bag/shell loading. They were also the world's first automatic 8" gun. These guns could be loaded at any elevation from -5 to +41 degrees. They were dual purpose guns (AA and ASuW). The gun houses on all three turrets are quite spacious due to the fact that they were designed with room for the installation of optical rangefinders, which were omitted from final plans." Dad likes to collect big brass, so he figured he'd scoop up the biggest chuck o' brass ever produced by the US military. Mom wants to use it as a vase for a very large flower arrangement.

November 24, 2002, 10:41 PM	#9
Coronach Senior Member Join Date: March 25, 1999 Posts: 3,147	Query: is the photo of CA 134 Des Moines, and if it is, is she still in the mobilization reserve? Can you imagine...12 8" guns, autoloading, all laying down the smack for an amphib assault? Sure, its not quite 9 16", but it's still pretty good... Mike __________________ The axe bites into the door, ripping a hole in one panel. The maniac puts his face into the hole, cackling gleefully, "Here's Johnny...erk." "And here's Smith and Wesson," murmurs Coronach, Mozambiquing six rounds of .357 into the critter at a range of three feet. -Lawdog "True pacifism is the finest form of manliness. But if a man comes up to you and cuts your hand off, you don't just offer him the other one. Not if you want to go on playing the piano, you don't." -Sam Peckinpah "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects." -Robert Heinlein

November 24, 2002, 11:11 PM	#10
glockten Senior Member Join Date: October 21, 2000 Location: Tennessee Posts: 524	So, where does one buy a spent casing like that?

November 24, 2002, 11:16 PM	#11
Sisco Senior Member Join Date: March 25, 1999 Location: KS Posts: 1,558	I need five or six of 'em. I want to build a windchime. __________________ "I don't mind it when stupid people say stupid things. Stupid people should be encouraged to say stupid things, that way we always know who the stupid people are." ~ Ted Nugent http://www.awbansunset.com/awcountdown_sm.gif

November 24, 2002, 11:20 PM	#12
sm Senior Member Join Date: February 5, 2002 Posts: 1,819	I have unruly neices and nephew's coming to visit. Since mom won't let me use her car and everbody else has a truck or SUV... Well if you lock 'em in the trunk -can't hear 'em scream...those would work out in the garage __________________ Use Enough Gun TFL Alumni

November 24, 2002, 11:24 PM	#13
liketoshoot Senior Member Join Date: August 30, 2002 Location: Houston, Texas Posts: 219	That's a lot of brass in that one shell. I wonder how many little 9mm casings you could get out of that one... I'm fairly new here, but um, let me pay you a compliment Runt_of_the_Litter - that is a nice picture of you. __________________ I like guns.

November 24, 2002, 11:34 PM	#14
bastiat Senior Member Join Date: February 14, 2001 Posts: 1,771	You're going to need to buy this stuff by the gallon... __________________ Flashbunny.org - Pro-Freedom Propaganda Politically Incorrect & Pro-Gun Stuff To Buy

November 24, 2002, 11:39 PM	#15
Schuey2002 Senior Member Join Date: September 21, 2002 Posts: 854	Do you have to register that thing with the BATF?

November 25, 2002, 12:42 AM	#16
Coronach Senior Member Join Date: March 25, 1999 Posts: 3,147	SK- That would be the only windchime ever invented that sounds like a tuba. Mike __________________ The axe bites into the door, ripping a hole in one panel. The maniac puts his face into the hole, cackling gleefully, "Here's Johnny...erk." "And here's Smith and Wesson," murmurs Coronach, Mozambiquing six rounds of .357 into the critter at a range of three feet. -Lawdog "True pacifism is the finest form of manliness. But if a man comes up to you and cuts your hand off, you don't just offer him the other one. Not if you want to go on playing the piano, you don't." -Sam Peckinpah "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects." -Robert Heinlein

November 25, 2002, 02:16 AM	#17
twoblink Senior Member Join Date: December 22, 1999 Location: Taipei, Taiwan Posts: 2,025	Runt, I recall you saying something about Oleg trying to shoot some gophers at your parent's house... Is the gopher problem really THAT BAD that you'd need to shoot them with one of those? Tell Jeff White, who thinks he always wins the ammo size pissing contest... __________________ "An unarmed society is one that's ripe for tyranny and oppression."

November 25, 2002, 08:30 AM	#18
K80Geoff Senior Member Join Date: December 20, 1998 Location: NE Pennsylvania Posts: 3,639	US Navy 8" RF55 MK16. From the www.warships1.com website: These were the first USN 8" (20.3 cm) weapons to use separate instead of bag ammunition._ With automatic shell handling and loading, a fire rate three times greater than that of previous US 8" (20.3 cm) guns coupled together with the use of "super-heavy" APC projectiles, these weapons made the Des Moines class the most powerful heavy cruisers ever built._ One of the few large-caliber automatic gun designs that proved reliable in actual service use, these weapons were still giving good performance during the Vietnam War some twenty-five years after they were first built._ Unfortunately, all this performance came at a steep price in weight, with the turrets mountings for these guns weighing 50% more than those in the previous Baltimore class. USS Newport News (CA-148) suffered a premature projectile explosion in the center gun of Turret II during a fire mission off Vietnam._ This explosion caused extensive damage to this mounting and split the forward slide structure._ Up until six months prior to the explosion there had been a complete spare gun assembly in the supply system, but it had then been scraped because the Navy felt that it cost too much to let it sit in a warehouse._ It was proposed to replace the damaged mounting with one taken from her decommissioned sisters, but this was rejected as too expensive._ As a result, the damage was not repaired and the turret was simply closed off. These weapons were apparently the first loose-liner guns in service in the USN._ Constructed of a monobloc autofretted barrel with a chrome-plated loose-liner held by a liner-locking ring._ The barrel screwed into the housing which contained the breech block._ Used a wedge-type vertical sliding breech block in place of the conventional interrupted screw._ Unlike previous US 8" (20.3 cm) guns, these guns could load at any angle._ An air bottle supplied pneumatic power to open and close the sliding breech block system used in these ships. Wowie!! An auto loading 8" gun!!! __________________ I am no longer a member of this forum. Bye!

November 25, 2002, 08:37 AM	#19
foghornl Senior Member Join Date: March 18, 2002 Location: Ohio Posts: 1,354	Oh, Nubbins....How come "Runt" always gets the cool toys ? ? ? ? Anyway, I wanna see the video of that gun being shoulder-fired............... And, can you reload THAT on your "Lee Loader" ? ? ? ? __________________ Load your weapons and 'Stand Ready'. It will be a bumpy ride.

November 25, 2002, 08:39 AM	#20
K80Geoff Senior Member Join Date: December 20, 1998 Location: NE Pennsylvania Posts: 3,639	If you click on the above website, then click on" Weapons of the World", then click on "United States" under naval guns, then click on 8"/RF55 MK2 under Cruiser Guns, there are pictures of the ships including one of the "Salem" showing how the brass cases were ejected from under the gun barrels Wonder what it was like having those shell casings rolling around the deck!!! __________________ I am no longer a member of this forum. Bye!

November 25, 2002, 08:49 AM	#21
Tamara Moderator Emeritus Join Date: March 11, 2000 Location: Indianapolis, IN Posts: 16,002	Coronach, I think that's the Salem (CA-139). __________________ MOLON LABE! 2% Unobtainium, 98% Hypetanium. The Arms Room: An Online Museum.

November 25, 2002, 08:50 AM	#22
braindead0 Senior Member Join Date: February 28, 2002 Location: Canton, Oh Posts: 896	Hmm, wonder what kinda fun could be had if you necked that down to say... .50 and build a vehicle mounted wildcat gun around it... ;-). __________________ DoD# 2223 Meum scapha volitare plenum anguillae

November 25, 2002, 08:55 AM	#23
Tamara Moderator Emeritus Join Date: March 11, 2000 Location: Indianapolis, IN Posts: 16,002	braindead0, All that would come out the barrel would be... wait a minute... ooh! You'd have a plasma gun! Well, a "lead & copper vapor" gun, at least. __________________ MOLON LABE! 2% Unobtainium, 98% Hypetanium. The Arms Room: An Online Museum.

November 25, 2002, 08:56 AM	#24
braindead0 Senior Member Join Date: February 28, 2002 Location: Canton, Oh Posts: 896	Ya know, if the bullet was solid copper.. a stream of liquid copper moving at those velocities.. probably wouldn't have a good effective range, but I suspect the close range penetration would be awesome! Perhaps if the end of the muzzle had a diffuser of some sort, it could be used for anti personel.. __________________ DoD# 2223 Meum scapha volitare plenum anguillae

November 25, 2002, 09:06 AM	#25
cslinger Senior Member Join Date: July 14, 2002 Location: Nashville, TN Posts: 2,045	There are about 1000 Reloaders on the site right now totally rethinking their Dillion Presses and other gear. Geez they would have to use snow shovels to measure the powder. Very cool. Actually it probably would make a great vase and I bet most people wouldn't even know it was anything firearm related. Tamara, If there ever is a history of war and weapons Jeopardy you really need to sign up. I thought I had a lot of useless information packed away but you are one smart lady. Geez, wouldn't ya hate to get a brass hickey from that bad boy. __________________ "Is there anyway I can write my local gun store off on my taxes as dependents?"